What defines a Catholic?

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guanophore
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If that politician is a representative, then his duty is to represent the constituency that elected him. If the majority of them are pro abortion, that is how he must vote. It is a terrible position for a Catholic to occupy! **

O.K. Let’s make it less terrible. Suppose you are a Catholic on the Supreme Court and accountable only to Truth and Justice, not the voters. Should you then vote your conscience, or should you take a sample of the mob’s sentiments and judge accordingly? :confused:
 
cargau
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I don’t believe a priest should ever refuse Communion to any practicing Catholic** who is not engaged in public sin or scandal or the recipient of formal excommunication. The Catholic Church is not a hotel for saints but a hospital for sinners…

How would you be a practicing Catholic if you don’t believe in the True Presence? :confused:
The Real Presence is a mystery. Not every practicing Catholic understands or accepts this profound reality equally. Some are still struggling to get there arms around this gift.

Ironically, the farther away we are from embracing this Truth, the more we need Him Sacramentally…

“Jesus, I believe in you, help me in my unbelief”…
 
The question in your post was, “What defines a Catholic”? I believe that the answer is transformation. We are all called to become more and more like Christ every day of our lives.

That statement infers that we are not there. That we are imperfect beings and in fact will never peerfectly be like Christ. Since our Church (The body of Christ) are all sinners, how can we demand judgment of other sinners without bringing the same on ourselves.
St. Paul said, in his first letter to the Corinthians, that we should judge those in the Church and that God will judge outsiders. The obvious inference, to me anyway, is that the Church, as “the body of Christ”, has an obligation to ensure that its members function as proper Catholics, or, to paraphrase you, to become more like Christ everyday. In other words, we, as members of that “body of Christ” have an individual as well as a collective responsibility to ensure that others within the Church do become “more like Christ” everyday. The transformation that you write of then requires that Catholics support other Catholics and even chastise them when the need arises. In my opinion, once we adopt the attitude that we are all sinners is tantamount to shrugging one’s shoulders and saying, well, everyone elses Catholicism is their business and not mine. It is this occurence, I think, that allows too many Catholics to stray from the path, particularly some of those in high office. They need to be pulled back into line and chastised if they do not try to become “more like Christ”.
Living life is God’s classroom. Some learn faster than others, but God never misses an opportunity to show us something about Himself every day. Beliefs can be changed and modified over time. God’s time. Every cross we are to carry should be followed with the question, “OK, Lord, what are you trying to show me now”? Again, the learning process preceeds transformation.
Perhaps Catholics need other Catholics to help them understand what certain crosses really represent and to help put them into perspective?
I don’t believe a priest should ever refuse Communion to any practicing Catholic who is not engaged in public sin or scandal or the recipient of formal excommunication. The Catholic Church is not a hotel for saints but a hospital for sinners…
I doubt that unless the sin or scandal was public that a Priest would even know that sin and scandal was a part of a particular person’s life. The point is, therefore, rather moot. However, once sin and scandal do become public, it effects the entire “body of Christ”. The “body of Christ” is tainted and tarnished by the public scandal, certainly, but it is also tainted and tarnished because one of its members has broken away from the unity of that “body of Christ”, the Church. It therefore becomes encumbant upon the “body of Christ”, the Church, to heal itself by dealing appropriately with the offending person.
 
guanaphore

**If that politician is a representative, then his duty is to represent the constituency that elected him. If the majority of them are pro abortion, that is how he must vote. It is a terrible position for a Catholic to occupy! **

Returning to this point, the politician who takes a census of his constituents before each of his votes in congress is not realistic, nor is it part of his job description to be taking a survey before each vote. If he is a Catholic and votes his conscience on any issue, it is the prerogative of his constituents to respect him for voting as he did or make a point of removing him from office in the next election. However, there is no must about which way he should vote. He is elected and trusted to do the right thing.

If he votes to appease a few voters and knows that his vote is immoral, his character is tainted with moral turpitude; he is not only not acting as a Catholic, but the question really is whether he is a Catholic at all or just another Trojan Horse inside the Catholic Church.
 
guanaphore

If that politician is a representative, then his duty is to represent the constituency that elected him. If the majority of them are pro abortion, that is how he must vote. It is a terrible position for a Catholic to occupy!
If a candidate seeks high office, he should be known for the principles he stands for. If a Catholic candidate is silent on the issue of abortion whilst seeking high office and is then confronted with having to vote on the issue, he is a victim of his own silence. If the majority of his electors want him to vote in favour of abortion, he is a victim of his own umwillingness to place all his moral credentials before the electorate. In other words, it is his own fault. Once faced with having to vote in favour of abortion and having to choose between his own moral convictions and the whim of the crowd, the choice should be an easy one. He should vote according to his principles. From the point of view of the electorate, he should also vote in favour of his principles, or else the electors will realise they have not elected a leader, but have instead elected someone who will not stand up for principled decision making, but will go with the crowd. If he is the type to go with the crowd at the expense of his own moral principles, then he just might also be willing to sacrifice his beliefs for a fistfull of cash.

Charlemagne II wrote -
Returning to this point, the politician who takes a census of his constituents before each of his votes in congress is not realistic, nor is it part of his job description to be taking a survey before each vote. If he is a Catholic and votes his conscience on any issue, it is the prerogative of his constituents to respect him for voting as he did or make a point of removing him from office in the next election. However, there is no must about which way he should vote. He is elected and trusted to do the right thing.
The politician who takes a census before a vote on any issue is populist and nothing more. If democracy were pure and true, it might work, as the majority would be truly represented. However, in the real world the groups with the most money and who can make the most noise can influence public opinion. That makes public opinion whimsical and therefore unprincipled. All the more reason for the need to have a principled representative in office. Someone who can’t be bought with cash and who can’t be swayed by popular opinion on matters which have a moral component.

Charlemagne II also wrote -
If he votes to appease a few voters and knows that his vote is immoral, his character is tainted with moral turpitude; he is not only not acting as a Catholic, but the question really is whether he is a Catholic at all or just another Trojan Horse inside the Catholic Church.
Agreed! However, I would also ask is he not only a trojan horse insode the catholic Church, but is he also not a trojan horse inside the political sphere? After all, if a representative will compromise his own principles, will he not then be inclined to trash the principles of others? All it would take is a fist full of dollars…

So it is with catholics who say they believe in such and such, but then add the ryder, not if it applies to me. The true test of moral character is when a moral descision applies to you; when you have to make a moral choice that tests your supposed beliefs. One poster earlier said he was against abortion, yet went on to say he would struggle with it if it applied to his daughter if she were raped. The question is, do you believe in the right to abort babies when it is expedient, or do you not beleive so? If it is wrong for others to use abortion as a tool of expedience, then it is wrong for ourselves as well. No ifs, buts, or maybes. Too often on these threads we see catholics picking and choosing what they want to beleive. That is not being Catholic. It is being expedient.
 
guanophor

jmcrae is a very well informed catechist.

And how would you know this for a fact? Have you certified him as one? :confused:
My job is not to vet the other members. I am sharing my personal experience only. Years of experience in reading jmcrae’s posts then researching on my own has confirmed my expereince. In general, it is good to always read critically, and question the source of what you read. I am sure as an educator, jmcrae would agree with that. 😉
 
My job is not to vet the other members. I am sharing my personal experience only. Years of experience in reading jmcrae’s posts then researching on my own has confirmed my expereince. In general, it is good to always read critically, and question the source of what you read. I am sure as an educator, jmcrae would agree with that. 😉
Absolutely. If the answer to the question is important to you, then you should get at least three reliable sources - your priest is one, or better yet, your Bishop; the Catechism is another. The Scriptures, if you know how to find things in them. A reliable teacher is another. If something sounds “off” or fishy, double-check with people you know and trust. 🙂
 
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