What did Jesus mean by "preparing a place"?

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As I was reading John 14 verses 2-3 caught my attention.

What does Jesus mean by preparing a place for the apostles? What is there to prepare?

If we know God is omniscient why weren’t these places prepared from eternity? Why also would God need to do anything? Shouldn’t he just be able to say “places be prepared” and everything would be done just as he did when the world was created? :confused:

Blessings to all
 
As I was reading John 14 verses 2-3 caught my attention.

What does Jesus mean by preparing a place for the apostles? What is there to prepare?

If we know God is omniscient why weren’t these places prepared from eternity? Why also would God need to do anything? Shouldn’t he just be able to say “places be prepared” and everything would be done just as he did when the world was created? :confused:

Blessings to all
Our place in the other life will in part be prepared based upon our preparation for it, IIUC.

ICXC NIKA
 
Hello MexCatholic.

This is Bridegroom language. Dr. Pitre goes into more detail here.

Dr. Pitre goes into a lot of detail here.

This introductory audio or . . .

this in-depth audio set will help as well.

This audio sample may be helpful too.

I go into a little detail on this subject here.

I’ll try also to come back and provide little more depth on this thread later too (but Dr. Pitre is the best I have found on this subject).

God bless.

Cathoholic
 
this was the 1st time that Jesus makes mention about going to heaven, when he said he was going to prepare a place for them in the house of his Father he was speaking about heaven, Jesus before that always spoke about the resurrection and the jews knew that paradise was on earth so they believed the resurrection to be on earth, but the teaching of heaven to his diciples at John 14 was new to them thats why they didnt understand what he meant if you read John 14:5 - Thomas said to him: “Lord, we do not know where you are going. How can we know the way?” maybe this can also help you to see that Jesus isnt God or atleast he isnt omniscient… the Bible says Jesus was the 1st person to die an go to heaven… if the Bible says that we could ask ourselves what happend then to the other faithful people that died before Jesus… when Jesus was speaking to his diciples at John 14 he was basically telling them that his going to open up the way for them to be with him in heaven… im not sure if im explaining this right
 
Im sure you are not.
what makes you sure? is it because im saying something new to you? or because im saying something against what you believe? what is you understanding about those verses if you are so sure my explanation is wrong you should then have a sure explanation of you understanding… so… make us understand… what did Jesus mean what place did he have to prepare? an how come the diciples didnt know what he was talking about?

think about this verse at John 3:13, Note Jesus’ thought-provoking statement: “No man has ascended into heaven but he that descended from heaven, the Son of man.”

the new international bible puts it this way - “No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven–the Son of Man.” hows that?
 
what makes you sure?
Because you said Jesus isn’t God.
is it because im saying something new to you?
No.
or because im saying something against what you believe?
It’s not merely against what I believe, but against what the Apostolic faith Teaches.
what is you understanding about those verses if you are so sure my explanation is wrong you should then have a sure explanation of you understanding
My comment wasnt regarding the O.P., but towards your accusation that Jesus is not God.
… so… make us understand… what did Jesus mean what place did he have to prepare?
Regarding this, I dont have a well studied answer. My initial thoughts are that it has something to do with the concept of the reward we will be given for our deeds here.

1 Cor. 3
Code:
"...but only God who gives the growth. 8 He who plants and he who waters are equal, and each shall receive his wages according to his labor. 9 For we are God’s fellow workers;[a] you are God’s field, God’s building."
Rev. 22

12 “Behold, I am coming soon, bringing my recompense, to repay every one for what he has done.

It is as though God’s reward is in direct relation to the degree that we follow Him and do His will. This is His preparing for us.
 
I dont say Jesus is God… read John 14 verse one an see what Jesus himself says… 14 “Let not your hearts be troubled; believe in God, believe also in me." Jesus speaks of God and himself as being 2 different people… in verse 2 he calls God his Father “My Fathers house has many rooms”… if im reading that wrong then make me understand how Jesus is speaking about himself?
 
I dont say Jesus is God… read John 14 verse one an see what Jesus himself says… 14 “Let not your hearts be troubled; believe in God, believe also in me." Jesus speaks of God and himself as being 2 different people… in verse 2 he calls God his Father “My Fathers house has many rooms”… if im reading that wrong then make me understand how Jesus is speaking about himself?
ChosenOne7,

I would love to share about the Trinity of who God is, but I should refrain from derailing this thread. Would you like to start a thread, join in a thread you would like me to start, or find an existing thread about the nature of God, the Trinity, and Jesus’ relation within God?

All I wish to say, is that the Trinity is a doctrine which can be found in Scripture. I think you would see the meaning of the Lord’s relationship with His Father and the fact that they are of the same substance while seperate ‘persons’. Jesus being of the same divine substance as the Father, with the Holy Spirit proceeding from both.

I’ll leave you with these passages to consider:

John 1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.[a] 2 He was in the beginning with God; 3 all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made.

14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, full of grace and truth; we have beheld his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father.
 
That’s true I agree with you… The trinity is another topic on its own, discussing John 1:1 we can do on another thread…

Those verses you mentioned though the 1st Corinthians 3 isn’t speaking about heaven it’s got nothing to do with “the place” Jesus is speaking about in John.
Using a different figure in writing to the congregation at Corinth, the apostle Paul likened the work of the Christian minister to that of a farmer, who first plants the seed, waters and cultivates it, then waits for God to make the plant grow to maturity. Paul brought the good news of the Kingdom to the Corinthians, planting seed in the Corinthian “field.” Apollos came afterward and by his further teaching nourished and cultivated the seed sown, but God, by his spirit, brought growth. Paul used this illustration to emphasize the fact that no individual human is important in himself, but all are ministers, working together as God’s workmen. God is the important One, and he blesses such unselfish, unified work.—1Co 3:5-9.

The verse in Revelations 22:12 is not talking about what Jesus is talking about in John 14 aswel… By the time John got this vision Jesus was long time in heaven, Johns vision was speaking about when Jesus comes back on his 2nd coming when armeggedon breaks out.

If we go back to the topic the original question is “What does Jesus mean by preparing a place for the apostles? What is there to prepare?”
 
Thank you all! I think I understand now with the bridegroom and the preparation being symbolic of what a Jewish husband would do.

Would I be wrong in saying Jesus meant to say he was just going to the Father to be ready for this wife the Church represented by the apostles?
 
maybe this can also help you to see that Jesus isnt God or atleast he isnt omniscient.
Wow! Don’t know where that came from but Jesus is God no doubt about it. Mentioned several times in the Bible as well as by the early Church Fathers. You can read more about it here
the Bible says Jesus was the 1st person to die an go to heaven… if the Bible says that we could ask ourselves what happend then to the other faithful people that died before Jesus.
The answer to your question is in Luke 16:19-31, they were in Abraham’s bosom (embrace). Now I’m not sure if God made exceptions for Enoch or Elijah for entering heaven. 🤷
 
Would I be wrong in saying Jesus meant to say he was just going to the Father to be ready for this wife the Church represented by the apostles?
You would be right to assert that but there is even more.

In an ancient Jewish Marriage ceremony there are two stages, kiddushin and nisuin.
  • Kiddushin (betrothal)
  • Nisuin
The first is kiddushin (or betrothal).

At the point the husband and wife are REALLY husband and wife.

Then the ceremony is in a sense suspended and the husband goes off to “prepare a place” for his bride. A new home.

But at this point (kiddushin) they are REALLY husband and wife.

For example: When St. Joseph was “betrothed” to the Blessed Virgin Mary, this means they had undergone kiddushin already.

The angel Gabriel came to a married woman. The Blessed Virgin Mary was already “betrothed” to Joseph when Gabriel the Archangel appeared to Mother Mary in Luke 1.

This means Joseph and Mary were REALLY and actually married.

That’s why the angel told St. Joseph to take “Mary, your wife” into his home.

After kiddushin, the husband goes and prepares a place for his bride. (Then he comes back later to get his bride).

This may take a short while. It may take up to a year or more in a Hebrew wedding.

The point is, the time frame is not fixed.

St. Joseph went off to prepare a home for his bride, the Blessed Mary Ever Virgin.

Likewise, Jesus who was already described as the “Bridegroom” by St. John the Baptist (early in John’s Gospel) goes off to prepare a place for His bride, the Church, Heaven.

Later in a Jewish marital context, the husband comes back to get the bride. This also has a ceremony.
This is called nisuin. This is done under a special Bridal Canopy called the chuppah (“hoo-pah”).

The world will see Jesus come on the clouds of Heaven. We will see the fulfillment of the chuppah over the Church at the end of time.

The Blessed Mother had the chuppah too didn’t She? She was “overshadowed” by the Holy Spirit.

Back to the ancient Jewish marital liturgy (Jewish people do this differently today).

After the husband goes to prepare a place for his bride, then the husband comes back (nisuin) and takes the bride into his home.

So in a sense, when we die, (assuming we “remain” in “the Vine” or assuming we remain in Jesus) we too are brought to our new Heavenly home.

JOHN 14:1-4 1 “Let not your hearts be troubled; believe in God, believe also in me. 2 In my Father’s house are many rooms; if it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you? 3 **And when I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also. **4 And you know the way where I am going.”

And in another sense at the end of time, the Church is brought into Heaven in the fullest sense (when we get our glorified bodies).

This will be a nisuin of sorts for us too.

Incidentally. This is WHY when the angel came to Mary and tells Mary she will conceive and bear a Son and name Him Jesus, it shows (implicitly) that Mary and Joseph had intended to remain virginal in that marriage (and they DID remain virginal in that marriage).

Because you have the archangel Gabriel, appearing to a MARRIED woman telling her all that he told Mary in Luke 1:26 (and following) . . . . And HOW does the Blessed Virgin Mary respond when She is told that She will conceive and bear a Son?

She says: “HOW can this come about?”

If you tell someone who is married that they will have a baby, they do NOT ask, “HOW can this come about” do they? They might ask, “WHEN” etc. But they don’t ask “HOW”.

They would never ask such a question unless . . . unless they intended to REMAIN virginal.

So the Blessed Virgin Mary is a “type” or a microcosm or a “typus” of the Church (see CCC 967).

And the Church is the spotless virginal bride of Christ.

EPHESIANS 5:25-29, 32 25 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, 26 that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27** that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish.** 28 Even so husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no man ever hates his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, as Christ does the church, . . . . 32 This mystery is a profound one, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church;

2nd CORINTHIANS 11:2 2 I feel a divine jealousy for you, for I betrothed you to Christ to present you as a pure bride to her one husband.

There is much more too.

And all of this marital imagery culminates with . . . . you guessed it . . . . "The Wedding Supper of the Lamb” in the book of Revelation which takes place in Heaven where we have communion with God in a way unimaginable now.
 
Thanks Cathoholic!

That was a great read and I actually understand many things better now.

The one question I have is that in Luke 1:27 the word used, as you already mentioned, is betrothed.

At the point of kiddushin was this more than just a promise for Jewish people? Was it more than saying this is my fiancé/fiancée?

Thank you
 
Frightening words from “ChosenOne7.”

JWs give me the fantods. I’m too sick to argue that MY Bible does not state “and the word was a god.”

I will look for the other thread.
 
Wow! Don’t know where that came from but Jesus is God no doubt about it. Mentioned several times in the Bible as well as by the early Church Fathers. You can read more about it here

The answer to your question is in Luke 16:19-31, they were in Abraham’s bosom (embrace). Now I’m not sure if God made exceptions for Enoch or Elijah for entering heaven. 🤷
Mexcatholic,

The JWs don’t believe that Jesus is fully God. They don’t believe in the Trinity and they believe that our Jesus is, in fact, a created being who also goes by the name of Michael the Archangel. I could go on, but under so much violent stress right now. Will post elsewhere and probably not tonight.

God be with you.
 
Mexcatholic. You mentioned . . .
At the point of kiddushin was this more than just a promise for Jewish people? Was it more than saying this is my fiancé/fiancée?
Then you said you came across the answer already.

I will reiterate that here for other readers of this thread.

No. Betrothal does NOT equal merely “engaged to BE married”.

Let’s go to the Jewish website, Judaism 101 and “Frequently Asked Questions” on this subject (here) for more details (bold and ul mine).
Kiddushin is far more binding than an engagement, as we understand the term in modern English; in fact, Rambam speaks of a period of engagement before the kiddushin.
St. Joseph and the Blessed Virgin Mary were “betrothed”.
St. Joseph and the Blessed Virgin Mary had already completed kiddushin.
St. Joseph and the Blessed Virgin Mary were **already “married”. **

St. Joseph and the Blessed Virgin Mary were “betrothed”. This IS being married. The initial stage but “married” never the less.

Let’s again go to the Jewish website, Judaism 101 and “Frequently Asked Questions” (here) for more details (bold and ul mine).

As Judasism 101 states:
Once kiddushin is complete, the woman is legally the wife of the man. The relationship created by kiddushin can only be dissolved by death or divorce. However, the spouses do not live together at the time of the kiddushin, and the mutual obligations created by the marital relationship do not take effect until the nisuin is complete. The nisuin (from a word meaning “elevation”) completes the process of marriage. **The husband brings the wife into his home and they begin their married life together. **
Heaven knew that too.

That is WHY the Angel tells St. Joseph not to fear to take Mary “your wife” into your home.

MATTHEW 1:18-20 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ took place in this way. When his mother Mary had been betrothed to Joseph, before they came together she was found to be with child of the Holy Spirit; 19 and her husband Joseph, being a just man and unwilling to put her to shame, resolved to send her away. 20 But as he considered this, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, "Joseph, son of David, do not fear to take Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit;

MATTHEW 1:20b (DRV) Joseph, son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife,

MATTHEW 1:20b (KJV) Joseph, son of David, fear not to take unto you Mary your wife

The Blessed Virgin Mary was never an “unwed mother”!

See here (from Homiletic & Pastoral Review and reprinted by catholicculture) by the late Mary J. Giovanoni for more details on the pernicious poisoning effects of the allegation that the Blessed Mother was ever an “unwed mother” (She wasn’t but the allegations are out there).

The Blessed Virgin Mary and St. Joseph had completed kiddushin (thus they are “betrothed”–they were already legally married), but they had not yet completed nisuin.

MATTHEW 1:18b 18 When . . . Mary had been betrothed to Joseph, before they came together . . .
 
Sorry must have misread your original post as the answer was clearly there 😦

Thank you again
 
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