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Hume
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My guess would be that a man with “red” hair in a sea of Hebrews would be a man whose hair shone a somewhat rusty reflection when it was in sunlight.
Seriously doubt it was full-on Northern European ginger.
What Did Jesus Really Look Like? Article Provides Some Information
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Seriously doubt it was full-on Northern European ginger.
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aroosi
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Red hair genes are not exclusive of Northern Europe, you can find them in other populations By the way, also Esau had red hair.
Usually in Middle East ‘Red hair’ is not a bright ginger red, more like a golden/brownish/reddish color (but I met one natural very bright ginger’ color too!).
Usually in Middle East ‘Red hair’ is not a bright ginger red, more like a golden/brownish/reddish color (but I met one natural very bright ginger’ color too!).
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RolandThompsonGunner
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But at least there is some basis to believe his appearance was in some way unusual for the community. The fact that it was commented on suggests that it was distinctive enough to be worth mentioning. If Jesus and Mary both looked Swiss in a community of olive complexioned people, presumably the Gospel writers would have mentioned it. It would stood out as unusual.
I’ve walked around the Middle East as a person of European ancestry and it’s pretty clear I ain’t a local.
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Lunam_Meam
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Well, Jesus’s detailed appearance according to the one who saw it described Him as pale, much lighter hair as a child, only a little tanned by the sun, which He liberally assimilated during His three-year passage through Palestine. Mary was a rosier white, as She was more withdrawn at home. Jesus is an ivory white, with that slight reflection of blue. He had a long, straight nose, with just a bit of curve above, near his eyes — a very handsome, thin, well-shaped nose. Deep set, very beautiful eyes, often so described as very dark sapphire. Thick eyebrows and eyelashes, but not excessively so — long, beautiful, shiny, dark brown, but with a microscopic spark of gold at the summit of each hair. Mary’s, on the other hand, are very light brown, thinner and sparser. Perhaps they seem that way because they are much lighter, so light they are nearly blonde. An even, smallish mouth, well-shaped, closely resembling His Mother’s, with lips just thick enough, neither too thin, so as to appear serpentine, nor too pronounced. In the center they are rounded and accentuated in a fine curve, and at the sides they disappear, making the very beautiful mouth seem to diminish out of sight, with its healthy red opening over even, vigorous teeth which are rather long and very white. Mary’s, on the other hand, are quite small, but regular and even joined. Thin, but not gaunt, cheeks. A very narrow, long oval, but quite beautiful, with cheekbones that neither protrude nor recede excessively. His beard, thick on his chin and dividing into two curly points, surrounds, but does not cover, his mouth as far as the lower lip and rises, shorter and shorter, towards his cheeks, where, at the level of the corners of his mouth, it becomes very short, limited to leaving a shadow, like a smattering of copper, on the paleness of his cheeks. Where it is thick, the beard is a dark copper color, a dark reddish blonde. And, so is His mustache, not very thick and kept short, so that it barely covers his upper lip between His nose and the lip and is reduced at the corners of His mouth. Small well-shaped ears closely joined to his head. They do not protrude at all.
Their appearances are depicted in many places throughout the writings, but this is an excerpt.
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RolandThompsonGunner
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Okay but I don’t believe any of this is credible. I know I said I’d leave it alone, but to be clear: I believe you that the writing says that. I don’t have any basis on which to trust the writing itself.
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Lunam_Meam
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I wouldn’t want anyone to take my word for it, because that’s not what I did from the person who told me about it, rather invoke the Holy Spirit, and read for yourself. As Pope Pius XIII said about the writings: “Publish this work as is; he who reads will understand.”Lunam_Meam:
Okay but I don’t believe any of this is credible. I know I said I’d leave it alone, but to be clear: I believe you that the writing says that. I don’t have any basis on which to trust the writing itself.
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Ridgerunner
Guest
But it might have been different at different times. The first Syrian I ever met had blond hair and blue eyes. I understand that’s not really common, but not terribly uncommon. The Middle East has been a crossroad of peoples for millenia, and the “local look” has probably changed many times.
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RolandThompsonGunner
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Probably not that drastically in 2000 years, which is relatively short in the grand scheme of things. I don’t claim to be an ancient historian, but I highly doubt there are any serious scholars who think that the average person in Judea in 5 AD looked like the girl from the Swiss Miss logo.
Certainly the locals would be aware of lighter skinned people, but the vast majority would have been obviously foreigners…merchants, Roman administrators and soldiers, etc.
All this to say, it’s certainly possible that Jesus was a blonde haired white guy, but we have no real reason to think so, and the simplest explanation is that He looked like a member of the local community.
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Ridgerunner
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I think we just plain don’t know what Jesus looked like other than a rough idea from the Shroud. But seriously, we don’t know what the “local community” looked like at different times. Remember, Al-Husseini the “Nazi Mufti” of Jerusalem, had blond hair and blue eyes. Hard to find a color picture of him, but he did. And that wasn’t all that long ago.
Probably there are plenty of people in the region with African features too. When people are of mixed ethnicities, you get a lot of variety. Among the local Mexican-Americans for example, you get “Indios” who look just like the Aztec paintings. Most are “Mestizos” who are mixed to enormously varying degrees. And then there are the “Crillos” who are extremely white. Did you ever watch a Mexican soap opera? The people are very fair; much more so than the “average” Mexican.
If I had to guess about Jesus’ appearance or die, I would guess some of those Greek icons that were made not too long after His death and Resurrection. But even those would have a sort of Greek influence to them.
https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1...qAhU7QjABHXBmBYcQ7Al6BAgGEC8&biw=1440&bih=789
Probably there are plenty of people in the region with African features too. When people are of mixed ethnicities, you get a lot of variety. Among the local Mexican-Americans for example, you get “Indios” who look just like the Aztec paintings. Most are “Mestizos” who are mixed to enormously varying degrees. And then there are the “Crillos” who are extremely white. Did you ever watch a Mexican soap opera? The people are very fair; much more so than the “average” Mexican.
If I had to guess about Jesus’ appearance or die, I would guess some of those Greek icons that were made not too long after His death and Resurrection. But even those would have a sort of Greek influence to them.
https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1...qAhU7QjABHXBmBYcQ7Al6BAgGEC8&biw=1440&bih=789
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RolandThompsonGunner
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Sure, there are outliers in every community. But populations don’t change drastically in 2000 years. We can be pretty confident that Julius Caesar looked European and not, say, Japanese. We just have no reason to assume Jesus was one of those outliers.
Remember, one of the Jewish answers to Christian claims about Jesus’ divinity was that He was actually the illegitimate son of a Roman soldier, product of an adulterous affair. If there were any evidence that Jesus had a particularly unusual appearance, especially one that would have been more common among foreigners, presumably they would have cited it in support of their theory. It would have seriously strengthened the argument that He was actually the son of a Roman legionary.
But yes, at the end of the day, we don’t know, I agree.
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Ridgerunner
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I sure don’t buy that theory, but I do suspect there was quite a bit of admixture going on at the time. At that time there were two legions in Syria, both of Teutonic origin.
But they wouldn’t have been the first people of fair appearance. Many say the Hyksos were Indo-European. One remembers that Saladin was a Kurd, who were and are Indo-European. Abraham, we’re told, came from “Ur of the Chaldees”. It’s not altogether certain who they were. Some say they were semitic. Some say Indo-European. But whoever they were they were endogamous for the most part. Remember that Abraham returned to his homeland to marry. On the other hand, there were plenty of Egyptians in the Levant at different times. Some would have been Hamitic, some would have been black.
I’m sticking with the Greek icons myself, even though I know they might be “too Greek”.
But they wouldn’t have been the first people of fair appearance. Many say the Hyksos were Indo-European. One remembers that Saladin was a Kurd, who were and are Indo-European. Abraham, we’re told, came from “Ur of the Chaldees”. It’s not altogether certain who they were. Some say they were semitic. Some say Indo-European. But whoever they were they were endogamous for the most part. Remember that Abraham returned to his homeland to marry. On the other hand, there were plenty of Egyptians in the Levant at different times. Some would have been Hamitic, some would have been black.
I’m sticking with the Greek icons myself, even though I know they might be “too Greek”.
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RolandThompsonGunner
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To be clear, I don’t either. Just pointing out that if Jesus looked German, presumably proponents of that theory would have wanted to publicize that as much as possible.
And personally, Greek icons are presumably relatively close, if I had to guess. Greek people tend to have more olive skin and dark hair. They certainly look more like people from the Levant than Danes or Lithuanians or Englishmen do.
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aroosi
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Having a certain familiarity with Middle Eastern people I think Jesus was not looking like Ken (Barbie’s friend) but not even like the picture in the article. My bet is on the Turin Shrine image or early icons.
Maybe He even looked a bit like the Israeli model Raz Degan at the beginning of his modeling career…
Maybe He even looked a bit like the Israeli model Raz Degan at the beginning of his modeling career…
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TheWryWren
New member
Sorry to jump into the middle of discussions, but…
From what I understand of DNA, human beings receive 50% of their DNA from their father and 50% of DNA from their mother.
Clearly, Christ was not conceived normally, and so his DNA is presumably different. I have no idea what Jesus looked like, but I will not be going to secular sources who probably ignore the fact of the incarnation.
From what I understand of DNA, human beings receive 50% of their DNA from their father and 50% of DNA from their mother.
Clearly, Christ was not conceived normally, and so his DNA is presumably different. I have no idea what Jesus looked like, but I will not be going to secular sources who probably ignore the fact of the incarnation.
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hope
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You are exactly right. The Jews did not marry outside of their people usually. Which would cause them to have the same look.
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Leferdion
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except that Jesus is a descendant of David, from the tribe of Judah. Bethlehem, is in Judea which is south. Galilee is North. Even if Jesus grew up in Nazareth, both Mary and Joseph are Judeans and it will be expected by that logic that they pull up a typical picture of a Judean for Jesus and not of a Galiliean
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TMC
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I don’t know how much impact a 14 generation back ancestor would have on someone’s appearance, or that there is that much difference in appearance between a Judean and a Galilean. Neither were Aryan in appearance.
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Ridgerunner
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I’m no historian, but I have read it opined that the “Israelites” who fled Egypt were not a distinct ethnic group but a collection of enslaved people of various types who shared only a desire to get out of Egypt and (for many but not all a common religion.
I have also had the experience of hearing people from elsewhere say "everybody in Springfield (Mo) looks alike. To me, they don’t, but since virtually everybody is of Scots-Irish ancestry, perhaps they do to one of some different ethnic origin.
I have also had the experience of hearing people from elsewhere say "everybody in Springfield (Mo) looks alike. To me, they don’t, but since virtually everybody is of Scots-Irish ancestry, perhaps they do to one of some different ethnic origin.
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hope
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The source for this quote is dubious. It cannot be independently verified. Nowhere in the Pope’s writings can it be found.
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Lunam_Meam
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People speak all the time, but don’t always have witnesses to what they say, and most of their words, if not all, isn’t recorded. Does that mean everything spoken, but not witnessed and recorded, wasn’t really said? No. Even what is recorded is often dismissed as lies, etc, anyway.
In this case, there was a meeting between Pope Pius XII, Father Migliorini, Father Corrado Berti, and Father Checchin regarding the writings in question, and one of the witnesses, Father Berti, summarized the Pope’s words as “Publish this work as it is.”
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