Yes, I’d echo these sentiments. I always appreciated Wesley’s Arminian beliefs along with his strong emphasis on love, based on the small amount I know of his teachings.Well, I can only answer for myself - I really like John Wesley actually, though I have a fellow friend in church who is a theology major who finds his doctrines extremely problematic, but that as a Christian he was quite exemplary.
I find him to be very inspirational in his life and his sermons. He`s definitely one of my favorite Protestant thinkers for sure. Much more than Luther, Calvin, or any of those guys.
But don’t your Methodist ways mean you recite the creed with the Filioque? Not sure how the Filioque would be a stumbling block to a Methodist since it’s part if their traditional creed.I ask because he actually was against starting the Methodist Church. He was an Anglican back when they had Apostolic Succession. In is diary, he was adamant that they NOT break it. It had more to do with the Revolutionary war. Even thou they likely would have split after his death. They tried to split during his life and he would always threaten to leave. It was just supposed to be a society of pious practicing Christians.
Thanks for the replies. I have been studying Catholicism but I am just stuck in my Methodist ways. It is becoming more on my mind that I be in an Apostolic Church though. As I went through RCIA I got stuck on the Filoque and I left. Among a couple just historical hang ups. I don’t know when dealing with the immortal soul, it;s hard to make changes to what you know and are comfortable with.
This is where I began to learn more about what it actually means in terms of how the trinity is constructed. We say the Apostles creed in church which said he was “conseived by the holy spirit”But don’t your Methodist ways mean you recite the creed with the Filioque? Not sure how the Filioque would be a stumbling block to a Methodist since it’s part if their traditional creed.
I’m not sure what you mean by this phrase, unless you are talking about women’s ordination. Even if women’s ordination breaks Apostolic Succession, it obviously does not do so for all Anglicans but only for some.I ask because he actually was against starting the Methodist Church. He was an Anglican back when they had Apostolic Succession.
True. Apostolicae Curae is not clear as to the specific point the Succession is said to be “lost”, though the best conjecture is at the consecrationof ++Parker, in 1559. But it would certainly be before Wesley’s day, by RC reckoning, if that is what is being referred to, above.I’m not sure what you mean by this phrase, unless you are talking about women’s ordination. Even if women’s ordination breaks Apostolic Succession, it obviously does not do so for all Anglicans but only for some.
So if Anglicans had Apostolic Succession in Wesley’s day, we certainly do now. If we do not have it now, we did not have it then. Everyone agrees on this (again, leaving the women’s ordination question aside).
In fact, a better case could be made that we did not have it then and do have it now. After the official RC declaration in the late 19th century saying that we did not (in their judgment) have apostolic succession since the time of Edward VI in the mid-sixteenth century, Anglicans began involving “Old Catholic” bishops in our consecrations. Whether that has restored apostolic succession to some Anglican lineages at least is a matter of debate. But it makes no sense to say that we had it in the 18th century and do not have it now.
Edwin
Yes, this is why I like him too. I have very much respect for the Methodists and John Wesley.Wesley more focuses on daily life or practices of a Christian which is why I like his theology. He is focused on how do we apply the scripture to our lives? I think that is the most important part of following Christ.
Wesley was adament that he was born a High Church Anglican, and he died a High Church Anglican.He started off Anglican which is very close to Catholic and I think when he was around, Anglicans were Apostolic. His brother Charles was very adamant that they remain Apostolic but John became mostly concerned with holiness regardless of who/what you claim to be.
Has anyone studied his theology or teachings? How close is he to Catholic beliefs?
Whoa, Nelly! The creed does not indicate that the Son and the Holy Spirit had a beginning. A beginning would denote time. God exists completely outside of time and space. God created both time and space, so He could not be bound by it. Everything is eternally NOW to God.This is where I began to learn more about what it actually means in terms of how the trinity is constructed. We say the Apostles creed in church which said he was “conseived by the holy spirit”
Then unell I misunderstood I was being taught the son came from the father and the holy spirit came from the son. THat would seem to indicate the son and holy spirit had a beginning and we know god has no beginning and no end.
Historically speaking, John Wesley, or Fr. John, was quite more Catholic looking and acting than today’s faithful Catholics. He celibrated the Eucharist and probably had valid orders if my source was correct. He engaged in the sacraments of the church as any faithful Catholic would do. The sad part is that his followers simply dumbed down what he tried to teach and ultimately it was morphed into modern day Methodism eventually.He started off Anglican which is very close to Catholic and I think when he was around, Anglicans were Apostolic. His brother Charles was very adamant that they remain Apostolic but John became mostly concerned with holiness regardless of who/what you claim to be.
Has anyone studied his theology or teachings? How close is he to Catholic beliefs?
What exactly is it you are saying his followers dumbed down?Historically speaking, John Wesley, or Fr. John, was quite more Catholic looking and acting than today’s faithful Catholics. He celibrated the Eucharist and probably had valid orders if my source was correct. He engaged in the sacraments of the church as any faithful Catholic would do. The sad part is that his followers simply dumbed down what he tried to teach and ultimately it was morphed into modern day Methodism eventually.
He was also a Geographer, something one of my professors got a swift kick about, we’re geographers.