What do Mormons REALLY Believe?

[BartBurk]

Some how you made it seem as if the personal beliefs of one or two men can represent the beliefs and doctrines of an entire church. Your post has no value, and was meant only as a means of insult. I’m pretty sure that if you look, you will find Catholics, Protestants, Jews, and others which have personal distinct beliefs. Does this mean that it represents what their church beleives? I think not.

Perhaps, but I must note these are two people who are being foisted on us as mainstream apologists for Mormonism by the Maxwell Institute and FAIR.

 

[willi8]

we don’t sing about any saint is going to responsible for our getting into heaven and we especially don’t sing about them hanging out with multiple gods. i have never heard any of the sings that you mentioned. the closest would be immaculate mary.and it is nowhere near what praise to the man is.

I don’t believe that “Praise to the Man” ever says anything about Joseph Smith being responsible for our getting into heaven. The only thing which I can see that would be a problem would be the “multiple gods” line. Thats a matter of a difference in doctrine. In that case many non-Catholics could find fault in the numerous Catholic hymns which references Mary as an intercessor. That is a matter of different doctrine also.

 

[willi8]

Perhaps, but I must note these are two people who are being foisted on us as mainstream apologists for Mormonism by the Maxwell Institute and FAIR.

If someone is a world renown scholar in Greek text, would his personal belief in UFO’s or Big foot affect his credibility in Greek text??? Most likely not. They are not relevant to each other…
If that scholar says that aliens wrote the texts, then maybe there is a case…

 

[RebeccaJ]

If someone is a world renown scholar in Greek text, would his personal belief in UFO’s or Big foot affect his credibility in Greek text??? Most likely not. They are not relevant to each other…
If that scholar says that aliens wrote the texts, then maybe there is a case…

Or, non-verifiable text that was produced by an ancient civilization, for which all evidence point that it is non-existent? Like that? And the text itself does not exist, in order to verify the “reformed Egyptian” has no error in translation? Like that?

Case closed!

 

[FCEGM]

Funny, I’ve never heard those.

Paul, “Long Live the Pope” is an oldie by a goody. We sang this when I was confirmed way back in the 1950’s. The old TV show “Captain Midnight” used the melody as it’s theme song.

Long live the Pope!
His praises sound
Again and yet again:
His rule is over space and time:
His throne the heart of men:
All hail! The Shepherd Pope of Rome,
The theme of loving song:
Let all the earth his glory sing
And heav’n the strain prolong.

Beleaguered by
By the foes of earth,
Beset by hosts of hell,
He guards the loyal flock of Christ,
A watchful sentinel:
And yet, amid the din and strife,
The clash of mace and sword,
He bears alone the Shepherd Staff,
The champion of the Lord.

Then raise the chant,
With heart and voice,
In Church & school & home:
“Long live the Shepherd of the Flock!
Long live the Pope of Rome!”
Almighty Father bless his work,
Protect him in his ways,
Receive his prayer, fulfill his hopes,
And grant him length of days!

And AMEN to that! I still love it! Hmmm, hmmm, hmmm, hmmmmm, hmmm, hmmm, hm, hm. . . .

 

[AMDGtoo]

Don’t fault Paul for not knowing about the song. It must not be sung much at all because I’ve never heard of it and it’s not in our parish hymn book or even in my last couple of missals.

 

[Nan_S]

Don’t fault Paul for not knowing about the song. It must not be sung much at all because I’ve never heard of it and it’s not in our parish hymn book or even in my last couple of missals.

I did a quick web-search on “Mary From thy Sacred Image” and found it easily. The hymn is a prayer of veneration (not worship) before a Marian icon. It’s published on websites associated with traditionalist Catholics: Eastern Catholics, SSPX, and Catholics who live in India.

I’ve never seen it in a Novus Ordo hymnal, more’s the pity. Much as I like Novus Ordo’s emphasis on scripture and comprehension, I still miss the reverence and sense of awe in the old rite.

 

[FCEGM]

Don’t fault Paul for not knowing about the song. It must not be sung much at all because I’ve never heard of it and it’s not in our parish hymn book or even in my last couple of missals.

Oh, I don’t fault him at all! I figured he was probably much younger than I am. It was sung, after all, by the generation that still remembers “Howdy Doody”. Unfortunately, the Church Militant is more silent in song these days.

 

[PaulDupre]

Oh, I don’t fault him at all! I figured he was probably much younger than I am.

I’m not that young. I’m 54; it’s just that my family was not very active when I was young. I stopped going to mass altogether when I was 12, so my exposure to Catholic culture was limited to my education by Jesuits. Not a lot of singing in prep school.

Paul

 

[FCEGM]

I’m not that young. I’m 54; it’s just that my family was not very active when I was young. I stopped going to mass altogether when I was 12, so my exposure to Catholic culture was limited to my education by Jesuits. Not a lot of singing in prep school.

Paul

Paul, even for those deeply involved in the Church from toddler years “Long Live the Pope” would have been a rarity to hear. (Add 10 to your 54 and there I am. )

 

[willi8]

Or, non-verifiable text that was produced by an ancient civilization, for which all evidence point that it is non-existent? Like that? And the text itself does not exist, in order to verify the “reformed Egyptian” has no error in translation? Like that?

Case closed!

No Rebecca, not even close. The Book of Mormon actually has witnesses which attest to the divinity of it’s origin. Joseph was one of them but then came three more. scriptures.lds.org/en/bm/thrwtnss

Then after those three, 8 more witnesses bore their testimony of of the Book of Mormon. scriptures.lds.org/en/bm/eghtwtns

Keep in mind that all of these witnesses were considered honarable men in their own communities. Also keep in mind that these men suffered greatly for their witness of the Book of Mormon. All they had to do was renounce it and many of their burdens would have been lifted. Rather, not one of them ever revoked their testimony. Even when some of them fell away from the church, they still would not denounce what they had seen. Even upon their deathbeds, they re-affirmed the truthfulness of their testimony. scriptures.lds.org/en/2_cor/13/1#1

This is the difference Rebecca, and what a difference it makes.

The case has not been closed yet, for witnesses have come forth!!!

 

[majick275]

none of these men were considered trustworthy. they were close friends and/or relatives of joseph smith. look at their “witness” afterwards…they they were unstable ate best and some even dishonest. those who left the main LDs church were trying to get their own versions of the LDs church going so that they could be in charge.

 

[RebeccaJ]

No Rebecca, not even close. The Book of Mormon actually has witnesses which attest to the divinity of it’s origin. Joseph was one of them but then came three more. scriptures.lds.org/en/bm/thrwtnss

Then after those three, 8 more witnesses bore their testimony of of the Book of Mormon. scriptures.lds.org/en/bm/eghtwtns

Keep in mind that all of these witnesses were considered honarable men in their own communities. Also keep in mind that these men suffered greatly for their witness of the Book of Mormon. All they had to do was renounce it and many of their burdens would have been lifted. Rather, not one of them ever revoked their testimony. Even when some of them fell away from the church, they still would not denounce what they had seen. Even upon their deathbeds, they re-affirmed the truthfulness of their testimony. scriptures.lds.org/en/2_cor/13/1#1

This is the difference Rebecca, and what a difference it makes.

The case has not been closed yet, for witnesses have come forth!!!

Which does not address what I SAID.

 

[teancum79]

that is a wicked blasphemous song. we have no hymns that speak of any man mingling with gods. we believe Christ speaks to any who listen him. we don’t have to channel his words through a prophet and we can speak with him directly. i speak to jesus every day. i worship him. you have take joseph smith’s word that god commands adultery sometimes and that you can be a god yourself.

No I take the guidance of the holy spirit and God never command adultery, just plural marriage at times.

As far as becoming like God JS taught it, but so did Christ and Paul I think it is a bad idea to criticize one guy for teaching what The Lord taught and other apostles taught.

As far as mingling with gods do not Catholics go about asking various dead people to pray for them?

Is it really a stretch for someone to go about (without a specific request from a mortal) doing things for the benefit of man with holy beings?

 

[majick275]

No I take the guidance of the holy spirit and God never command adultery, just plural marriage at times.

according to jesus it’s the same thing

As far as becoming like God JS taught it, but so did Christ and Paul I think it is a bad idea to criticize one guy for teaching what The Lord taught and other apostles taught.

christ and paul never taught eternal progression as defined by the LDS church. it is NOT the same!

As far as mingling with gods do not Catholics go about asking various dead people to pray for them?

saints are not anything like Gods.

Is it really a stretch for someone to go about (without a specific request from a mortal) doing things for the benefit of man with holy beings?

that’s not what this about and you know it. JS is not looked upon as a saint in the catholic sense but rather as an exalted man in the LDS sense. (like elohim) praise to the man has a number of disturbing themes in it. JS being a God is only one of them.

 

[AMDGtoo]

As far as mingling with gods do not Catholics go about asking various dead people to pray for them?

The Protestant roots of your founder betray you. If he actually knew about Catholic belief, you would know that Catholics do not pray to dead people ever. The word “pray” means “to ask”, and we have been known to ask our fellow Christians–on earth or alive with Our Lord–to ask God’s help with us. It’s like a prayer chain.

 

[teancum79]

according to jesus it’s the same thing
christ and paul never taught eternal progression as defined by the LDS church. it is NOT the same!
saints are not anything like Gods.
that’s not what this about and you know it. JS is not looked upon as a saint in the catholic sense but rather as an exalted man in the LDS sense. (like elohim) praise to the man has a number of disturbing themes in it. JS being a God is only one of them.

Having more than one wife when commanded by God to do so is nto a sin.

Paul and Christ taught that we are the children of God and that we can become like him. Thats about as simple as it gets.

Its a great song with a good story behind it. I find it odd that someone would get upset over a song that addresses the good deeds done by a great man.

 

[Nan_S]

Having more than one wife when commanded by God to do so is nto a sin.

Since God is in charge of deciding Male or Female at conception, does He have so much trouble making enough men to go around that He has to resort to polygamy for every woman to have a husband?

Or is it simply that God has trouble making enough men who believe, and that women are a bunch of mindless sheep who will believe whatever their husbands say, so the few believing men have to take all the wives they can grab?

Personally, I believe that polygamy is a statement of lack of faith in the power of God.

By the way, did you know that eleven of Joseph Smith’s 34 wives were already married to other church members at the time he took them to wife (without a divorce), and that they continued to live with their original husbands?

 

[zaffiroborant]

Having more than one wife when commanded by God to do so is nto a sin.

I have yet to see anything proving God issued a command for polygyny. Since there is none… having more than one wife is adultery and God would not command you to commit such a sin.

 

[majick275]

Having more than one wife when commanded by God to do so is nto a sin.

something tht you have to show ever happened. jesus teachings on the subject indicte that such a command would never occur

Paul and Christ taught that we are the children of God and that we can become like him. Thats about as simple as it gets.

big difference. like him as iin when we re taken into his presence we experience what he has/is. his light shines in us then and we “like” him but we certainly don’t become gods ourselves. that was never taught by paul or christ

Its a great song with a good story behind it. I find it odd that someone would get upset over a song that addresses the good deeds done by a great man.

it epitomes the blasphemy of eternal progression, it endorses blood atonement, it glorifies a womanizing con man in a manner unknown even for saints, it demonstrates a personality cult masquerading as a religion. i guess i shouldn’t be surprised that people who think calling the creeds abominations isn’t offensive are okay with this despicable song.