What do you call yourself?

[Claire_from_DE]

Claire Christian to me is someone who believes and accepts Christ as their savior. As opposed to say a Jew who doesn’t, or a Muslim that has a different view of Jesus.

PEACE

I agree with your definition but it is a very broad one. If I were identifying myself to a Buddist I would say that too. If I were identifying myself to another Christian I would be more specific. Sadly, Christians are not united in belief about Christ and his church.

 

[ibkc]

You see… being born again is of the spirit. It is a spiritual birth. Repentance (turning away from your once sinful nature) and baptism of the Holy Spirit… That means be born again.

OK, I understand now. You pick and choose which Scriptures you will accept, and you’ve chosen to reject the ones that speak of the sacramental nature of water baptism for the remission of sins. It’s totally clear.

 

[believers]

If I were mean, I’d ask how you prove this from Scripture. But I’m not.

Ahh, subjectivism at its finest.



I’ll drop a note to my Mormon friends that they’re born again, too…

It does, however, say “testimony” (Gk. martyrias, from whence we derive the term “martyr”). “Word of their testimony” (logon tes matyrias) is a summation of their external behaviour as Christians, which would naturally include their reception into the Church via baptism of water (as we know from historical documentation of the Early Church). As such, this verse does not say the saints overcame exclusively through baptism, but baptism is implicitly included as part of their overcoming.

Thought so. You see, I used to be right where you are now. I self-identified solely as “Christian” during my Evangelical childhood, until I sat down and realized it really wasn’t precise enough.

I used to be a very serious and studious Protestant, so I believe I am precisely aware of how major the differences are amongst Protestants.

Is baptism necessary for salvation, or not? (Lutherans vs. Pentecostals)

Is partaking of the real Body and Blood of Christ an essential part of the Christian life? (Anglicans vs. Baptists)

Does man freely choose to accept the grace of God for salvation, or is he forced to be saved by the irresistible power of God? (Arminians vs. Calvinists)

Is it acceptable to pray to the saints in heaven, or is this idolatrous? (Anglicans and some Lutherans vs. Evangelicals)

Is anything not mentioned in Scripture forbidden, or permitted? (Churches of Christ vs. most other denominations)

These are just a few of the more prominent examples.

Then you’ve found the right church that fits your belief and probably life style. It gives you the opportunity to use your reason and logic. I, on the other hand, have found the Word of God and have conformed to what it says and who it says I am in Christ. Remember, I am the “whosoever” mentioned in John, Romans, Acts…

Why don’t you define “whosoever” for me since you seem to fond of defining words. TIA

 

[Evlogitos]

Then you’ve found the right church that fits your belief and probably life style. It gives you the opportunity to use your reason and logic.

I hope you’re not implying we should put our brains on hold for Jesus. Faith should always be reasonable. To say otherwise is to buy into a cult mentality.

I, on the other hand, have found the Word of God

“On the other hand”? Because my church “gives me the opportunity to use my reason and logic,” therefore I have not found the Word of God? I hope that’s not what you’re saying, because the implication is monstrously offensive.

and have conformed to what it says

Conformed to your interpretation of what it says, rather.

and who it says I am in Christ. Remember, I am the “whosoever” mentioned in John, Romans, Acts…

According to your definition of those verses (coughprooftextscough), I would fall under that definition too, as would Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses, many Gnostics, many Unitarians, etc.

Why don’t you define “whosoever” for me since you seem to fond of defining words. TIA

Since you seem to be fond of ignoring what words really mean, and how a text really reads, in favour of how you’d like it to read, I shall more than happily oblige:

e.g.:

“For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.”

In Greek, “whoever” is pas. This means “all,” in a fairly good correlation between the Greek and the English. As such, it typically means a literal “all,” but sometimes is used to mean “some from the whole,” as in “all the world.”

 

[Tabitha]

I would but I think you really just want to debate. If that’s the case then I declare you the winner. As I said earlier, you better know you’re born again of the spirit. Where you spend eternity depends on it. If you believe that water baptism did that for you, then you are free to believe what the RCC teaches.

No, I don’t want to debate you. Honestly. I really just want to see where your beliefs are in early Christianity. If you know of early Christian writings that say what you believe, especially about being born again verses baptism, I want to see it.

RCC doesn’t teach “be baptized abd do nothing else and be saved”.

 

[Ilroy]

According to Catholic.com, a person is born again via water baptism. That means, for most Roman Catholics, they were “born-again” as an infant during water baptism. You were supposedly born-again at your water baptism.

Now, let’s see what the Word of God actually says…

Jhn 3:1
There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:

Jhn 3:2
The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.

Jhn 3:3
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

*no mention of infants getting baptized here

Jhn 3:4
Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is OLD? can he enter the second time into his mother’s womb, and be born?

*notice how Nicodemus said when he is OLD.

Jhn 3:5
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a **man **be born of water and [of] the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Jhn 3:6
That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Jhn 3:7
Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

So let’s review, when a person is born into this world, They are born of water. In other words, flesh. But, to be saved we must also be born of the spirit (by the Word of God).

1Pe 1:22
Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, [see that ye] love one another with a pure heart fervently:

1Pe 1:23
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

So, by this whole line of reasoning women cannot be saved…nor young men…you have unlined and bolded old and men only. You are forgetting that it is written that baptism is the new form of circumcision which enters us into the new covenant with God. When were people curcumcised and brought into the old covenant? that’s right, at 8 days old…seems like an infant to me.

Nice try, but next time take into account ALL of scripture…

 

[Ilroy]

Being born again is a spiritual rebirth not an “intellectual assent”. The Word of God says I would know His disciples by their love… not by water baptism by the RCC.

Jhn 13:34
A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

Jhn 13:35
By this shall all [men] know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Wait Wait Wait…a couple posts previous you claimed that all we need is to believe and we will be saved…now you are coming at us with needing to love to be called His disciples…you need to make up your mind…is it believe, is it love, just what is it???

Of course, we Catholic Christians and many other Christians know that it is not just one or the other…Christ gave us alot more than just the few verses you like to quote.