What does Excommunication mean in today's world?

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Angel_Hazard

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A close friend of mine has decided to become ordained through an inter-faith out reach ministry. She was once a devote Catholic, and is worried that she might be excommunicated from the Church. Despite this, she feels that this is her calling in life. She asked me to help her research this, and I have not found any information about modern forms of Excommunication. Can she really be excommunicated? And if so how would this impact her life?

Thank you for any information that you might be able to provide for her.
 
Modern excommunication does occur. If she is concerned about being excommunicated she should talk to someone in her diocesan chancellery. Being excommunicated would prevent her from receiving the sacraments until she went to confession and had any canonical censure lifted.
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marty1818 said:
Modern excommunication does occur. If she is concerned about being excommunicated she should talk to someone in her diocesan chancellery. Being excommunicated would prevent her from receiving the sacraments until she went to confession and had any canonical censure lifted.
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Thank you for pointing me in the right direction. I will tell her.
 
Angel_Hazard said:
A close friend of mine has decided to become ordained through an inter-faith out reach ministry. She was once a devote Catholic, and is worried that she might be excommunicated from the Church. Despite this, she feels that this is her calling in life. She asked me to help her research this, and I have not found any information about modern forms of Excommunication. Can she really be excommunicated? And if so how would this impact her life?

Thank you for any information that you might be able to provide for her.
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My post from another thread:

Excommunication:

Ferendae Sententiae (imposed after formal proceedings):

Can 1378 The pretended celebration of the Eucharist or of Sacramental Confession
Can 1388 Violation of the Seal of Confession by an interpreter

Latae Sententiae (imposed automatically):

Can 1364 Apostasy, heresy, schism
Can 1367 Violation of the Sacred Species
Can 1370 Laying violent hands on the Pope
Can 1378 Absolution of an accomplice
Can 1382 Episcopal consecration without authorisation from the Holy See
Can 1388 Violation of the Seal of Confession by a confessor
Can 1398 Procuring an abortion
 
thistle said:
Excommunication:

Ferendae Sententiae (imposed after formal proceedings):

Can 1378 The pretended celebration of the Eucharist or of Sacramental Confession
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Every year in seminary there’s someone who’s scared they were excommunicated because they practiced Mass, lol.
 
Excommunication in modern day is not your great great grandfather’s excommunication.
Continuous study and exploration of the subject by canon lawyers and theologians has brought about a different understanding. Some say that a pronouncement of excommunication does not put one outside the church; he or she remains a Catholic. Nor does excommunication pronounce any judgment from God or assume the persons does not have goodwill. The Church teaches that above all, our consciences should be obeyed before any ecclesiastic law. In other words…excommunication is all in the mind.
Your friend must do what she truly believes is best.
 
Angel_Hazard said:
A close friend of mine has decided to become ordained through an inter-faith out reach ministry. She was once a devote Catholic, and is worried that she might be excommunicated from the Church. Despite this, she feels that this is her calling in life. She asked me to help her research this, and I have not found any information about modern forms of Excommunication. Can she really be excommunicated? And if so how would this impact her life?

Thank you for any information that you might be able to provide for her.
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From what you say your friend has turned her back on the Catholic Church (do I understand correctly?) so whether she is excommunicated or not she would still be in a state of mortal sin.
 
Excommunication as a canonical issue is a matter of a violation of Canon Law.

As a practical matter, a mortal sin is a practical break with communion (that is, unity) with the Church and one cannot receive the sacraments while in a state of mortal sin. Without more information, it sounds like your friend is not in practical, real day-to-day unity with the Church; there may or may not have been one or more events that have broken unity with the Church since whenever she stopped attending Mass on a weekly basis (and I have not read all posts - so I may be overstating the issue) and have effectively ex comunicated her (or she excommunicated herself - broke unity).

Female ordination in another faith group may wlee be effective renunciation of her faith, which may be a cononical issue resulting in breaking unity with the Church - being “out of communion” or ex-communicated.
 
Anna_Claire said:
The Church teaches that above all,** our consciences should be obeyed before any ecclesiastic law.**
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Are you sure???
Isn`t supremacy of conscience a myth?
Anyway, the Church teaches that we must have an** informed **conscience.
 
Fiasco said:
Are you sure???
Isn`t supremacy of conscience a myth?
Anyway, the Church teaches that we must have an** informed **conscience.
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Joseph Ratzinger (now Pope Benedict XVI) expressed the Church’s understanding of the primacy of conscience – an understanding which he eloquently expressed while serving as Chair of Dogmatic Theology at the University of Tübingen in 1968.

“Above the pope as an expression of the binding claim of church authority,” writes Ratzinger, “stands one’s own conscience, which has to be obeyed first of all, if need be against the demands of church authority.”
 
Anna_Claire said:
… The Church teaches that above all, our consciences should be obeyed before any ecclesiastic law. In other words…excommunication is all in the mind.
Your friend must do what she truly believes is best.
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This is heretical thinking because it is mere relativism. The Church does not teach any of that, even worst it is contrary to the teachings of the Church. The Church teaches the primacy of a well formed conscience, a well formed conscience does not go against the teachings of the Church.

We should not play “sola scriptura” with an out of context quote from a theology teacher.
 
“heretical”…folks on these boards love to throw that one out a lot. Please review what an actual heresy is.

Back to our conscience…if a person uses “primacy of conscience” without true examination then I would say he/she is not informed regarding the faith. However if a decision comes about after serious review of the situation…after much prayer and reflection,…after taking all the necessary steps to be informed and still truly believes he/she is right and the church teaching is wrong, then that person is obligated to follow his/her conscience. Sometimes that’s how the Holy Spirit is working through us.
 
Anna_Claire said:
“heretical”…folks on these boards love to throw that one out a lot. Please review what an actual heresy is.

Back to our conscience…if a person uses “primacy of conscience” without true examination then I would say he/she is not informed regarding the faith. However if a decision comes about after serious review of the situation…after much prayer and reflection,…after taking all the necessary steps to be informed and still truly believes he/she is right and the church teaching is wrong, then that person is obligated to follow his/her conscience. Sometimes that’s how the Holy Spirit is working through us.
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Probably you should review the difference between actual heresy and heretical thinking, two related but different items. The other point is that the Church does not ask for an informed conscience but for a well formed one, the latter implies the first but the first does not ensure the latter.
 
Angel_Hazard said:
A close friend of mine has decided to become ordained through an inter-faith out reach ministry. She was once a devote Catholic, and is worried that she might be excommunicated from the Church. Despite this, she feels that this is her calling in life. She asked me to help her research this, and I have not found any information about modern forms of Excommunication. Can she really be excommunicated? And if so how would this impact her life?

Thank you for any information that you might be able to provide for her.
Click to expand...
Anna_Claire said:
“heretical”…folks on these boards love to throw that one out a lot. Please review what an actual heresy is.

Back to our conscience…if a person uses “primacy of conscience” without true examination then I would say he/she is not informed regarding the faith. However if a decision comes about after serious review of the situation…after much prayer and reflection,…after taking all the necessary steps to be informed and still truly believes he/she is right and the church teaching is wrong, then that person is obligated to follow his/her conscience. Sometimes that’s how the Holy Spirit is working through us.
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Now in the case of the OP, I would hope that you agree even if a person still feels she should be ordained in another faith, after searching all church teachings she still feels she is called to be ordained where the Church prohibits, do you feel it is right to follow her malformed conscience? Just to believe something and want something doesn’t make it the right thing to do. Pope Benedict XVI did not mean this by his words and i believe you know this.

It is possible this person has excommunicated their self because of a public declaration, being ordained in another faith, or being baptized in another faith. To do that is to publically announce that you renounce the Catholic Church. You may still be technically Catholic, but on the outside looking in by your own wishes.
 
Anna_Claire said:
Back to our conscience…if a person uses “primacy of conscience” without true examination then I would say he/she is not informed regarding the faith. However if a decision comes about after serious review of the situation…after much prayer and reflection,…after taking all the necessary steps to be informed and still truly believes he/she is right and the church teaching is wrong, then that person is obligated to follow his/her conscience. Sometimes that’s how the Holy Spirit is working through us.
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If a person feels led by conscience to commit an act of apostacy, the canonical penalty for apostacy still applies. The teaching on conscience refers to the morality of an action, not its canonical status. Formally joining another religion is an act of apostacy and therefore carries a laetae sententiae penalty of excommunication, no matter how much a person is following her conscience.
 
floresco said:
If a person feels led by conscience to commit an act of apostacy, the canonical penalty for apostacy still applies. The teaching on conscience refers to the morality of an action, not its canonical status. Formally joining another religion is an act of apostacy and therefore carries a laetae sententiae penalty of excommunication, no matter how much a person is following her conscience.
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What you say is true but excommunication is really all in the mind. There is no official document that states a person is excommunicated.
 
Anna_Claire said:
What you say is true but excommunication is really all in the mind. There is no official document that states a person is excommunicated.
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There are observable consequences to excommunication. As already mentioned, one may not receive Communion. One cannot be a godparent or Confirmation sponsor. One is not treated as a Catholic for the purpose of marriage within the Church.

There are spiritual consequences too. You seem to dismiss these as “all in the mind”. As Catholics we believe that the spiritual is real not imaginary. But there is no point arguing with you about that.
 
Anna_Claire said:
What you say is true but excommunication is really all in the mind. There is no official document that states a person is excommunicated.
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So tell me, is the entirety of Canon Law merely a figment of the imagination? Whether or not formal excommunications are common these days, hardly changes the fact that it is a legitimate canonical penalty imposed on those who publicly depart from the Church. The fact is that Christ’s Church is a visible, and united, community. It is possible to really be separated from a community.

*Generally it also entails separation from God, does the lack of Sanctifying Grace also exist solely in the mind?
 
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