What does your Boss think about Gay Marriage?

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or your MD, or your accountant or anyone else that you give money to or get money from?

I’m not trying to be flippant, this actually occurred to me on the way home from Mass tonight. ( I pass a Chick Fil A) All week we’ve been hearing about Chick Fil A, and Amazon and Walmart…what about people who have a more direct influence on our lives?

A poster on this board said she quit a job at JC Penney because of their pro-gay family stance. I can’t deny that I’m impressed by that kind of commitment, but I know I can’t do the same. I have a signed lease, I have a car payment-those are obligations that I must honor. It was tough enough in my area to find a job at all-let alone to find one aligned perfectly with Catholic teaching. I know the answer is that honoring God is more important but could we all really do that? I freely admit I have yet to reach that level of trust that God will provide even if I were to take that risk.

What about the MD? We’re trusting that person with our very lives and most of us probably know nothing about their morals and values. Not to mention that we give them a decent amount of our money.

Where do we draw the line as far as supporting only those who endorse our values and compromising because it is practical?
 
Seeker1961 said:
or your MD, or your accountant or anyone else that you give money to or get money from?
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Well I’m the Boss and I support same sex marriage.
What about the MD? We’re trusting that person with our very lives and most of us probably know nothing about their morals and values.
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Not something I necessarily discuss with people I employ but I’ve expressed my views when appropriate or relevant.

Some agree, some disagree but I have yet to have a resignation from anyone.
Where do we draw the line as far as supporting only those who endorse our values and compromising because it is practical?
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That’s for you as an individual I guess and your conscience.

I have a great team working for me. I’d hate to lose any of them especially not just because they felt they could no longer work for me because of my views on homosexual marriage.

But if that were to happen, I wouldn’t try to ask them to reconsider. I wouldn’t want anyone working for me who had a fundamental objection to the person that paid their wage.

Good luck to them finding another job and I hope they’ll be happy there - assuming of course they’ve checked their Boss out for premarital sex, whether they use contraception, if they’ve ever had an abortion, do they too support same sex marriage, and lots of other stuff 🤷

Sarah x 🙂
 
It seems to me that it is almost impossible to live in the world and only deal with people who think exactly like us.

Of course, if there is a reasonable choice to shop somewhere else, conveniently, in order to make a statement, then we can do so.
 
We don’t go far out of our way, but where we can we seek out Catholic or businesses more in line with our values. We definitely don’t even think in terms of boycotting, but might take the next to best price from someone we know has our values.
Example, we got a very bottom dollar deal on a new car without any hassles from a car dealer that donates to our Catholic parish’s school and we bought the full service & warrant extension that I wouldn’t normally buy.
 
My boss thinks it’s an inappropriate subject for workplace discussion.

However, if we only use services that are run by people who share our values, aren’t we losing quite an opportunity for ministry? My best friend is a practicing pagan. We each talk freely and openly about our faith, and I try to show him what my faith is by my example.

On a related note, it always seemed that we’d get alot farther with “God Loves Babies” posters than “God Hates Baby Killers!” posters.
 
No problem with my boss. He is also my pastor. :o Yes, I work for our local parish.

My family doctor, my GYN and my ortho are all Catholic. In fact, my GYN is listed on the One More Soul website.

That said, I do not ask the opinion on homosexual marriage from anyone with whom I do business.

BUT, I do support those businesses that express Christian values. I like the fact that Chick-fil-a and Hobby Lobby are closed on Sunday. 👍
 
I think this is a very good question for CAF Catholics. I have noted a tendency towards withdrawal from the world, so that children are home-schooled, social activities take place with other Catholics, and Catholic business are supported. I have no obection to Catholics doing this. This is a solution to being overwhelmed by, well, people like me I suppose, and I have no objection to Catholics deciding to do this. Most of us live in free countries, and it is hard enough I guess being a catholic without feeling you have to put up with me as well! 🙂 But I see a risk in this. I notice on CAF that same Catholics find it very difficult to engage with others of different views without assuming we want to ‘de-convert’ them, or are motivated by some sort of evil intent. The relevance of this to gay marriage in the workplace is this: if a workmate is truely happy because they are getting married, do you celebrate only if the marriage is valid in the eyes of the Church, or only if the relationship is ‘natural’ in terms of natural law, or only if the marriage is a sacrament? I think that to tell someone at the moment of their greatest happiness that you will not celebrate with them, or refuse to contribute to a gift, or attend a wedding shower, because you think their happiness derived from ‘unnatural lusts’ is unlikely to win a lot of people to Catholicism. Indeed I think it likely to lose a few. On the other hand I get that to participate in celebrating what you regard as objectively evil, or even something they don’t believe in, is not something people should be expected to do. In a pluralist society we need to get on in our workplaces, but should not have to deny our beliefs. At the same time we should not act in a way which causes others distress. Neither we unbelievers nor Catholics have this one fully worked out, but I think accepting the views of others, and realising that it is possible to disagree without disrespecting is a start.
 
There are communities of people who have strong cultural, ethnic and racial identities that prefer to primarily stay with and deal with others just like themselves. I think it is very important for Catholics to home school and to truly keep their children from spending hours meditating on garbage suitable only for the landfill. The current immorality index is quite high. And let’s not forget something that is very anti-social:

"Pope Benedict XVI goes on to say:
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"We are moving toward a dictatorship of relativism which does not recognize anything as for certain and which has as its highest goal one’s own ego and one’s own desires. The church must defend itself against threats such as “radical individualism” and “vague religious mysticism”. [emphasis added]
“Pope Benedict does not play language games, he is unconcerned with the postmodernist’s corner on untruth. Neither should we be. Notice how he calls relativism a “dictatorship” instead of agreeing that no values and no Truth are the way forward for society. What many fail to recognize is that imposing nihilism and arbitrary tribalism is a form of dictatorship. Where untruth or half truth is the common order, there can only be oppression. Political correctness has asked us to abandon our value-laden language and to pick up a new language proper to the secular forum. However, this secular newspeak is value-laden against the traditional claims of the Western world and as such, is a poison rather than a new order. We can and should bring our own conviction laden language to the table, if we’re going to have any sort of real dialogue at all. Misinformation and restrained convictions are not the proper building blocks for a democracy.”

Anarchists, nihilists and those that don’t believe in anything beyond themselves will not provide a way forward or a way to sustain what we have that is worthwhile.

What any boss does in private, even if the Church regards it as sinful, is none of my business. But if my boss does this, there’s going to be a problem:

lifesitenews.com/news/san-diego-firefighters-win-lawsuit-over-forced-participation-in-gay-pride-p

Peace,
Ed
 
Seeker1961 said:
or your MD, or your accountant or anyone else that you give money to or get money from?

I’m not trying to be flippant, this actually occurred to me on the way home from Mass tonight. ( I pass a Chick Fil A) All week we’ve been hearing about Chick Fil A, and Amazon and Walmart…what about people who have a more direct influence on our lives?

A poster on this board said she quit a job at JC Penney because of their pro-gay family stance. I can’t deny that I’m impressed by that kind of commitment, but I know I can’t do the same. I have a signed lease, I have a car payment-those are obligations that I must honor. It was tough enough in my area to find a job at all-let alone to find one aligned perfectly with Catholic teaching. I know the answer is that honoring God is more important but could we all really do that? I freely admit I have yet to reach that level of trust that God will provide even if I were to take that risk.

What about the MD? We’re trusting that person with our very lives and most of us probably know nothing about their morals and values. Not to mention that we give them a decent amount of our money.

Where do we draw the line as far as supporting only those who endorse our values and compromising because it is practical?
Click to expand...
I spent almost 10 years working at a large hospital and a lot of paperwork passed through my hands and I knew a number of people at the hospital. When I went to the Emergency Room, I never asked anybody about their sexual orientation. There was nothing on any form that required me to check “sexual orientation,” followed by a list of possibilities. At the Visitors’ Desk, no one was asked about their sexual orientation.

There used to be something called privacy, especially privacy regarding sex. I’m sure my parents had sex but they sure never discussed it with me. Privacy is good - in your face, 24/7 sex, sex and more sex - bad.

Privacy.

Peace,
Ed
 
We have talked all week about how great it is that we know that Chick Fil A is against gay marriage so we can spend our money there and that Amazon is for gay marriage so we take our business elsewhere. There has also been a great deal of talk this year about whether or not our tax dollars should fund birth control pills or abortion.

All I am asking here is how far do we take the stewardship of our money-whether it is coming in to your account or going out of it. How much should we try and find out about where we make and spend our money?

I work for Disney. It’s a great job, not a real high salary but a lot of job satisfaction, I get to meet great families every day, great people, and I think it is a wonderful opportunity for me to show Christ’s love to others. However, it is very gay friendly company. How should a Catholic handle that?

Should we all be digging deep when it comes to where we work and where we spend our money to find out what the values are?
 
I honestly don’t think about it too much. I will send messages to businesses that I agree with to show my support. For example, I sent Chick Fil A a message expressing my support a few days ago. I figure they get tons of hate mail, so I think it’s important that they know they have supporters too.

As for my boss, he does not support same sex marriage. We are really good friends so we know all about each other’s views, etc. and we agree on pretty much everything.
 
“…to tell someone at the moment of their greatest happiness that you will not celebrate with them, or refuse to contribute to a gift, or attend a wedding shower, because you think their happiness derived from ‘unnatural lusts’ is unlikely to win a lot of people to Catholicism.”

Your hypothetical statement is not something I sought out to do with a lesbian couple, I knew one of them before they came out. I just didn’t RSVP or show up at their “wedding” or reception. Weeks later when I saw them again I was prepared to make an answer without saying anything like ‘unnatural lusts’, but they would hear that I don’t approve. They were non-confrontational and I was happy to see them.

A few years later, her partner lost her college sport scholarship when they were opening up that they were a couple and I genuinely consoled her, she was keeping a brave face in front of her younger partner, but broke down into tears away from her. I truthfully said that that has nothing to do with sports or a college education and is a bigoted act. Also saying that no one who has an unmarried live-in heterosexual partner would have a scholarship pulled.

It’s been interesting being a sounding board of mutual understanding across this divide for a lesbian couple that used donor sperm to give birth to two girls. Again not something I sought out to become or have I agreed with their lifestyle or actions. I’m sure they understand, but we’ve not had a single confrontation mostly from knowing what not to discuss out of mutual respect. I did refuse to go into their bedroom when they had moved into a new house and was showing me around, but we just quickly moved on.

P.S. The result of the Scholarship part of the story. - She had an out of court settlement that she could transfer to another school without any of the usual transfer penalties.
 
My supervisor is a happily married lesbian. I think I know where she stands.
 
I will echo the sentiments of those who discourage airing one’s voting and other preferences at places of employment. There was a time not long ago when such was considered rather bad taste. People did not relate to each other in that way in the work place. There was formality and neutrality. It was understood that you discussed those things among family & close friends, and certainly not with co-workers or with strangers (such as, at a party). The reason is simple: It is very easy to offend, even without realizing it. The other person may be polite, seem to agree, and smile, but feel resentful. He or she may be prevented from firing you or in other ways discriminating (he probably will be!), but that does mean that your openness will not strike a discordant note.

This is a preamble to the OP’s question, because although I have not been the Boss-Boss, I have had underlings, and I have never made my views known to them about such things. I wouldn’t advertise one way or the other about controversial contemporary issues, whether I thought my opinion was majority or minority in the workplace.

I think it is irrelevant what my boss’ views are, and it should be irrelevant to him or her what my views are.

I’ll just say this, though: People who do air their views at work, or their lifestyles, do so at their own risk. I was recently in a situation where two of the employees under me were in an open lesbian relationship. One of those two people has sought a higher position for quite some time, and she has been passed over twice now. It has not been stated why she was passed over. (I also would not promote her, but NOT for that reason AT ALL. While she is capable, there are certain ways in which she is not suitable for reasons having nothing to do with her orientation !) However, the one responsible for reviewing her for promotion has turned her down twice. It happens to be that while he is very educated and assimilated, he is nevertheless an immigrant from a country which frowns upon homosexual lifestyles, and certainly ‘parading’ those openly. I know his culture very, very well, because so many of my former clients & students also came from there. 10-to-1 that was the deciding reason this woman was not promoted.

Discretion is the orientation that I wish more people exercised.

And I realize this is not exactly answering the OP’s question.
 
My boss has not made his opinion knows on the matter.

If I worked at someplace where there was pressure to be supportive of same-sex marriage, I would be very insecure and would probably look for something else. I worked for one company where my boss was very pro-abortion and she made it clear that she felt those who were not pro-abortion were not very smart or promotable. Bye! And I think that was the issue with some people who left places like JCP. The company really made it a part of the culture to approve of same sex marriage. That’s not someplace where I would be comfortable working.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
I will echo the sentiments of those who discourage airing one’s voting and other preferences at places of employment. There was a time not long ago when such was considered rather bad taste. People did not relate to each other in that way in the work place. There was formality and neutrality. It was understood that you discussed those things among family & close friends, and certainly not with co-workers or with strangers (such as, at a party). The reason is simple: It is very easy to offend, even without realizing it. The other person may be polite, seem to agree, and smile, but feel resentful. He or she may be prevented from firing you or in other ways discriminating (he probably will be!), but that does mean that your openness will not strike a discordant note.

This is a preamble to the OP’s question, because although I have not been the Boss-Boss, I have had underlings, and I have never made my views known to them about such things. I wouldn’t advertise one way or the other about controversial contemporary issues, whether I thought my opinion was majority or minority in the workplace.

I think it is irrelevant what my boss’ views are, and it should be irrelevant to him or her what my views are.

I’ll just say this, though: People who do air their views at work, or their lifestyles, do so at their own risk. I was recently in a situation where two of the employees under me were in an open lesbian relationship. One of those two people has sought a higher position for quite some time, and she has been passed over twice now. It has not been stated why she was passed over. (I also would not promote her, but NOT for that reason AT ALL. While she is capable, there are certain ways in which she is not suitable for reasons having nothing to do with her orientation !) However, the one responsible for reviewing her for promotion has turned her down twice. It happens to be that while he is very educated and assimilated, he is nevertheless an immigrant from a country which frowns upon homosexual lifestyles, and certainly ‘parading’ those openly. I know his culture very, very well, because so many of my former clients & students also came from there. 10-to-1 that was the deciding reason this woman was not promoted.

Discretion is the orientation that I wish more people exercised.

And I realize this is not exactly answering the OP’s question.
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I agree…why do I have to know someone’s sexual orientation? I don’t want to see heterosexual couples lacking discretion or homosexuals doing that…especially un-married people. The same way I don’t want to hear someone swearing all the time.

What does this have to do with their work? I did have someone who worked for me who I thought was agnostic…but yet when we were at San Fransisco on business and walking around…I notice St. Peter and Paul CC was open. I asked if she wouldn’t mind if I went in…she shocked me by coming in too! But I did not make a big deal about it…

What I don’t like is when people expect you to have their view on it…or have a problem if you have morals that will not allow you to do things you consider “shady” but they don’t see anything wrong with…
 
wmw said:
“…to tell someone at the moment of their greatest happiness that you will not celebrate with them, or refuse to contribute to a gift, or attend a wedding shower, because you think their happiness derived from ‘unnatural lusts’ is unlikely to win a lot of people to Catholicism.”

Your hypothetical statement is not something I sought out to do with a lesbian couple, I knew one of them before they came out. I just didn’t RSVP or show up at their “wedding” or reception. Weeks later when I saw them again I was prepared to make an answer without saying anything like ‘unnatural lusts’, but they would hear that I don’t approve. They were non-confrontational and I was happy to see them.

A few years later, her partner lost her college sport scholarship when they were opening up that they were a couple and I genuinely consoled her, she was keeping a brave face in front of her younger partner, but broke down into tears away from her. I truthfully said that that has nothing to do with sports or a college education and is a bigoted act. Also saying that no one who has an unmarried live-in heterosexual partner would have a scholarship pulled.

It’s been interesting being a sounding board of mutual understanding across this divide for a lesbian couple that used donor sperm to give birth to two girls. Again not something I sought out to become or have I agreed with their lifestyle or actions. I’m sure they understand, but we’ve not had a single confrontation mostly from knowing what not to discuss out of mutual respect. I did refuse to go into their bedroom when they had moved into a new house and was showing me around, but we just quickly moved on.

P.S. The result of the Scholarship part of the story. - She had an out of court settlement that she could transfer to another school without any of the usual transfer penalties.
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I hope Ed reads this. :tiphat:
 
“I think that gay marriage should be between a man and a woman.” - Arnold Schwarzenegger during the California recall campaign (2003)
 
Dorothy said:
It seems to me that it is almost impossible to live in the world and only deal with people who think exactly like us.

Of course, if there is a reasonable choice to shop somewhere else, conveniently, in order to make a statement, then we can do so.
Click to expand...
This cannot be accurate!

Makes too much sense! 👍
 
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