What exactly is a venial sin?

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truthseekerjay

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According to the CCC:

1862 One commits venial sin when, in a less serious matter, he does not observe the standard prescribed by the moral law, or when he disobeys the moral law in a grave matter, but without full knowledge or without complete consent.

Can someone give me some scenarios where a venial sin is committed? For example, is downloading songs from the internet a venial sin? How about being angry/irritated at someone for a minor issue?
 
truthseekerjay said:
According to the CCC:

1862 One commits venial sin when, in a less serious matter, he does not observe the standard prescribed by the moral law, or when he disobeys the moral law in a grave matter, but without full knowledge or without complete consent.

Can someone give me some scenarios where a venial sin is committed? For example, is downloading songs from the internet a venial sin? How about being angry/irritated at someone for a minor issue?
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I think - Moral Law States: “Always be Patient, Kind, and Motivated for God in the Body, Mind, Will, and Soul towards Others and the Self.”

Possible Scenario: If one accepts or knows that it is against Moral Law to get angry, and gets angry, then somewhere within the moment of getting angered, a venial sin was committed. Discerning where failure to “Love in the Being” can only be found through heavy reflection of one’s self.

I hope this helps. Great Question!
 
truthseekerjay said:
According to the CCC:

1862 One commits venial sin when, in a less serious matter, he does not observe the standard prescribed by the moral law, or when he disobeys the moral law in a grave matter, but without full knowledge or without complete consent.

Can someone give me some scenarios where a venial sin is committed? For example, is downloading songs from the internet a venial sin? How about being angry/irritated at someone for a minor issue?
Click to expand...
I would not spend a second on that.
It is up to God to judge us. To try to guess what is a venial sin is a shot in the dark.
Theory is right but it is so hard to figure out all the details that ony God hs the wisdom to do that.
 
Pfaffenhoffen said:
I would not spend a second on that.
It is up to God to judge us. To try to guess what is a venial sin is a shot in the dark.
Theory is right but it is so hard to figure out all the details that ony God hs the wisdom to do that.
Click to expand...
But Pfaffenhoffen,

Isn’t it important to know the sorts of sins that are venial and the sorts of sins that are mortal?
 
TrueLight said:
But Pfaffenhoffen,

Isn’t it important to know the sorts of sins that are venial and the sorts of sins that are mortal?
Click to expand...
TrueLight, I agree and the reason I even asked the question is because I remembered learning in CCD that when a person commits a mortal sin, they have to go to confession before receiving communion. I know that Catholics are required to go to mass every Sunday and I assume that they should also be receiving communion weekly. I would think that for someone to receive communion weekly that they would have to go to confession weekly as well just to play it safe since they probably don’t know which of their sins during the week were mortal and which were venial.
 
jochoa said:
Possible Scenario: If one accepts or knows that it is against Moral Law to get angry, and gets angry, then somewhere within the moment of getting angered, a venial sin was committed. Discerning where failure to “Love in the Being” can only be found through heavy reflection of one’s self.
Click to expand...
Does this mean that, with respect to anger, a venial sin is always followed by a mortal sin? I guess one can realize that he/she is angry and try to calm themselves down, but would you say that a mortal sin already occurred when the person became angry?
 
truthseekerjay said:
Can someone give me some scenarios where a venial sin is committed? For example, is downloading songs from the internet a venial sin? How about being angry/irritated at someone for a minor issue?
Click to expand...
It would be much easier to give you an example of a mortal sin.

In order for an act to be mortally sinful, it must meet three (and exactly three) very specific criteria:

  1. *]It must be of a serious and morally offensive nature (such as a violation of the Ten Commandments)
    *]The person must be fully aware of the serious nature of the offense at the time of the act.
    *]The person must fully, freely, and willingly consent to the act.

    If something is a sin but does not rise to these criteria, it is not a mortal sin (and is thus a venial sin). Killing someone might be mortally sinful in one circumstance, and venially sinful in another, and completely sinless in yet another. Thus, we cannot say whether any particular act is always mortally sinful.

    FWIW, it is actually impossible for anyone (even us) to know if any of our acts are mortally sinful. Only God (who knows us better than we know ourselves) can say for sure.

    You cited the example of downloading songs on the internet. Under US law, this is normally a violation of copyright, and is a criminal act.

    In legal terms, copyright law would generally be categorized as Malum prohibitum, meaning it is unlawful because it is prohibited by statute. Catholics are obliged to adhere to local laws (provided they do not contradict Catholic teaching), so such laws are binding upon Catholics. But the Church would not agree that all such laws rise to the level of “seriousness” required by the first criteria of culpability for mortal sin. Other examples of Malum prohibitum laws include speed limits and parking violations.

    Some laws are categorized as malum in se, which are morally repugnant to society. Such crimes would include murder and rape. This is an aspect of Common Law, which transcends judicial boundaries and applies to everyone everywhere. The Church generally regards all such offenses as serious matters and thus are more likely to be mortally culpable (but only God knows for sure).

    US civil law currently classifies copyright violations as a form of theft - which is a violation of the Ten Commandments. The whole notion of copyrights (and especially international copyrights) is fairly new in human society, and most legal scholars would argue that it does not rise to the level of malum in se in the same manner of a highwayman bandit committing armed robbery. The Church has not taken a position on this particular point.
 
truthseekerjay said:
According to the CCC:

1862 One commits venial sin when, in a less serious matter, he does not observe the standard prescribed by the moral law, or when he disobeys the moral law in a grave matter, but without full knowledge or without complete consent.

Can someone give me some scenarios where a venial sin is committed? For example, is downloading songs from the internet a venial sin? How about being angry/irritated at someone for a minor issue?
Click to expand...
The other day I was at a hardware store. I had a bunch of stuff I had to buy. I thought I put everything up on the counter to scan for payment. I paid the bill. When I got to the car I found 1 item in the basket that I didn’t see back in the store. It didn’t get scanned. It was a $3.00 item. I’m thinking at that moment I have every intention of paying for the item. So I went back into the store, to the same checker, and paid for the item telling her what happened. She thanked me for my honesty. 2 things as I see it, happened there.
  • The sin would have been a small sin if I decided not to pay for the item. But it would have bothered me just the same because I knew it would be wrong not to pay for the item. Small sins are venial in nature but they wound the soul just the same
  • my action ended up being a witness to the checker. How many times has that happened to her in all the customers she sees over the course of maybe years? Maybe I’m the first to do that for such a small item… I have never seen this checker before and I probably won’t see her again…it’s a big hardware store, and lots of employees. I don’t even remember what she looked like. But maybe this act helps her in her faith. Or maybe she sees me again in the store and will remember the incident and how a small item can make a big impact. Maybe she tells the story at the next employee meeting, and it makes an impact on somebody. All over a small $3.00 item and doing what’s right.
The CCC has multiple entries on Venial sin ccc.scborromeo.org.master.com/texis/master/search/?sufs=0&q=venial+&xsubmit=Search&s=SS
 
truthseekerjay said:
According to the CCC:

1862 One commits venial sin when, in a less serious matter, he does not observe the standard prescribed by the moral law, or when he disobeys the moral law in a grave matter, but without full knowledge or without complete consent.

Can someone give me some scenarios where a venial sin is committed? For example, is downloading songs from the internet a venial sin? How about being angry/irritated at someone for a minor issue?
Click to expand...
The Catechism gives a cross reference of CCC paragraphs to Scriptural basis. Venial sin is a sin that is not unto death (or deadly) This is most clearly illustrated in the first letter of John.

1John 5:16 - 17 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.
 
[bibledrb]Genesis 4:6-7[/bibledrb]

Sin is the opposite of God’s righteousness. And the level of sin is directly related to the level the sinful act takes you away from God. It is very personal and IMHO can only be measured by knowing the true nature of our hearts. And I know of no mortal man capable of that. That is exclusive to our Lord and Savior.

However, by the guidance of the Holy Spirit the Church can assist us to get back on track.

God Bless.
 
DavidFilmer said:
In order for an act to be mortally sinful, it must meet three (and exactly three) very specific criteria:

  1. *]It must be of a serious and morally offensive nature (such as a violation of the Ten Commandments)
    *]The person must be fully aware of the serious nature of the offense at the time of the act.
    *]The person must fully, freely, and willingly consent to the act.
Click to expand...

  1. Whenever one willingly violates ANY law given by God, couldn’t that be considered as one putting their will over God and in a sense idolizing oneself over God? And doesn’t that break the second commandment? I know that idol worship is a more direct violation of the second commandment, but I would think that failing to follow any rule would be a violation as well just like lust is as much a violation of the adultery commandment as direct adultery. I don’t know if you were hinting at this, but couldn’t ALL sins be seen as serious enough to be a mortal sin?

    BTW, it seemed as if you were saying that violating speed limits is not a serious offense against God, but can you say that for sure? As you mentioned, Jesus did command us to follow the rules of the state if they don’t violate His rules. If expert opinion states that 60 mph is a safe limit and you willingly violate that rule, couldn’t that be seen as willingly putting yourself and possibly others in danger. This MAY be worst than lying or lust, so can you be sure that God doesn’t see violating speed limits as a minor offense?

    I’ll probably start a thread on this, but if no one can be certain what is a venial sin and what is a mortal sin, should Catholics go to confession every week to assure that all their mortal sins are forgiven in order to receive communion every week?
 
truthseekerjay said:
Does this mean that, with respect to anger, a venial sin is always followed by a mortal sin? I guess one can realize that he/she is angry and try to calm themselves down, but would you say that a mortal sin already occurred when the person became angry?
Click to expand...
Hmmm…I think:
It depends on a few factors:
  1. Where is the anger occurring (In the body, the mind, the will and interactions, the soul, or the entire being unified)?
    If it is a Unified Anger, then I am confident it is heavily aligned with Mortal Sin.
    If not…
  2. What is the Overwhelming Motivation (the self, others, and/or God)?
    If the Overwhelming Motivation is the self, then I am confident it is heavily aligned with Mortal Sin.
    If not…
  3. What is the Future Gameplan regarding a similar scenario (continue to get angry until the other person changes, or Study, Learn, and change the self to be more at oneness in Perfect Love)?
    If the gameplan is to continue getting angry, then I am confident it is heavily aligned with Mortal Sin.
Thank you very much for your time and consideration! I appreciate your questions, for they have helped me grow in faith and understanding.
 
steve_b said:
The other day I was at a hardware store. I had a bunch of stuff I had to buy. I thought I put everything up on the counter to scan for payment. I paid the bill. When I got to the car I found 1 item in the basket that I didn’t see back in the store. It didn’t get scanned. It was a $3.00 item. I’m thinking at that moment I have every intention of paying for the item. So I went back into the store, to the same checker, and paid for the item telling her what happened. She thanked me for my honesty. 2 things as I see it, happened there.
  • The sin would have been a small sin if I decided not to pay for the item.
Click to expand...
When you say “small sin”, are you calling it a venial sin? The following situation may be highly improbable, but would this be considered a more serious sin (in God’s eyes) if the item was $1000? How about if a person had a friend with asthma who accidentally dropped his inhaler in that person’s gym bag and after realizing what happened, that person was too lazy to bring it back to his friend the same day. Would this change the seriousness of the sin in God’s eyes?
 
steve_b said:
The other day I was at a hardware store. I had a bunch of stuff I had to buy. I thought I put everything up on the counter to scan for payment. I paid the bill. When I got to the car I found 1 item in the basket that I didn’t see back in the store. It didn’t get scanned. It was a $3.00 item. I’m thinking at that moment I have every intention of paying for the item. So I went back into the store, to the same checker, and paid for the item telling her what happened. She thanked me for my honesty. 2 things as I see it, happened there.
  • The sin would have been a small sin if I decided not to pay for the item.
Click to expand...
I had to do something before finishing my last post.

Anyway, I think that it’s obvious with our human point of view that the consequences of “stealing” a $3 item, a $1000 item, and an inhaler become more serious, but I feel that it’s all the same in God’s eyes. Jesus did say that lust was just as bad as adultery (although the consequences for lust may not be as “bad” from a human point of view). I guess my question is if venial sins actually exist or are ALL sins mortal?

This is a Bible verse quoted above:
1John 5:16 - 17 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.

This verse SOUNDS TO ME like it’s saying not to pray for a person committing a sin causing death, but we obviously pray for people who have murdered and committed other “serious” acts, so is this verse really distinguishing between mortal and venial sins? Please feel free to correct my interpretation of this verse as necessary.
 
jochoa said:
Hmmm…I think:
It depends on a few factors:
  1. Where is the anger occurring (In the body, the mind, the will and interactions, the soul, or the entire being unified)?
    If it is a Unified Anger, then I am confident it is heavily aligned with Mortal Sin.
    If not…
  2. What is the Overwhelming Motivation (the self, others, and/or God)?
    If the Overwhelming Motivation is the self, then I am confident it is heavily aligned with Mortal Sin.
    If not…
  3. What is the Future Gameplan regarding a similar scenario (continue to get angry until the other person changes, or Study, Learn, and change the self to be more at oneness in Perfect Love)?
    If the gameplan is to continue getting angry, then I am confident it is heavily aligned with Mortal Sin.
Thank you very much for your time and consideration! I appreciate your questions, for they have helped me grow in faith and understanding.
Click to expand...
With respect to the second question, I think the anger that Jesus was talking about that He said was equivalent to murder was the self motivated anger. Jesus was obviously angry when people were making use of the temple for unholy purposes, so all anger can’t be bad. The anger I was referring to in my first post was self motivated anger, like when someone gets angry for being in traffic, or being cut off by another car, or being corrected by a fellow coworker.
 
truthseekerjay said:
I had to do something before finishing my last post.

Anyway, I think that it’s obvious with our human point of view that the consequences of “stealing” a $3 item, a $1000 item, and an inhaler become more serious, but I feel that it’s all the same in God’s eyes. Jesus did say that lust was just as bad as adultery (although the consequences for lust may not be as “bad” from a human point of view). I guess my question is if venial sins actually exist or are ALL sins mortal?

This is a Bible verse quoted above:
1John 5:16 - 17 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.

This verse SOUNDS TO ME like it’s saying not to pray for a person committing a sin causing death, but we obviously pray for people who have murdered and committed other “serious” acts, so is this verse really distinguishing between mortal and venial sins? Please feel free to correct my interpretation of this verse as necessary.
Click to expand...
Surely you’ll agree that any given verse/set of verses can have multiple levels of meanings. It seems quite clear that these verses describe the existence of venial and mortal sins by saying “there is a sin unto death”, and “there is a sin not unto death”. Here, John is making a clear distinction between two classes of sin - one that causes spiritual death and one that does not. As Catholics, we call sins that lead to spiritual death mortal sins, and we call sins that do not lead to spiritual death venial sins.

As I’m sure you’ve already noticed, there’s no set list of what actions are mortal sins. It’s much easier to give a list of actions that are considered to be grave matter, which is one of the three requirements for a sin to be considered mortal (as previously stated, the other two requirements are full knowledge and deliberate consent). A particular action could be a mortal sin for one person and a venial sin for another person (for instance if one person does not understand the gravity of what they did or they do not freely choose the action).

While it is important to understand the distinction between different levels of sin, it’s most important to understand that all sin offends God, and we must avoid sin always. God bless.
 
The theory is good, but it is so difficult to understand Buy RS Gold all the details that ony am God’s wisdom to do so.
 
truthseekerjay said:
BTW, it seemed as if you were saying that violating speed limits is not a serious offense against God, but can you say that for sure?
Click to expand...
Only God can say for sure. But all legal jurisdictions that I know of classify a speed limit violation as a misdemeanor offense, unless it is an “extreme” violation (the definition of which varies among jurisdictions).

In this regard, US civil law is in agreement with Church doctrine that some sins are inherently more grievous than others. A person who travels 66 MPH in a 65 MPH zone is subject to far less penalty than one who travels at 100+ MPH in the same zone (which, in many jurisdictions, constitutes a felony - the legal equivalent of a mortal sin - and the penalty is much more severe). The offense is exactly the same in both cases (exceeding the posted speed limit) but the punishment is not the same due to the severity of the act.

This is justice, tempered by mercy. God is Just AND Merciful. If the US legal system can get this right, God can certainly get this right.
 
TrueLight said:
But Pfaffenhoffen,

Isn’t it important to know the sorts of sins that are venial and the sorts of sins that are mortal?
Click to expand...
True Light, first of all, was everything all right with the ceremony? Hly communin, I guess. Just wondering, noneed to share!

For me True Light, it is a waste of time. There are better ways to spend your time. The Church says that no one can be sure if he/she is in a state of grace. So, invresely (I would say, not the Church), no one can be sure that she/he in a state of sin.

Jesus said to St.Therese of Avila, I wont tell you whether Judas is in hell. Are we sure Hitler, the biggest butcher after Genghis Khan, is in hell?

It is up to God to judge us. We are sinners, all of us, from me to the Pope. It is wnough for confessions. Now, if this sin is 55.6%, or the other is 34.9%, is just consuming and leads nowhere.

The Church always preached: in the end of the day, do your exam. See what you have done wrong. See what you could do better. Make a plan for the future. See how you can improve, kill your sins, be more perfect so that you may be perfect like the Father who is in Heaven. I think this is productive. Try your best to be better each day.

Now, exam each action to think: what is mortal? was it venial? If venial, how much? I mean, I passed through it, it is exhausting and leads nowhere.

I think to be positive to search for perfection, to try to correct your sins, to try to do better if you did good is a more positive way than dwelling in the thoughts: I am in mortal sin! And if I die tonight I go to hell! And the priest broke a leg and in a month I cannot confess! And there is no other priest around! And i go to hell! Girl, exhausting and … selfish… it is just me and me and me and me…My hell and My Heaven… And the other?

GBY
 
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