What exactly is the holy spirit?

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You said,
To put it basically, the Father and the Son love each other so fully that it produces another Person: the Holy Spirit.
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Which made it sound like you meant produced doubly by the Father and Son.
 
I also would like to add the power can be the 7 gifts of the holy spirit and fruit of the spirit, and a person who is spirit filled has these gifts and fruits to the max or filled with these qualities
 
Who came first the Holy Spirit or The Son? Some scripture readings mention the Holy Spirit before Jesus this is a tad confusing.
 
The persons of the Trinity are co-eternal, so we have to understand the relationship between them in that sense. We profess in the Nicene Creed that the Spirit “proceeds from the Father and the Son” but this is not referring to a specific point in time, rather it is eternal.

As for the Son, John 1:1 states: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God”, the Word of course referring to God the Son. It’s not that He did not exist until the moment of the Incarnation.
 
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wiggbuggie1 said:
I also would like to add the power can be the 7 gifts of the holy spirit and fruit of the spirit, and a person who is spirit filled has these gifts and fruits to the max or filled with these qualities
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Well said. Generally understood, the seven fold gifts of the Spirit are power and strength; and the fruits of the Holy Spirit as the names suggest, are qualities that characterized the indwelling or the action of the Holy Spirit in us.

The fruits therefore should be the preferred signs that we desire, of one who has the Holy Spirit, rather than talent and power.

Jesus was saying (John15) that only in Him we will bear much fruit. Some people say this can be the furits of the Holy Spirit that we are developed into, together with the result of our work.

God bless.
 
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Yeah, Lucas, ran with it… he even included the Heavenly battle (Genesis 3:15; Apocalypse [Revelation] 12), but no.

Chi–far from it; there’s no give and take here.

The Holy Spirit is God; the Third Person of God, to be precise.

Jesus Reveals that God is Spirit (St. John 4:24) and Scriptures Reveal that:
  • the Father is God
  • the Son is God
  • the Holy Spirit is God
Scriptures also Reveal that God Exists from the Beginning (before anything was brought into existence); hence, the Holy Spirit, being God, does not depend on the play of the bad/dark side in order to Be.

…and no, it is not some achievable level or some “special” genetic “gift” that some are born with.

So “to be filled with the Holy Spirit” is not something that man can achieve on his own.

While the Gift of the Holy Spirit is freely Granted by God, only those who Believe can be filled by the Holy Spirit:
2 For he is found by them that tempt him not: and he sheweth himself to them that have faith in him. 3 For perverse thoughts separate from God: and his power, when it is tried, reproveth the unwise: 4 For wisdom will not enter into a malicious soul, nor dwell in a body subject to sins. 5 For the Holy Spirit of discipline will flee from the deceitful, and will withdraw himself from thoughts that are without understanding, and he shall not abide when iniquity cometh in. 6 For the spirit of wisdom is benevolent, and will not acquit the evil speaker from his lips: for God is witness of his reins, and he is a true searcher of his heart, and a hearer of his tongue. 7 For the spirit of the Lord hath filled the whole world: and that, which containeth all things, hath knowledge of the voice. (Wisdom 1)
15 If you love me, keep my commandments. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he shall give you another Paraclete, that he may abide with you for ever. 17 The spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, nor knoweth him: but you shall know him; because he shall abide with you, and shall be in you. (St. John 14)
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Maran atha!

Angel
 
Here’s the Scripture to go with that:
13 In whom you also, after you had heard the word of truth, (the gospel of your salvation;) in whom also believing, you were signed with the holy Spirit of promise, 14 Who is the pledge of our inheritance, unto the redemption of acquisition, unto the praise of his glory. (Ephesians 1)

Maran atha!

Angel
 
Hi, Rose!

It is a Mystery.

Some have attempted to Know God–some may have been given a little knowledge about God; ultimately only when we are “changed” would we Truly Know God and Understand Him as He IS.

Maran atha!

Angel
 
Hi, Philosopher!

I do not usually get involved in scrutinizing God… but I got to this thread… so where do you get that single/double source thing?

Maran atha!

Angel
 
You shouldn’t… (yet, how do you do that?–mute the thread, I mean)

Maran atha!

Angel
 
Hi, Alexander!

I think that you are speaking to the Incarnation–the Holy Spirit being the Source of the Virgin’s Conception of Jesus.

However, God is God–He does not Exist in variant timeframes or levels.

St. John’s Gospel opens with:

‘In the Beginning was the Word.’

He further qualifies:
‘The Word was God and the Word was with God.’

So it is Revealed that God Exists from the Beginning (before Creation) as God and alongside God.

Revelation of God (the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit) takes places as He chooses to enter into Creation.

Maran atha!

Angel
 
Francis de Sales has an incredibly beautiful description of the origin / nature of the Holy Spirit in his Treatise on the Love of God. Go to page 178 of the PDF, Book III Chapter XIII. It’s only a couple of pages.
 
(At the bottom of the page, until “This topic will close…” you’ll see a button called Tracking. Click on it, and you’ll see your notification options, including muting.)
 
Thanks!

I’ve noticed the link before but never thought to open it.

I don’t plan to use it but some threads (people) just go on and on–so it is good to know.

Maran atha!

Angel
 
jcrichton said:
He IS.
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Respectfully toward thank you for your kindly reply! 🙂 Ones point exactly jcrichton, He IS!
As written John 14:9 Don’t you know…
Written Forgive them for they know not…

Why do we not know or Jesus asking the question>>>Why don’t you know?

Jesus rebukes strongly, boldly, harshly to whom in>> Matthew Chapter 23, might tell us why we know not? Or do not know?

And agree only when we are changed from within…Love me with your >>whole >>>hearts soul and mind. James Epistle teaching of wisdom is about knowing and how to accomplish such? Restore our fracturedness within, become whole within?
Jesus wants us to know does he not?

Why he came preaching, teaching, rebuking and making it known, telling all >>Let your ears hear what the Holy Spirit says…?

Interesting is all, have more questions then answers. lol Asking questions is how we come to know? Jesus asked many questions to those who thought they knew the all of all, did he not, knowing they knew not?

Peace 🙂
 
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rose321 said:
Why do we not know or Jesus asking the question>>>Why don’t you know?
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This is the most important question man has to answer.

Yet, Jesus has already given us the answer. He made it clear (though the Teaching does confuse) that no one can come to Him unless they go to the Father and the Father Teaches them to go to the Son; yet, it is the Holy Spirit that makes this possible:
4 For wisdom will not enter into a malicious soul, nor dwell in a body subject to sins. 5 For the Holy Spirit of discipline will flee from the deceitful, and will withdraw himself from thoughts that are without understanding, and he shall not abide when iniquity cometh in. 6 For the spirit of wisdom is benevolent, and will not acquit the evil speaker from his lips: for God is witness of his reins, and he is a true searcher of his heart, and a hearer of his tongue. 7 For the spirit of the Lord hath filled the whole world: and that, which containeth all things, hath knowledge of the voice. 8 Therefore he that speaketh unjust things cannot be hid, neither shall the chastising judgment pass him by. 9 For inquisition shall be made into the thoughts of the ungodly: and the hearing of his words shall come to God, to the chastising of his iniquities. (Wisdom 1)
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St. Paul passes on Jesus’ Teachings about the Holy Spirit as he explains:
26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmity. For we know not what we should pray for as we ought; but the Spirit himself asketh for us with unspeakable groanings. 27 And he that searcheth the hearts, knoweth what the Spirit desireth; because he asketh for the saints according to God. (Romans 8)
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The problem man has is that he is obstinate and refuses to humbly submit to God’s Will–man hinders the Grace of the Holy Spirit.

So we travel, too often, as the Hebrews in their 40 years desert trek–always second-guessing God’s Purpose and Design.

Maran atha!

Angel
 
jcrichton said:
Yet, Jesus has already given us the answer. He made it clear (though the Teaching does confuse) that no one can come to Him unless they go to the Father and the Father Teaches them to go to the Son; yet, it is the Holy Spirit that makes this possible:
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Respectfully opinion only: Fully agree with ! Let your ears hear what the Holy Spirit says…
jcrichton said:
The problem man has is that he is obstinate and refuses to humbly submit to God’s Will–man hinders the Grace of the Holy Spirit
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Fully agree with and indeed man hinders the Grace of the Holy Spirit.
Peace 🙂
 
thephilosopher6 said:
Are you implying the Holy Spirit finds his source between the Father and Son, so as to have a double source? If so, that’s heresy. The Holy Spirit finds his source in the Father through the Son as a single spiration, not double.
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In the niceno-constantinopolitan creed which we recite every Sunday at Mass, we profess:
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father and the Son…

Accordingly, it is true to say both that the Holy Spirit proceeds from two sources and also from one source and also that this procession from either point of view takes place simultaneously. The procession of the Holy Spirit can be looked at from the point of view of the distinction of persons of the Father and the Son as well as from the point of view of the unity of their nature which is one.

From the distinction of the persons of the Father and the Son from whom the Holy Spirit proceeds, the Holy Spirit is from two principles. The Father is the first principle of the Holy Spirit or the principle not from another principle. The Son is the second principle of the Holy Spirit or a principle from a principle because the Son is from the Father only while the Holy Spirit is from them both.

From the point of view of the unity of the one divine nature of the Father and the Son, the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son as from one principle or source. The Trinity is three according to the distinction of the persons and at the same time one according to the unity of one divine nature. As the Trinity of persons are of one divine nature, there is only one intellect and will in God, i.e., not three intellects or three wills in God. Consequently, being the third person of the Trinity, the Holy Spirit is spirated simultaneously and equally from the Father and the Son from their one will and love for each other for love is an act of the will which is why the Holy Spirit is called ‘Love’, and thus as you point out there is only one spiration of the Holy Spirit and in this sense the Father and the Son are one principle of the Holy Spirit.

The preposition ‘through’ in the clause ‘the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father through the Son,’ stresses the first principle or source of the Trinity of persons who is the Father. The greek fathers preferred using the ‘through’ preposition. The latin fathers preferred the ‘and’ conjunction using the clause 'the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son. This stresses the consubstantiality of the Father and the Son and their oneness or unity of nature from whom conjointly, the Holy Spirit proceeds. Both clauses referring to the procession of the Holy Spirit either with the ‘though’ preposition or the ‘and’ conjunction mean the same thing but looked at from different points of view as it were. The clause with the ‘through’ preposition is laying stress on the first principle of the Trinity which is the Father from whom both the Son and Holy Spirit proceed but in due order while the clause with the ‘and’ conjunction is laying stress as it were on the conjoint procession of the Holy Spirit from the Father and the Son
 
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This is the best answer anyone will get on this thread. Comment are no longer necessary. 😇
 
KevinK said:
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Brittany:
To put it basically, the Father and the Son love each other so fully that it produces another Person: the Holy Spirit.
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I have never heard that the Holy Spirit is a product of the love between Father and Son. What is your source for this?
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Yes, that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the will by way of love from the Father and the Son and that the Son is begotten from the intellect of the Father has been a teaching in the Church since the Church Fathers especially St Augustine. It is derived from Holy Scripture itself. This teaching is considered theologically certain, sententia certa.

Confer the Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma, Dr. Ludwig Ott
http://www.traditionalcatholic.co/free-catholic-books-ii/

Summa Theologica of St Thomas Aquinas - its online, just google for it.

General Audience Catechesis by Pope John Paul II - The Holy Spirit Proceeds from the Father and the Son - November 20, 1985
http://www.totus2us.com/teaching/jp...-spirit-proceeds-from-the-father-and-the-son/
 
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