What Happened Before Christ?

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What does the Catholic Church hold as to the destiny (heaven, hell, etc.) of those people who died before the time of Christ? I always assumed it would be the same as for those who lived during and after in a state of “invincible ignorance”, but given the necessity of Christ’s coming to earth I wonder if that’s incorrect…?
 
What does the Catholic Church hold as to the destiny (heaven, hell, etc.) of those people who died before the time of Christ? I always assumed it would be the same as for those who lived during and after in a state of “invincible ignorance”, but given the necessity of Christ’s coming to earth I wonder if that’s incorrect…?
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church (emphasis mine):
633 Scripture calls the abode of the dead, to which the dead Christ went down, “hell” - Sheol in Hebrew or Hades in Greek - because those who are there are deprived of the vision of God. Such is the case for all the dead, whether evil or righteous, while they await the Redeemer: which does not mean that their lot is identical, as Jesus shows through the parable of the poor man Lazarus who was received into “Abraham’s bosom” “It is precisely these holy souls, who awaited their Savior in Abraham’s bosom, whom Christ the Lord delivered when he descended into hell.” Jesus did not descend into hell to deliver the damned, nor to destroy the hell of damnation, but to free the just who had gone before him.
634 “The gospel was preached even to the dead.” The descent into hell brings the Gospel message of salvation to complete fulfilment. This is the last phase of Jesus’ messianic mission, a phase which is condensed in time but vast in its real significance: the spread of Christ’s redemptive work to all men of all times and all places, for all who are saved have been made sharers in the redemption.
 
Right. To make it simple. The gates of heaven were closed to all until opened by the Redeemer for those who had already died righteous.
 
In pre-Christian days a soul was judged solely on its merits relative to The Law and on moral conscience for those who did not have The Law.

There are saints who have revelations (though it escapes me which ones at the moment) about what happened to the dead before heaven was opened. What we now call hell is really a “Hades” or abode for the departed souls that had 2 distinct compartments seperate from the other. Those souls who were damned were sent to the compartment we would associate now with “hell” - a place for eternal punishment. The other compartment was as some have said “the bosom of Abraham” – a paradisaical place of peace and comfort. Those there had to wait for The Christ to instruct and enlightened them and sanctify them by His Word and for Him to open heaven to humanity. No beatitude with God was possible until Christ’s resurrection - human nature was simply too corrupt and incapable of intimate spiritual-beatitude with God until Jesus came to transform us and elevate our nature. It’s unclear if those waiting for Christ to open heaven had to spend some time in purgatory or were sanctified by Christ when He taught to them in the 3 days His body lay in the tomb.

I believe that Purgatory was opened or came into being as a result of God’s Mercy won by Christ. So now at death a soul: 1) immediately goes to heaven if saintly pure, or 2) to purgatory if having minor defects of small sins then on to heaven when purified, or 3) immediately to hell for eternal punishment if disgraced and guilty of grave sins.

James
 
Hi All,

“Waiting” in a timeless world does not have the same meaning as it might have on earth. Those who were saved before Christ were saved in view of his death and resurrection. They were not parked somewhere “waiting”. They were however aware of their unworthiness to enter heaven on their own merit and their dependence on the sacrifice of Christ. How all this worked in practice is not something that we can fully understand.

Verbum
 
Thank you so much for the detailed (and documented!) answers - this board is an amazing resource for the lazy scholar! 🙂
In pre-Christian days a soul was judged solely on its merits relative to The Law and on moral conscience for those who did not have The Law.
By “those who had The Law” do you mean the Jewish people?
 
Thank you so much for the detailed (and documented!) answers - this board is an amazing resource for the lazy scholar! 🙂

By “those who had The Law” do you mean the Jewish people?
Yes.
James
 
The nature of the thread question depends at least in part on three assumptions. One is that the use of the word “Christ” which used to be translated as “Healer,” and has other meanings, is correct in the Catholic usage. Second is that the meaning of “incarnation” in the Catholic usage is correct as applying only to the person of Jesus. Third is that “redemption” as understood by the Church is attributable as a distributive function over the idea “Man.”

There is much evidence that these three points are not correctly interpreted by the Church, which historically has denied its shenanigans in changing history and plagiarizing practices it turned into a manipulative and limited popular “theology.” The faithful will summarily dismiss such claims due to the habituated human mind’s inability to think outside an accepted and ingrained context. Nevertheless, it is so, and avid research will prove it on the part of the sincere inquirer who has no agenda of self-verification.

Even a superficial examination of the question itself tells us that it is based on a generality and semantic inconsistency and needs great clarification and definition. That is unlikely in this context as the last thing we tend to do is to examine the nature and way of how we acquire and maintain a belief in any area, least of all in religion.

It would be useful, therefore, to get a broader picture of the contexts such a question could evolve in, and inquire not only as to their internal validity, but their fit into the actuality of history and critical thought outside the self-verifying system of the Church itself. Though that system has been very successful in proposing an internally valid cannon, the same system has failed in consistently producing Good. Good, the outcome of Love, is not the province and never will be the province of religion, except by mistake of attributuon. If it were not so, only the members of X faith would experience good. Yet we know that that is not so. Similarly, “redemption” is not restricted, never was, and never will be, to the members of a particular faith or non-faith. Neither does its occurence depend on a person, but on a state. In the Catholic system that state might be called Grace, if it is loosed from its contextual limits.
 
What does the Catholic Church hold as to the destiny (heaven, hell, etc.) of those people who died before the time of Christ? I always assumed it would be the same as for those who lived during and after in a state of “invincible ignorance”, but given the necessity of Christ’s coming to earth I wonder if that’s incorrect…?
As DavidFilmer said, after the crucifixion when Jesus died, He descended into hell for the three days and rescued the just from hell. Jesus Christ came to save everyone, even those who had died before Him.
 
Hi All,

“Waiting” in a timeless world does not have the same meaning as it might have on earth. Those who were saved before Christ were saved in view of his death and resurrection. They were not parked somewhere “waiting”. They were however aware of their unworthiness to enter heaven on their own merit and their dependence on the sacrifice of Christ. How all this worked in practice is not something that we can fully understand.

Verbum
“Waiting” is just a term to make a point. Indeed, there is not “time” after death since space-time fabric does not hold true to spirits. However, I would like to emphasize however that God’s power and mercy is not limited by time and space. Hence, his mercy is applicable to all in all places and in all time (before or after Christ’s Passion and Ressurection).

The “descend” of Jesus to “hell” is therefore a “temporal” view of this application of Christ’s Infinite Merits to the sins of the previous generations who are supposed to be saved.
 
“Waiting” is just a term to make a point. Indeed, there is not “time” after death since space-time fabric does not hold true to spirits. However, I would like to emphasize however that God’s power and mercy is not limited by time and space. Hence, his mercy is applicable to all in all places and in all time (before or after Christ’s Passion and Ressurection).

The “descend” of Jesus to “hell” is therefore a “temporal” view of this application of Christ’s Infinite Merits to the sins of the previous generations who are supposed to be saved.
Well, the story of the Transfiguration indicates that Elijah and Moses appeared in all their glory, so one could suppose that there were some who were glorified in heaven before Christ’s crucifixon and death in time.

Detales was so limited in his statement that it made no sense at all to me as to what he was trying to express, except his disbelief. Maybe that is all he wished to express.:confused:
 
That would do, for a start, unless there is a deeper reading of that post, rwoe. Knowledge is a “way from belief.” Last tiem I checked, someone might “know” their faith, but faith per se is not knowing. Hence it is called that, or belief. At any rate, rather than baldly state certain things, I thought it might be, and actually am sure, that what I wrote is within the capability of the readers on here to at least make conjectures or reach conclusions of some significance.
 
We also have to remember that God is not on the same time-scale that we are on. In other-words “before” and “after” are not relative to Him because He lives outside of time. The best way that I understand it is to think that God is fair and loving. He knows who would accept and who would reject Christ and gives them such opportunity. Then He makes his judgments accordingly.
 
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