What happened to Catholic Knights and how do we get them back?

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And who are your “kids” as Catholic.?

I also heard police will shoot a teen holding a swiss army knife, and that also is a fact. Frankly, as an ex military myself, and if I were a policeman, I wouldn’t have minded to take my chances and disarm him in other ways. The bravery you speak of goes two ways. As I am about to do this, I would have had in the back of my mind a picture of some mother who has hope for the future, a mother who’s husband left her and left the raising of a son to her while she worked to raise him, at a time when the raising of sons is critical. I would have in my mind a young man, my brother, who right now is doing something foolish but doesn’t realize the impact of what he is doing. The point is “I”, at this moment, bound to live the days of Corinth, must make it possible for him to change his direction in the future. To a Catholic, regardless of vocation, the desire to orient change encompasses the probabilities of all concerned, the nation as well as the offender. We are commanded to hope under the new law, not the erroneous trust except for the trust of God only. 77 X 7 doesn’t imply that we trust, but in a hope that directs us to convey mercy so that he can have a hopeful next time.

But the demands on a police officer also entail consistency in the duties toward God firstly as it is to the nation. Crimes occur all around him in life. A day’s work rounding up criminals in events that make public notice surely must bring a self satisfaction to him for a job well done. The hard part has God waiting in the sidelines. The offenses committed while in the service is also another task he must zealously attend to, as this too is an attack on justice. An institution ripe with corruption should have our Knight crusading in less comfortable, politically correct domains of certain personal risk. His promise to ensure that teen has to his avail a system of untainted due process is also his duty; this too is mercy and ensuring his future. A person so afflicted knows he is not qualified as a Knight.

It should be remembered that the good we do is non effectual to the soul and renders it redundant if we do nothing to address the capital wrongs that come into our sphere of action or influence, or adhere to and propagate treasonous principles contrary to God’s morals, or commit wrongs that are directly imputed to us. If the Church teaches a nation that something is a sin, then our duty is to act and not find favor with the law the nation adopts. Doing nothing is not an option. A policeman can rack up a career of doing a good job, make it to commissioner, only to have it lost on his principles contrary to God’s morals. We cannot be partially Catholic.

The common good as it is defined in today’s no tolerance mentality is also taking a beating. This is due to the compounding effect of the acceptance of the mortal sins of capital punishment and abortion. It has an oxymoronoc aire about it in that “good and non tolerance” are somehow compatible. All good finds it’s source in God’s vast pool of available Good. The nation can tap into this pool for establishing a common good so that it can maintain order. No man who is inspired by a honed conscience can see this is unjust. The nation can only claim this privilege if itself is without taint. The caveat to the nation is that there must be an inherent connection between what is legislated, and to the end in which it desires to effect*. A nation who allows the abortion of infants assumes the position of a mistrust in God, is truant to the Teacher’s instructions, and implies that God is incapable in turning future events for the betterment of the now unhappy mother and her child. The Holy Spirit works on his own timetable, the nation’s mandate is to obey the Church and play it’s role so that He can through this sequence of events realize the better future for the child. Such a nation should withdraw it’s global military activities until it can settle it’s own conflict of conscience at home. Seldom is it found that a non virtuous nation can gain global respect either from God or his people.

One-upping God bodes nothing good. Same goes for capital punishment.
  • Conscience in Conflict, p36, Kenneth R. Overberg, S.J.
 
didn’t the Teutonic knights disband about 500 years ago when their leaders became protestant or something like that?
To tell you the truth, I don’t know much about them.:o

But from reading the wikipedia article: A Bailiwick of Teutonic Knights that became Protestant and the Teutonic knights were expelled from Prussia when their Grand Master converted to Lutheranism in 1525.

However, the Teutonic Knights continued to operate in other parts of Europe.

There are about 1,000 members of the Teutonic Knights today.

Here’s their website:

imperialteutonicorder.com/
 
In light of the tragedy in Newport: what happened to our REAL Catholic Knights and how do we get them back?

This isn’t just a “let’s muse about theological heady stuff” thread. I want to know for real: if I wanted to start a lay order of Catholic Knights - REAL knights - where would I start, who would I talk to, what sorts of things would they want to know.
😦
As a member of the Knights of Columbus I am a little offended that you don’t consider the Knights of Columbus to be “real” knights. I ask you if you can specify between Knights and “real” Knights by using the terms Chivalric Knights and Military Knights.

With that said, I agree it would be a good thing to prepare Catholic laymen to defend those who cannot defend themselves. I don’t think you would need to go through the Church to start such an organization. I don’t think the Church would encourage you, but it wouldn’t stop you if you started an independent organization. In other words, you’re better off starting a militia or security force that is influenced on the teachings of the Catholic Church, but not directly connected to the Church.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_order
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chivalric_order
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papal_Orders_of_Chivalry
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Catherine%27s_Academy
 
Learn martial arts. 🙂

There isn’t always going to be someone else around to help, and in most cases the damage will be done by the time the help arrives.
Agree. Buy a gun, learn how to use it in a defensive situation. Also expect that in defense of your family you might receive major trauma, so also learn how to treat it, especially heavy bleeding. Every household needs to keep some form of either QuickClot or Celox. And of course, know CPR.
You don’t need a gun either. One 12" throwing knife that hit a person anywhere is going to seriously impair the person ability to attack, even if for a few brief moments.
Absolutely wrong! Throwing a knife to take out a man with a gun works only in movies. I have trained for over 12 years with swords and with daggers and we have the saying “Don’t take a sword to a gun fight”. My martial arts teacher follows all of the reports of police being attacked by people with swords and in almost all cased that those people are filled with many bullets, a few were tasered. In defense of your family you might have to go against a gun while unarmed or armed only with a blade weapon but that is just to give your family a few seconds to escape. In general a blade weapon against a gun is suicidal.

Ran
 
As a Knight of Columbus, no offence taken at all, because you are indeed correct. 😉

However, Pope John Paul II did label us as “the strong right arm of the Church”, and for good reason. Not only do we have a very significant number of members, over 7 million, with the vast majority here in the US, the Knights of Columbus has done much good work in it’s 128 year history, such as supporting our priests, the Church and our own parishes where much of our good work can be seen. The amount of money raised and the volunteer man-hours we have put in for our Church is truly staggering. Much of our money also goes to the Holy Father and his causes.

But the most important work I believe we ever did was take on the KKK, the Whigs, the Know-Nothings and other anti-Catholic groups that painted Catholics as Romanists and Papists that never would make good citizens and would bring “their” country down. These groups were very successful, until the Knights of Columbus stepped in and fought fiercely with these groups defending the Church and it’s right to exist here and flourish. Yes, some of these battles were physical. So determined were these anti-Catholics, that without the Knight of Columbus stepping into the fray, I truly believe that Catholicism might not have survived here, and at least, would not have thrived as it has.

The Holy Fathers have seen our works close-up and personally over the course of our history, and understand our importance to the Holy Mother Church, the Papacy and to our Faith. So while it is true that K of C members are not truly knighted, as (name removed by moderator) has rightly noted, we have fought like Knights on nearly all the important issues facing Catholics both at home and abroad…
 
No worries. I know we’re considered a fraternal service organization. Although being “knighted” is debatable. The Knights of Columbus started in the United States which doesn’t recognize titles of nobility and royalty. This leaves the definition of knighted up for redefining in this country. And since there are so many of us it’s not practical for a cardinal or bishop to be knighting us. The Knights of Columbus are more knightly than most of those “knighted” by some official. We serve the poor, strengthen the community, and defend the Church, like in Mexico during the Cristero War.
:cool:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chivalric_order#Imitation_chivalric_orders
 
Hey,

I’m not an expert on the situation in the US, being a proud Birt :D, but I saw that someone said disarming law abiding citizens has ‘‘never worked.’’ I have to respectfully disagree. It works quite well in Britain. I have never met anyone with a gun, except pellet guns and things, and our normal police officers don’t carry firearms. Gun violence is much much lower per capita than in the USA. The main concern in the UK, even among gangs, is knife violence. Now I’m not saying American should have such staunch gun control, we have some of the toughest laws in the world, as our cultures and histories are different. For example we have no written constitution, any of our laws about guns can be overturned, amended etc with a simple Act of Parliament, but I just wanted to say gun control can work.

Also, about the whole Knights thing, wouldn’t national governments be a bit upset by an armed and trained militia loyal to someone else. I can see the secular media quickly branding it as a fundamentalist/extremist army.
 
Absolutely wrong! Throwing a knife to take out a man with a gun works only in movies.
Or if he is not looking at you. If someone is stupid enough to pull out a knife when someone has a gun, a gun wouldn’t help them anyway.
 
To tell you the truth, I don’t know much about them.:o

But from reading the wikipedia article: A Bailiwick of Teutonic Knights that became Protestant and the Teutonic knights were expelled from Prussia when their Grand Master converted to Lutheranism in 1525.

However, the Teutonic Knights continued to operate in other parts of Europe.

There are about 1,000 members of the Teutonic Knights today.

Here’s their website:

imperialteutonicorder.com/
hmm, quite fascinating it appears it was re-sanctioned in 1929 but now is only made up of priests and religious.
 
That is unfortunate (name removed by moderator), but understandable that you might take offence.

I do, and I know that each member of the Knights of Malta give far more than their fair share, and dare I say, more than most K of C members do. If all 7 million of our members were to give what each and every Knight of Malta does, we would be an unstoppable force for good!

Both organizations are different and unique, but both have important roles to play in our Church and we shouldn’t be in some sort of competition with one another. While our roles are different, we should both stand proudly for our accomplishments and we should both enhance the mission of one another instead of thinking that one might be better than another.

Certainly no offence should be given from one to another, and likely it wasn’t meant…🙂
 
Such Knighthoods, at least from Britain, are considered honourary so he won’t be refereed to as Sir or anything. But I think he is allowed to use the post-nominal letters. For example an American could be made an honourary Commander of the British Empire (one of the levels in the Order of the British Empire) so would be able to use CBE (in a similar fashion to PhD) but wouldn’t be called Sir X. So I’m not sure if you Americans would consider these men Knights?
 
wasn’t there a us secretary of the treasury that was a knight of Malta a few decades ago?
 
Calm down. I said most not all. Malta is one of the few cool ones. I looked into them a while back because they’re Catholic and they go way back.
 
Now you are putting words into my mouth. I expected a little more civility from a deacon. If you take the time to review the current orders on the list of chivalric orders you will find that most are orders of merit bestowed by national governments or monarchies and are more often secular in nature. They are merit awards similar to the Presidential Medal of Freedom, Kentucky Colonels and Nebraska Admirals. Chivalric orders are modeled after military orders which were Catholic societies dedicated to defending the faith. I was not referring to Papal Orders of Chivalry because they do defend the faith. Are the Knights of Columbus more knightly than most knighted orders? This is a rhetorical question since a response from you would probably be filled with straw men. The unequivocal answer is yes because the Knights of Columbus are dedicated to defending the faith and serving others as did the ancient knights. I hope this clarifies your misinterpretation of my opinion, the many definitions of knights, and the word most in reference to the overabundance of chivalric orders; and I hope I did not overstep my place in the Catholic Church by correcting a deacon. Good day, Sir.

Chivalric orders:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chivalric_order
 
  1. Knights were from medieval Europe, and the Knights Hospitaller would be a more appropriate class rather than the templars you mentioned.
so too answer your question i dont think it is a good idea too kill people or compare them to inferior moder units of your country who are not catholics.
 
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