What happened to Catholic schools?

[Cider]

What happened to Catholic schools? They started catering to non Catholics and hiring non Catholic staff.

 

[ajpirc]

What happened to Catholic schools? They started catering to non Catholics and hiring non Catholic staff.

There were a lot of non-Catholics in my Catholic school. The only reason it’s Catholic is because our Bishop says it can be called a Catholic school. Other than that, nothing really makes it feel Catholic.

 

[adstrinity]

Agree with Cider to an extent.

Basically, until the 1960s, sisters did teach at the schools. After the Council, when Catholics decided to use the Coucil for their own politics, sisters were either ushered out or fell away from the faith. Problem: Who’s going to teach our children if not the sisters? Solution: We will hire teachers.

So, that’s that. Before, what used to be done out of the love of God and obedience because of a vocation now needed to be done as a job. This is why Catholic schools had to close, because tuition went up to pay salaries…and it kept going up.

Catholic education isn’t as important as money. Simple.

 

[JimG]

I was raised by a really faithful Catholic family. We prayed the rosary together, went to confession once a month,were told about the real presence in the Eucharist and we knew about making sacrifices for God. We were all sent to Catholic schools.

I think that what happened is not all of the parents fault at least not my parents. They tried to do their best at teaching their six children but since they were paying a lot for our Catholic education they thought that we would learn all the Church teaches.

This did not happen. When I was in 3rd grade the religion books suddenly changed and there wasn’t any catechism. We just learned about love, peace and Jesus! It was 1967. Most of the nuns started wearing regular clothes, our priest took off with one of the nuns and they got married. My father was so upset about the new religion books that he went and talked to the pastor of our parish. Nothing changed. We made collages of people sharing all the way into high school. I do remember hearing about the sacraments but nothing about the mass, the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist, or the hard teachings of the Church in our Senior year marriage class. I left the Church at 18yrs. old along with all of my siblings. I am the only one who has returned to the Church so far.

I think many families can identify with your story. Parents of large families might not have noticed that there came a time when their younger children were suddenly not being taught their Faith as their older siblings had been.

Even my bishop once told us a similar story in a talk. He went to Catholic schools but had not the faintest idea of the meaning of the sacraments, the Eucharist, or a myriad other things, until he went to seminary! Suddenly, he was thinking, ‘oh, so that’s what we believe!’ All he learned of his faith in his Catholic schools were to draw pictures and posters, sing songs, and talk about love.

I’m happy to say he is now a great and orthodox bishop and the Catholic schools here are excellent.

 

[buffalo]

Agree with Cider to an extent.

Basically, until the 1960s, sisters did teach at the schools. After the Council, when Catholics decided to use the Coucil for their own politics, sisters were either ushered out or fell away from the faith. Problem: Who’s going to teach our children if not the sisters? Solution: We will hire teachers.

So, that’s that. Before, what used to be done out of the love of God and obedience because of a vocation now needed to be done as a job. This is why Catholic schools had to close, because tuition went up to pay salaries…and it kept going up.

Catholic education isn’t as important as money. Simple.

And why pay for watered down teachings in addition.

 

[ajpirc]

I’m happy to say he is now a great and orthodox bishop and the Catholic schools here are excellent.

This is who we need are bishops who see a problem in today’s Catholic schools and are willing to fix them.

 

[buffalo]

This is who we need are bishops who see a problem in today’s Catholic schools and are willing to fix them.

Model the Diocese of Wichita. Your kids go to school K-12 tuition free. How do they do it? Faith and love of children together with a strong faithful bishop.

 

[ajpirc]

Model the Diocese of Wichita. Your kids go to school K-12 tuition free. How do they do it? Faith and love of children together with a strong faithful bishop.

That’s how it was long ago because there were nuns. The nuns didn’t do it for a salary, they did it for the children out of the good in their hearts. If the nuns teaching don’t have to get paid, the Catholic schools don’t have to raise money for tuition. Nuns probably know the Catholic Faith more than lay teachers and will try to teach the children the Faith.

 

[edwest2]

I wonder if part of the problem hasn’t been size. Schools aren’t able or willing to stay fairly small. Or at one time they had many Catholic students, and now they have fewer.

Anyway, once you have a desire to attract a lot of non-Catholic students to fill up the school and pay the rent, you often end up making concessions.

We have two Catholic schools here: one is very small, and very Catholic. The other is more ecumenical - still giving good basic Christian teaching, but not so “Catholic”.

That being said - Catholic education wasn’t always great in the past either. People may have been taught more stridently, but they were not always taught accurately about their faith, or in a way that was really good for children.

I think a broad generalization needs to be supported by facts. I went to Catholic grade school and High School in the 1960s and early 1970s. Our education was exceptional. We had homework every day. We had an excellent series of Religion classes. I still have one of the books.

The answer is to contact your Diocese, politely and accurately point out the problems and state your desire that something should be done. In some cases, if no one complains then others think there is no problem. I encourage you to let them know.

Peace,
Ed

 

[Bluegoat]

I think a broad generalization needs to be supported by facts. I went to Catholic grade school and High School in the 1960s and early 1970s. Our education was exceptional. We had homework every day. We had an excellent series of Religion classes. I still have one of the books.

The answer is to contact your Diocese, politely and accurately point out the problems and state your desire that something should be done. In some cases, if no one complains then others think there is no problem. I encourage you to let them know.

Peace,
Ed

I didn’t make a broad generalization - then I would have said “it wasn’t good in the past” which is rather different than “it wasn’t always good”. In general it seems to have been more strict, as schools were in those days, but some were strict past the point where they ought to have been, and some sisters were unfortunately not very well educated about Catholicism, and kids learned some odd things about religion.

There isn’t much help in looking to the past as if it was always wonderful, and wondering why we can’t achieve that now. There were some good and bad schools, just like at the present time. The problems are different, but no time has all the answers.

 

[MarkThompson]

That’s how it was long ago because there were nuns. The nuns didn’t do it for a salary, they did it for the children out of the good in their hearts. If the nuns teaching don’t have to get paid, the Catholic schools don’t have to raise money for tuition. Nuns probably know the Catholic Faith more than lay teachers and will try to teach the children the Faith.

That is not really true, on both counts. Many Catholics schools did require parents to pay tuition, and Sisters and Brothers could expect to be paid a salary for teaching. See, for instance, here for some discussion.

 

[edwest2]

I didn’t make a broad generalization - then I would have said “it wasn’t good in the past” which is rather different than “it wasn’t always good”. In general it seems to have been more strict, as schools were in those days, but some were strict past the point where they ought to have been, and some sisters were unfortunately not very well educated about Catholicism, and kids learned some odd things about religion.

There isn’t much help in looking to the past as if it was always wonderful, and wondering why we can’t achieve that now. There were some good and bad schools, just like at the present time. The problems are different, but no time has all the answers.

“always wonderful” is a term I would never use. There is a great deal to be learned from the past, such as, Why is Catholic higher education in the state it’s in? Once we learn how and why things changed then we can, hopefully, avoid and correct similar things in the present.

catholichistory.net/Events/LandOLakesStatement.htm

Peace,
Ed

 

[ExLibris]

I can’t speak for Catholic schools outside of my town.

Locally, there’s been reported problems of the school’s faculty and staff unwilling to offend a growing number of non-Catholics with our infallible and most perfect doctrine.

So, I don’t know. I guess it might be a money thing.

 

[Murcury]

I can’t speak for Catholic schools outside of my town.

Locally, there’s been reported problems of the school’s faculty and staff unwilling to offend a growing number of non-Catholics with our infallible and most perfect doctrine.

So, I don’t know. I guess it might be a money thing.

The Parochial school I used to go to had a few non Catholics but that didn’t hamper their religion classes. In my high school, we have a number of non Catholics but it’s probably more the teacher’s fault for any flaws in the class rather than money. Catholic doctrine is being taught, but the books used are pretty disappointing. Maybe I just like deeper theology and religion than the surface stuff.

 

[Bluegoat]

The Parochial school I used to go to had a few non Catholics but that didn’t hamper their religion classes. In my high school, we have a number of non Catholics but it’s probably more the teacher’s fault for any flaws in the class rather than money. Catholic doctrine is being taught, but the books used are pretty disappointing. Maybe I just like deeper theology and religion than the surface stuff.

I don’t think it always has that effect. I know of some religious schools that stick strictly to their religious mission, despite students who are not part of that religion.

I think that perhaps when you have something like a big building, or debts though, it starts to get harder to ignore the possibility of attracting other paying families.

 

[MusherMaggie]

I think that the problems with Catholic schools come from the failure of the parents of being good Catholics. The family is the primary source of education for the children. The parents are supposed to be true role models for the religious development of the children. The parents are the ones supposed to held the Catholic schools accountable for the proper teachings. The parents are supposed to be involved with participation in Sunday catechetical activities and sacramental preparation too.Usually, but not always, if the kids do not know their religion and/or fall away from the Church you can find the source of the problems at home. When you see a Catholic school failing you can dig a little bit deeper and see that the parents are not really involved with their own religious development. I think that even among Catholics it is easier to delegate any form of teaching to the school instead of participating into the children lives. I also firmly believe that adults cannot be parents to their children alone but they have an obligation to support those families that have limited means in educating their own children. I have seen a few parents taking their children away from public religious education because they did not like the system. A true Catholic should not pull back but stand firm for the good of the children through a charitable participation in the parochial education system.

Very well put!!

 

[sedonaman]

What happened to Catholic schools? Feminist nuns ruined them.

amazon.com/Sisters-Crisis-Unraveling-Religious-Communities/dp/0879736550/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1309448810&sr=1-1

 

[ajpirc]

Feminist nuns ruined them.

How did they impact the schools?

 

[jwder09]

“The Parochial school I used to go to had a few non Catholics but that didn’t hamper their religion classes. In my high school, we have a number of non Catholics but it’s probably more the teacher’s fault for any flaws in the class rather than money. Catholic doctrine is being taught, but the books used are pretty disappointing. Maybe I just like deeper theology and religion than the surface stuff.”

I believe it may extend beyond the teachers. Recently, I attended an open house at one of the two Catholic schools in my area. I was shocked to find that the pre-kindergarten teacher had posted the protestant version of the Ten Commandments. I went to the school library and verified what I had seen, and presented my findings to the nun running the open house. She made up an excuse about there being no Catholic book store, presumable from which to buy a copy, in the area. She then told me not to worry, the Commandments weren’t taught in pre k. All of this told me that this was permitted by the school adminstration. I have no problem with a protestant teaching my daughter her ABCs; but, the atmosphere seemed to have had a subversive element in it. Although regretable, I did not see fit to enroll my daughter at this school.

 

[TimothyH]

All the good Catholic Schools moved south, along with all the good Catholics.

jwder09, I’m sorry you have had a bad experience with schools in your diocese (Savannah?). But that is not my experienc here in Suburban Atlanta.

Seriously, all the Catholics who used to sit in the pews in Michigan and Massachusets didn’t just fall off the face of the earth and they didn’t all leave the Church for atheism as the media would like us to believe. Catholicism is booming in the deep south. The Archdiocese of Atlanta ordained fifteen deacons last year, 2015 went through the Rite of Election this past Easter. We have three going to seminary and two going to the convent from my parish and some diocese in the deep south cannot build schools fast enough. My children attended a school staffed by four fully habited and fifteen decade rosary equipped Dominican Sisters of St. Cecilia. The kids all genuflect when the pass the chapel in the school, I can tell you that for sure.

This is not an isolated instance either. Greenville SC, Birmingham AL, Charlston SC, Atlanta, and many of the smaller cities in the south are growing Catholic centers.

So ya’ll come down. Seriously.

-Tim-