What if a couple disagrees on more kids?

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Congratulations, but it’s not for me. And I have yet to meet a military wife with more than 3 or 4 kids. So I don’t see this “many many MANY” you speak of, but that’s not the point.

And I really don’t appreciate your condescending tone regarding a decision/compromise that my husband and I made together. Not all of us can do well with 8 kids under these types of circumstances. I sacrificed for him and he sacrificed for me so that we’d both be healthy and happy. :mad:
We’ve been active duty for 10+ years now. He is Army. Maybe Air Force is different. Maybe you will meet more people in time.

I don’t think you MUST or even SHOULD have a large family, I just think no one should use children as bargaining chips at any time for any reason. If you don’t want a big family that is between you and God, but kids, born or future, should never used to make compromises. They are deserving of much more than that.
 

What – you don’t think a woman/wife – has the capacity on her own – to come to know the truth. Again you are thinking of women/wives – as if they are children – that need the direction of an adult to know the truth.
Women are not children. Women and men both need to be taught truth by other people during their life. Of course women can come to know the truth outside of their husband. If you are just going to intepret everything I say through a lens then you will continue to mis-understand what i am trying to say.
 
I agree. Men are still more likely to cheat on their wife, but with more examples like the show “Sex in the city” the trend is moving in the other direction. But when you pull back the layers is it possible that you will find that the husband was left prone to tempation by his wife becasue of the way she treated him? Now that does not excuse him in any way of giving into the temptation and he alone is responsbile before God for his sin. However, is part of the responsiblity of a wife to protect the husband from adulterous tempations?
But you say, the husband is the boss, the leader who must lead his wife so using your own arguements, the wife is not responsible for anything and certainly not for protecting him.
 

What – you don’t think a woman/wife – has the capacity on her own – to come to know the truth. Again you are thinking of women/wives – as if they are children – that need the direction of an adult to know the truth.
This is something which Casti Connubii explicitly warns against, not only the idea that women should be treated like minors, but the idea that the reason for the teaching of the authority of the husband over the wife has anything to do with a deficiency in women’s intellect or reasoning powers. Anyone who believes that is thinking contrary to official Catholic teaching.
 
And as a military wife with 8 kids I can tell you many many MANY of us do this. The average family size at our current base is 4 children, but I know many of us with 6+ kids. That is not a good example of compromise at all, and what’s more it is sad that it would even be thought of to do that to your spouse
Actually that’s a perfect compromise. A married couple needs to be able to sit down and discuss honestly what they want in life, what steps they can take to achieve that, and what they are and are not equipped to deal with as individuals. It sounds like they did that, and that she was upfront about her limitations. Frankly just because some people can stay home and raise a lot of kids in that situation does not mean that everyone can. She is not doing anything to her spouse, they are working out their lives together.
 
The funny thing is that at the same time that I got that response from that poster, another poster sent me a PM saying this in response to my same post:

"I just read this and wanted to say congratulations for your husband getting accepted as a pilot. And thanks to your husband (and you!) for choosing to serve our country. My oldest son is in the Air Force. You as his wife and your family (and future family) have already made sacrifices and will be more making sacrifices, so I just wanted to write a little note to say thanks.

Welcome to the Air Force family!"

You win some you lose some. 🤷
Some get it right.👍
 
But you say, the husband is the boss, the leader who must lead his wife so using your own arguements, the wife is not responsible for anything and certainly not for protecting him.
Just becasue the husband is the head of the home does not mean that God does not hold the wife accountable for her actions. The husband is responsible for his actions and to some extent the actions of his wife. But the wife is repsonsible for her actions before God. To not respect your husband or put him into the a place of tempation is something God will hold the wife responsible for.
 
We’ve been active duty for 10+ years now. He is Army. Maybe Air Force is different. Maybe you will meet more people in time.

I don’t think you MUST or even SHOULD have a large family, I just think no one should use children as bargaining chips at any time for any reason. If you don’t want a big family that is between you and God, but kids, born or future, should never used to make compromises. They are deserving of much more than that.
I don’t think we saw them as “bargain chips.” :confused:

As BEL said, we compromised and talked about our limitations. If he had been a pharmacist, for example, we’d probably end up having more kids. But he didn’t want to be a pharmacist, he wanted to be an AF pilot. So in the situation we are in with his career choice, I personally don’t think I can handle a lot. Not sure how that translates to me not giving our future kids what they deserve.
 
Yes, A man should not have to earn respect. The world says you need to earn respect. God says I respect you despite your sinfulness. Of course men should never check out and give up otherwise they would not be following the example of Jesus. However, if a man does fall short that is no exuse for the wife to not respect her husband as much is it is possible for her to do.
Let’s define “respect” here, because it can mean both to treat someone with the dignity due to a human being, regardless of how they act–of course, that kind does not have to be earned–and it can also mean to show deference to merit, and it can mean other things.

Should a husband respect his wife? What kind of respect is he entitled to that she is not entitled to and that he ought not have to merit? If you are saying that a wife ought to have the respect due her office and a husband ought to have the respect due to his office–similar to the respect that a member of the clergy ought to have among the faithful, regardless of his merit or fidelity, or that is due to a judge or a governor or a president–I can live with that.

If you think that both a bad or arrogant husband and a bad or arrogant member of the clergy ought to be treated exactly the same as their virtuous and faithful counterparts, that is something else again. I think that there is respect and especially trust that both a pastor and a husband do not deserve if their actions and attitude towards those they lead do not warrant it. There is also cooperation that neither a pastor nor a husband can demand, not just in theory but especially in practice. Your pastor can tell you all about this!! Christian leadership is not the bishop dictating to the priests with no care about their concerns, it is not the pastor dictating to the parish with no care about their concerns, and it is not husbands being dictators to their wives, with no care about their concerns, as if the bishops’ priests, the priests’ parishioners, and the husbands’ wives were children or chattel or mere employees.

No, the bishop and the pastor and the husband must lead in the knowledge that their leadership will be judged by the standards laid down by Christ. The bishop, the pastor, and the husband must work to come to know the needs of those he leads, and must lead as a servant of the servants of God. Also, just as the Prophet Nathan confronted and admonished his king, David, without usurping the kingship himself, just so might priests and parishioners and wives are not only allowed but duty-bound to confront and admonish someone who is betraying both God and those they lead by a self-centered or arrogant mode of leadership.

When the wife is put into the situation of the Prophet Nathan, but unlike King David her husband will not repent, she has to do the best she can to provide leadership to her family that is according to God’s heart. If a husband and wife are arguing and digging their heels in over a question that could go either way, that is not good. Someone needs to give in, and it does not always need to be the wife. It needs to be whoever it needs to be, so that the marriage is put first. That is the course of fidelity.
This is what I see too. I see many young men trampled on and publically disrespected while young wives stamp their feet and whine if things aren’t going their way. I see women who are waited on hand and foot while they trash talk their husbands. I see moms talk bad about dad to the kids and undermine his authority over his own children. Men are potrayed as stupid and chauvinistic. In past generations I saw women disrespected and put down, but the pendulum has swung too far in the opposite direction. That is what’s wrong
Let us remember that we do not ever see everything that has gone on in a marriage, let alone in a courtship. Still, there is no excuse for adults to act like that towards anyone, but least of all towards their spouses. That is so plainly outside a life of Christian virtue as to be beyond relevance in a discussion such as this. Let us restrict ourselves to the example of two Christians spouses with very different views on the capacity their family has to welcome more children. I think that is what the OP was asking about, and we are digressing from that question.
 
This is something which Casti Connubii explicitly warns against, not only the idea that women should be treated like minors, but the idea that the reason for the teaching of the authority of the husband over the wife has anything to do with a deficiency in women’s intellect or reasoning powers. Anyone who believes that is thinking contrary to official Catholic teaching.
👍
 
Just becasue the husband is the head of the home does not mean that God does not hold the wife accountable for her actions. The husband is responsible for his actions and to some extent the actions of his wife. But the wife is repsonsible for her actions before God. To not respect your husband or put him into the a place of tempation is something God will hold the wife responsible for.
You can’t have it both ways. Further, wives deserve respect too, they deserve to be treated as partners in a marriage with God given brains and abilities.
 
So when a woman cheats, it is her fault.
And when a man cheats, it is his wife’s fault, at least partly.

That is interesting calculus you got there.

There is no way that a woman can protect her husband from temptation to adultery. To imply that she has that ability or responsibility is adding insult to injury.
No if a women cheats then it could be connected to the lack of love by the husband.
 
No if a women cheats then is partly her husbands fault.
This is plainly against Church teaching. We are all each responsible for our own actions. A husband does not bear any guilt for the his wife’s sin of adultery. A wife does not bear any guilt for the husband’s sin of adultery. We are supposed to help each other bear our burdens, but we are not guilty for the sins of others. If my husband cheated on me, I would not be guilty, even in the smallest fraction, of adultery.
 
No if a women cheats then is partly her husbands fault.
Nope. I took vows regarding my own personal behavior on my wedding day. In those vows I promised to be faithful through everything no matter what those circumstances. If I violate those vows that I freely took knowing full well what they meant than that is completely on me, not my husband.
 
In a similar way, when you pull back the layers of a wife cheating you can find that the wife was left prone to temptation because of the way she was treated by her husband. This goes both ways.
I 100% agree!
 
Nope. I took vows regarding my own personal behavior on my wedding day. In those vows I promised to be faithful through everything no matter what those circumstances. If I violate those vows that I freely took knowing full well what they meant than that is completely on me, not my husband.
Hey, BlueEyedLady, did you have your wedding already? I missed that. I knew you were engaged. Congratulations! Welcome to married life. All the best wishes to you and your husband.🙂
 
This is plainly against Church teaching. We are all each responsible for our own actions. A husband does not bear any guilt for the his wife’s sin of adultery. A wife does not bear any guilt for the husband’s sin of adultery. We are supposed to help each other bear our burdens, but we are not guilty for the sins of others. If my husband cheated on me, I would not be guilty, even in the smallest fraction, of adultery./QUOTE

My point is the one sin (not respecting your husband or wife) can add fuel to other sins (adultery). Instead of trying to lay blame I think couples should first ask what they did wrong before they point out the mistakes of their spouse.
 
My point is the one sin (not respecting your husband or wife) can add fuel to other sins (adultery). Instead of trying to lay blame I think couples should first ask what they did wrong before they point out the mistakes of their spouse.
So if my husband hits me should my thought process be “what did I do wrong??” :confused:
 
mommamaree;11050953:
This is plainly against Church teaching. We are all each responsible for our own actions. A husband does not bear any guilt for the his wife’s sin of adultery. A wife does not bear any guilt for the husband’s sin of adultery. We are supposed to help each other bear our burdens, but we are not guilty for the sins of others. If my husband cheated on me, I would not be guilty, even in the smallest fraction, of adultery.
If my husband cheats I’m going to lay blame. And I’ll do so very loudly and very quickly. Whatever mistakes I may have made do not compare to infidelity.
 
Women are not children. Women and men both need to be taught truth by other people during their life. Of course women can come to know the truth outside of their husband. If you are just going to intepret everything I say through a lens then you will continue to mis-understand me.
Paul Fekete:
I agree! The husband needs to lead his wife as best he can with where she is at and not try to force her to be somewhere else.** Just like how Jesus leads us to his truth over time a husband should lead his wife towards truth over time.**
The trend I see is that many men bail out when their wives resist their Spiritual leading which is wrong and not being like Jesus.

Hey – you are the one who put it out there – in just that way. Furthermore – you are implying that a woman who does not follow your contrary to Church teaching --“line of thinking”-- is responsible for the bad deeds of the husband.

Well – I’d say —what is truely un-Godly – is for a man to use God as a tool – to impose power/control/domination over a woman/wife.
 
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