What if the gates of hell were opened and the damned were gotten into heaven?

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No impure thing shall enter.
The gates of hell are closed on the inside.
God is just and anyone in the end who persists in rejecting God will end up in hell.

My recent thinking, from earthly observations, has been even if the damned were somehow forced into heaven, they will not get heaven and thus unable to enjoy it. Just as an unchaste person never gets true love and intimacy, a murderer never values life, etc.
 
Given enough time, and no restraint, they’d turn heaven into hell.
 
The damned are in hell because of their pride and unwillingness to recognise and submit to a higher authority. They choose of their own free will to live for themselves, succumb to the lust for power and delight in being masters of their own destiny. They exist in “splendid” isolation because that is the only way in which they can express themselves with unrivalled freedom from “interference”. They derive great pleasure from rejecting the sovereignty of God and worshipping themselves but their pleasure brings them torment because they are never satisfied. Their obsession with themselves makes them incapable of escaping from themselves and sharing their life with others. The more freedom they have the more they want. The vicious spiral of selfishness and evil leads to a form of insanity in which they become incapable of loving anyone but themselves.

The only way in which the damned could escape from hell is to identify themselves with others. Only then would they cease to be slaves to themselves. The truth makes us free - and the truth is that we did not create ourselves. We are liberated by adoring our Creator in heaven, loving His children on earth… and having compassion for those in hell…
 
The damned are in hell because of their pride and unwillingness to recognise and submit to a higher authority. They choose of their own free will to live for themselves, succumb to the lust for power and delight in being masters of their own destiny. They exist in “splendid” isolation because that is the only way in which they can express themselves with unrivalled freedom from “interference”. They derive great pleasure from rejecting the sovereignty of God and worshipping themselves but their pleasure brings them torment because they are never satisfied. Their obsession with themselves makes them incapable of escaping from themselves and sharing their life with others. The more freedom they have the more they want. The vicious spiral of selfishness and evil leads to a form of insanity in which they become incapable of loving anyone but themselves.

The only way in which the damned could escape from hell is to identify themselves with others. Only then would they cease to be slaves to themselves. The truth makes us free - and the truth is that we did not create ourselves. We are liberated by adoring our Creator in heaven, loving His children on earth… and having compassion for those in hell…
Tonyrey - wow. You said it all in 2 paragraphs. You should start a blog.
 
How does anyone know whether they are in Hell or not? Has anyone died, gone there, and come back to tell about it? How does anyone know that God has not forgiven them? After all, the Bible does say forgive 70 X 7 times.
 
How does anyone know whether they are in Hell or not?
Has anyone died, gone there, and come back to tell about it?
We don’t have to go to Hell to know what it’s like! Isn’t there enough evidence in this world of unnecessary misery and suffering caused by selfishness, greed and the lust for power? The difference is that very often it is the innocent who suffer here and the guilty go unpunished. But ultimately every vice brings its own punishment. If you love yourself more than others you alienate them and isolate yourself. No one wants to live with an egoist. Jesus told us that “The first shall be last and the last first…” Pride is the high road to hell…
How does anyone know that God has not forgiven them? After all, the Bible does say forgive 70 X 7 times.
God cannot forgive if His forgiveness is rejected. It is like having the door slammed in our face. He tells us to forgive so that we may be forgiven. His mercy and justice are seen in the fact that He forgives us to the exact extent that we forgive others. The ball is in our court…
But from one point of view we get more than we deserve because no one deserves to share life with God in heaven. That is a completely free gift from the One who loves us far more than we love ourselves…
 
Some questions about Hell seem relevant here.

1] What qualifies you for it? Rejecting God - well very few people do.Many people either do not think he exists and so is not there to be rejected or are not sure if he exists or not. And so do they go to Hell because they are not very good at Philosophy and have made a mistake when looking at the evidence?

Or have they gone to Hell because they did not have Faith. But if this is believing when the evidence is not sufficient - why is lack of Faith a sin?

Or is it because they are totally selfsih? But is anyone so?

Most people who go to Hell it would seem are not totally selfish or knowingly rejecting God.

2] A person in Hell would realise their mistake and repent. Why would God not accept their repentence? It is very arbitrary and not at all loving to not forgive after the death of the body.

3] If Hell is God’s punishment for sin it is quite disproportionate to make it everlasting.

4] God offers us his love and tries to get us to return to him while we are in this life - so why not in the next.

The whole idea of Hell does not square with a good God.
 
@Laurie
You are thinking of this in Human terms. We really dont know how the next life is going to be and how we feel. Our minds can not comprehend what is in store for us. Once you see God and all his glory and still reject him, you will never be forgiven.
Pax
 
Some questions about Hell seem relevant here.

1] What qualifies you for it? Rejecting God - well very few people do.Many people either do not think he exists and so is not there to be rejected or are not sure if he exists or not. And so do they go to Hell because they are not very good at Philosophy and have made a mistake when looking at the evidence?

Or have they gone to Hell because they did not have Faith. But if this is believing when the evidence is not sufficient - why is lack of Faith a sin?

Or is it because they are totally selfsih? But is anyone so?

Most people who go to Hell it would seem are not totally selfish or knowingly rejecting God.

2] A person in Hell would realise their mistake and repent. Why would God not accept their repentence? It is very arbitrary and not at all loving to not forgive after the death of the body.

3] If Hell is God’s punishment for sin it is quite disproportionate to make it everlasting.

4] God offers us his love and tries to get us to return to him while we are in this life - so why not in the next.

The whole idea of Hell does not square with a good God.
If you know all this now can’t you avoid the anxiety.
 
Some questions about Hell seem relevant here.

1] What qualifies you for it? Rejecting God - well very few people do.Many people either do not think he exists and so is not there to be rejected or are not sure if he exists or not. And so do they go to Hell because they are not very good at Philosophy and have made a mistake when looking at the evidence?

Or have they gone to Hell because they did not have Faith. But if this is believing when the evidence is not sufficient - why is lack of Faith a sin?

Or is it because they are totally selfsih? But is anyone so?

Most people who go to Hell it would seem are not totally selfish or knowingly rejecting God.

2] A person in Hell would realise their mistake and repent. Why would God not accept their repentence? It is very arbitrary and not at all loving to not forgive after the death of the body.

3] If Hell is God’s punishment for sin it is quite disproportionate to make it everlasting.

4] God offers us his love and tries to get us to return to him while we are in this life - so why not in the next.

The whole idea of Hell does not square with a good God.
Thought provoking questions, Laurie! Please let me ask you this: Why do you believe (3) to be true? In what way is the punishment disproportionate?
 
Thanks for comments - let me respond.

CATHOLIC GUY - you say;
*Once you see God and all his glory and still reject him, you will never be forgiven. *

My point is that nobody seeing God as he is would reject him - hence nobody in Hell

THING

Yes if an individual knows God now he will avoid the anxiety of a possible Hell. But my questions are about people who honestly do not think there is a God…

SPOCKY PERSON

Hell is supposed to be 100% awful and everlasting. It is hard to think of anything that merits such a punishment. I may not be a very good person and I may not think that the evidence merits belief in God but I cannot think this merits an eternity of agony!

A fixed term punishment or anihilation would be more proportionate.
 
From earthly observations, there are consequences that are life altering, lasting to the end of one’s life/existence. If by my choice I jump from a building, I am not coming back. So it is not inconceivable that in the world to come there will be lasting consequences. It is the same God who made both worlds. And he has warned us.

Where we end up in the world to come (which starts after death), depends purely on our choice. If we die choosing God, then it will be heaven for us immediately or via purgatory. If we die rejecting God (choosing self or some other ‘god’), then we get ‘not God’ and with that all that is not God which is misery and due punishment (our wages).

We were given free will not to choose between good and evil but to choose Good freely (that’s why God is the thrice Holy God and Mary the Immaculate).

God would not be Good if he were not Just.

Michelle Arnold put it well in a post here: if good people get bad here, why shouldn’t bad people get bad in the world to come? Right now things do not seem righted (God being patient that we be saved and come to the full knowledge of the truth), then everything will be righted and will be seen righted to the everlasting Glory of God. Actually it is now that people say why does a Good God allow…then it will be all clear.

I think that if we end up in hell, one worm that never dies will be the regret that God (made man Jesus) had obtained for us overabundant graces to reach our goal but through our own fault, we forfeited it. Using another human example, think of a man or woman who out of ‘who knows what’ ruin/alter forever their marriage.

In hell, I will have no one to blame but myself and I will weep and gnash my teeth.
 

SPOCKY PERSON

Hell is supposed to be 100% awful and everlasting. It is hard to think of anything that merits such a punishment. I may not be a very good person and I may not think that the evidence merits belief in God but I cannot think this merits an eternity of agony!

A fixed term punishment or anihilation would be more proportionate.
Laurie:

Thank you for replying. Perhaps a fixed term of punishment would be appropriate; but is such possible? You see, you and I don’t really know what it is like in eternity. Maybe our choices there are more–well, eternal and permanent? For example, angels exist in eternity, and the Bible appears to teach that when a third of them made the decision to rebel against God, there was no turning back. They have no opportunity to repent, perhaps because repentance is impossible in eternity.

Also, annihilation might appear good to you and me, but is it good to God? God creates; the Devil destroys. To destroy the eternal souls He creates would be to make Him less like God and more like the anti-God. Annihilation might not be an option for the Creator and giver of eternal life.

Let’s say, then–just for grins-- that (1) once in Hell, it is impossible to leave, and (2) God cannot end the spiritual life He creates. Let’s also say that it is true that (3) God is merciful to everyone, including those in Hell. Can you then think of a way to reconcile these three ideas? Can you imagine of any state of existence in Hell that would be in keeping with the possibilities and the character of God? That is, is there any possible way that Hell can be, and yet God is not a monster?
 
Hello FMS

The problem is that very few people indeed reject God in the sense that they think there is a good God etc and who nevertheless choose to oppose him.

They may not think he exists or they may not be sure he exists.
Or they may ignore him or go against some of his commandments.
None of this ammounts to a 100% conscious rejection which might merit Hell.

Or let’s talk morality. Nobody is completely good though Christians and many non-Christians try. But nobody is 100% bad either. Only the latter - if there are - any merit Hell.

Anyone in Hell would repent. They would surely say, “I see now that there is an eternal loving God who made me so that I could not be truly happy save in his presence. I see now and bitterly regret my rejection of this God when I was on earth. Holy Mother and all the Saints pray for me. Lord forgive me and answer my prayers” Nobody would want to continue in a situation that they now clearly see is horrible. They might unwittingly have chosen to go there when they were on earth but now, in agony they would repent of their choice. And God would answer them!
 
One sentence answer to question posed by Mr Spock,

No, Captain - it would not be logical.

Laurie
 
One sentence answer to question posed by Mr Spock,

No, Captain - it would not be logical.

Laurie
Then, if there is no mercy in Hell, either God is not merciful to all, or there is no Hell. Sorry to ask you to do this, Laurie, but I promise to join you: Which cup shall we drink to find the logical consequences of such poison of sweetness? Shall we swallow the idea that God is not merciful to the damned? or shall we drink a toast to the annihilation of Hell?

http://roflrazzi.files.wordpress.com/2009/12/129061021672469600.jpg
 
Thanks for comments - let me respond.

CATHOLIC GUY - you say;
*Once you see God and all his glory and still reject him, you will never be forgiven. *

My point is that nobody seeing God as he is would reject him - hence nobody in Hell

THING

Yes if an individual knows God now he will avoid the anxiety of a possible Hell. But my questions are about people who honestly do not think there is a God…
Why would such people ask themselves about hell if they do not think about it. When the thought comes to the person about hell the solution comes also. A person is not condemned because of their ignorance, but because of their conscious rejection of what they know and understand is good.
SPOCKY PERSON

Hell is supposed to be 100% awful and everlasting. It is hard to think of anything that merits such a punishment. I may not be a very good person and I may not think that the evidence merits belief in God but I cannot think this merits an eternity of agony!

A fixed term punishment or anihilation would be more proportionate.
A scenario;
I think you are thinking and talking about hell in the way we think of things in this world. One significant difference with life in an eternal afterlife is the absence of time. If I enter into the afterlife at 4pm, time stops for me there. I do not say to myself, well it must be nearly 5pm now; 4pm is the very same as 5pm when in eternity.
When a person is in hell they do not experience their eternity as a passage of time stretching on into infinity. They experience it as the ever present ‘now’ event. It does not seem long, or indeed any time at all for them, they are always ‘in the moment’.
The difference between heaven and hell is only in qualitative terms. Both are ever present in the eternal moment ‘now’, but where those in heaven experience Gods qualities, those in hell experience the quality of Gods enemy.
Where those in heaven experience their vista ever increasing as they explore the infinite realm of God, those in hell experience the opposite, an experience of ever constricting circumstance.
They may find themselves in the dark, and in the same moment, because there is no time, the next experience may be a further constriction of their worldview by means of, lets say, a malevolent sense in the darkness, constricting further as cold and discomfort are felt, constricting further as sounds disturbing are heard, constricting again as disturbed voices are heard close to, constricting further as they find themselves in a claustrophobic tunnel with one exit smaller still, through less welcoming substances, water, fire, creatures, or anything which feeds on the paranoia which now controls their minds. There is no time, no perception of time, only worse and worse situations in the ‘now’.
At the lowest level of hell one may envisage the most constricting of circumstance. One may lie face down in the hot empty comfortless sand with a sense of your enemy behind you, you cannot turn to see you are so constricted now you are virtually paralyzed. Fire burns within you and comes through your flesh drying you with its heat but never consuming you. But bad as these constricting circumstances are there is still room for ever more, even as you become aware of the worst of your place ,now a burning rock lands next to your face and every ounce of strength and suffering is squeezed out of you as you try as you might to move your arm to move the rock which is offending you with its heat in your face.
So hell gets worse and worse without an experience of a longer and longer term. Those in hell are ever present in the eternal now, trapped in dark hell by their own paranoid minds. A paranoia which cannot accept anything not even the help of an angel of heaven.
 
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