What if your pastor announced that from now on all new altar servers will be girls?

[fix]

All lay functions are open to all Catholics in good standing, both male and female. Yes, that’s “from Rome.”

No, the trend started before permission was given.

From the point of view of liturgical law, an official interpretation of Canon 230, Paragraph 2, of the Code of Canon law on the possibility of delegating certain liturgical offices led to a 1994 letter from the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Sacraments clarifying that girls may serve at the altar. But bishops are not bound to permit them to do so, nor could the episcopal conference limit the bishop’s faculty to decide for himself.

A further clarifying letter published in 2001 said priests are not compelled to have girls serve at the altar, even when their bishops grant permission.

The 1994 letter states: “It will always be very appropriate to follow the noble tradition of having boys serve at the altar. As is well known, this has led to a reassuring development of priestly vocations. Thus the obligation to support such groups of altar boys will always continue.”

The letter also recommends to bishops to consider “among other things the sensibilities of the faithful, the reasons which would motivate such permission and the different liturgical settings and congregations which gather for the Holy Mass.”

Therefore the Holy See’s recommendation is to retain as far as possible the custom of having only boys as servers. But it leaves to the bishop the choice of permitting women and girls for a good reason and to the pastor of each parish the decision as to whether to act on the bishop’s permission…

zenit.org/article-9302?l=english

Hardly something that shouts Rome was eager to change things.

 

[Beautiful]

I think it is accepted females were used before permission was granted. Again, a political move. The Vatican has said specifically males are to be encouraged must I conclude the Pope bases this on a yellow fading memory?

Some have and will use it as a political move but not all. Only God knows the hearts of those who desire to serve.

Males encouraged? Sure and wisely so at a time of transition. Encouraged - yes- but the whole matter should not be at whimsical discretion of various priests who decide to exclude females. Uniformity - not division is necessary at this time and all time.

 

[fix]

Some have and will use it as a political move but not all. Only God knows the hearts of those who desire to serve.

Males encouraged? Sure and wisely so at a time of transition. Encouraged - yes- but the whole matter should not be at whimsical discretion of various priests excluding females. Uniformity - not division is necessary at this time and all time.

Rome says otherwise. You make my point for me.

 

[Daprato]

This is the same guy who told the Communists where to go, told off the Chinese government, sat Fidel Castro down for a good talking-to, and gave Bishop Oscar Romero what-for, right?

I seriously doubt that he “caved in” to a bunch of little girls.

I think the fact that he said, “yes” to female altar servers means that he considered their argument, and found it to be a good one. Which is a lot different than “caving in.”

All you offer is personal conjecture. I stated I did not know why the change. However it’s clear that if he “considered their (whose?) argument, and found it to be a good one” that he would have done a far better job of communicating it.

 

[Beautiful]

Rome says otherwise. You make my point for me.

The only point I make here is that female altar servers are in and are going to stay. Making it a variable choice among priests only creates division. Is that the point you trying to make?

 

[mlchance]

I think the fact that he said, “yes” to female altar servers means that he considered their argument, and found it to be a good one. Which is a lot different than “caving in.”

That depends on whether you like the answer.

How many parishes do you know have only boy altar boys?

By definition, an altar boy is a boy. The answer to your question is, “Every parish that has altar boys has only boys as altar boys.”



– Mark L. Chance.

 

[AJV]

All lay functions are open to all Catholics in good standing, both male and female. Yes, that’s “from Rome.”

Not fully…instituted lectors and acolytes (if there are any outside seminaries) are not ranked among the clergy but the cannot be women. And even so, it depends upon the bishop- I know certain places where women are not allowed to be EMHC’s though they can be readers

 

[Beautiful]

No, the trend started before permission was given.

trend : follow a general course

God gave females permission to love and serve long before writing utensils were thought of or used by most. God wants ALL to love and serve him.

I’m finally going to vote in the poll I set up. I’m going to vote ‘opposed’ because I believe both males and females can serve God. I’d be shocked and then saddened if my parish priest eliminated male servers.

 

[adrift]

At my parish we had one altar girl who was seated stared at the communicants.
Recently I watched as the poor priest waited for the altar girl crawl around a chair. I don’t know what was going on but you should have seen that poor priest face. She was looking for something under that chair. All that could be seen of her was the back end good thing it was well covered He finally just skipped the hand washing:shrug: I never saw such a thing before.
Last Sunday the Altar servers at the church I was visiting were adults a man and a woman. Although with the women on the altar I kept thinking about the recent sacrilegious event. They were very respectful and was really beautiful. I liked them better than the children.

 

[Sarabande]

My thoughts on this tend to change. When they first permitted female altar servers, I was a teenager and was very disconcerted seeing girls in the robes. To me at that time, they looked like girls dressed in male drag - only because I was used to seeing only males in robes and vestments. (Although when I see female pastors of other denominations, they still look like females dressed in male drag. - I can’t help it. I try very hard not to think.)

I remember these old ladies in our choir admonished me for expressing my opinion on female altar servers when our church started allowing the female altar servers back in high school. They were lauding this new “breakthrough” for female equality, etc. and thought I’d get on track because I was a teenager girl. Anyway, I wasn’t even rude about it - only saying how I found it disconcerting and that it would be hard to get used to. I consider myself pretty middle-of-the-road. They then went on this angry, political track, political correctness and how my opinion as a young lady was wrong. How could I even think against female altar servers? All the years of women fighting for equal rights, etc. I should be ashamed of myself, yadda, yadda. Yikes!!! I didn’t even think of this as an equal rights, democratic thing. I just knew it was going to take a while to get used to it. I didn’t think the Church was a democracy. But, I kept my mouth shut, mainly out of shock, out of respect of my elders, and because I didn’t know enough about politics and the Church at that time to want to get into some sort of calm debate, as those women already had the claws out ready to chew up and spit out anyone who would say say something negative regarding female altar servers.

Anyway, after that long narrative history, I am more used to seeing them and it doesn’t bother me either way. I’ve found that the female altar servers at the churches I’ve attended are just as attentive as the male altar servers. But, I’ve always found that those old ladies and many women/men I’ve met who were of that same mind, were such turn-offs because they turned it into a political, equal rights issue - and not about the faith and the Church and how the Church works in terms of her rules and laws. It doesn’t work like our US Constitution, as much as those people would like to make it so.

To answer the OP’s question, I would have to ask the pastor if he was given permission/authority to make a decision like that. If the Church actually said that no parishes would be permitted to have male altar servers (which I highly doubt would happen) then I’d obey the Church. If one pastor got it into his head to make up a rule like that, I would question him about it and make sure he wasn’t doing it for a political reason and statement, but an actual theological and faithfilled reason.

 

[NewUlm1976_2000]

Other, this is never going to happen so why waste a thread on it. Boys will never be excluded from being alter servers. They should both equally have that option.

 

[fix]

The only point I make here is that female altar servers are in and are going to stay. Making it a variable choice among priests only creates division. Is that the point you trying to make?

My point is Rome has said what the criteria must be. Whether female servers are here to stay is a separate issue.

 

[fix]

trend : follow a general course

Great. Now, a trend may be good or bad.

God gave females permission to love and serve long before writing utensils were thought of or used by most. God wants ALL to love and serve him.

Great. Does that reasoning mean we decide which Church laws to follow?

I’m finally going to vote in the poll I set up. I’m going to vote ‘opposed’ because I believe both males and females can serve God. I’d be shocked and then saddened if my parish priest eliminated male servers.

They cannot eliminate male servers as far as I am aware. My point in this discussion is that we tend to look at this thing in terms of political power rather than authentic service.

Note the use of the term discrimination and the like.

 

[jmcrae]

Not fully…instituted lectors and acolytes (if there are any outside seminaries) are not ranked among the clergy but the cannot be women.

Because they are Seminarians. Even though Seminarians are lay people, they are preparing to become priests, and obviously women cannot prepare to become priests.

And even so, it depends upon the bishop- I know certain places where women are not allowed to be EMHC’s though they can be readers

Yes, but their choice to do this does not have any impact on the rest of the Church, which permits all lay people to participate in every kind of lay service.

The local Bishop can establish local age and gender restrictions, but that doesn’t affect the Diocese next over - they make their own rules, within the same parameter of every lay person can do every lay action.

The local Bishop could also decide that only lay females over the age of 65 and under age 90 can carry the candles; it does not take away from the fact that the Church as a whole permits any lay person in the Church to do that task - if the Diocese next over decides to restrict it to boys under the age of 10, that’s their business.

 

[Beautiful]

My point in this discussion is that we tend to look at this thing in terms of political power rather than authentic service.

Note the use of the term discrimination and the like.

When I read these many quotations from various saints – both men and woman alike - I sense that they equally desire, serve, love and adore God but of course only God knows the intentions of each individual as they attempt to know, love and serve God.

In the end there can never be a written formula made by human hands and minds that can ever measure the response of humans to Divine Love. Only The Greatest Love can distinguish love’s intention.

“There is a school in Heaven, and there one has only to learn how to love. The school is in the Cenacle; the Teacher is Jesus; the matter taught is His Flesh and His Blood,”

• St. Gemma Galgani

I don’t believe this school in Heaven is segregated

Segregated: restricted to members of one group or one race by a policy of segregation

 

[fix]

When I read these many quotations from various saints – both men and woman alike - I sense that they equally desire, serve, love and adore God but of course only God knows the intentions of each individual as they attempt to know, love and serve God.

In the end there can never be a written formula made by human hands and minds that can ever measure the response of humans to Divine Love. Only The Greatest Love can distinguish love’s intention.

I don’t believe this school in Heaven is segregated

Segregated: restricted to members of one group or one race by a policy of segregation

The Pope is Christ’s vicar on earth. He is the authority. Which saint denies this?

 

[Beautiful]

The Pope is Christ’s vicar on earth. He is the authority. Which saint denies this?

No saint denies this.
If our Pope Benedict should withdraw female altar servers all faithful Catholics should humbly obey.

Currently the word from the Vatican sends mixed messages and confusion. I don’t like confusion and division. The word should state clearly if females are ‘in’ or ‘out’ of lay service.

Eliminating female altar servers would also mean elimination of female Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion, cantors and lectors. Don’t they serve on the altar as well?

No – I don’t foresee our Pope withdrawing female altar servers in the near future. To do so would be like shackling the hand that rocks the cradle. The cradle can contain both male and female babies. Madres everywhere don’t want shackles.

 

[GregoryPalamas]

O dear, I misread the question. I voted incorrectly. I couldn’t believe that anyone would contemplate such a foolish idea. When men can carry babies to term then girls can serve at the altar.

CDL

 

[Beautiful]

When men can carry babies to term then girls can serve at the altar.

CDL

Women have already built a fire. They understand the cold. Women will not stand in the cold again.

 

[fix]

No saint denies this.
If our Pope Benedict should withdraw female altar servers all faithful Catholics should humbly obey.

Currently the word from the Vatican sends mixed messages and confusion. I don’t like confusion and division. The word should state clearly if females are ‘in’ or ‘out’ of lay service.

But, Rome has said the bishop and pastor may decide. How is that confusing?

Eliminating female altar servers would also mean elimination of female Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion, cantors and lectors. Don’t they serve on the altar as well?

Aagin, those decisions are made by the proper authority.

No – I don’t foresee our Pope withdrawing female altar servers in the near future. To do so would be like shackling the hand that rocks the cradle. The cradle can contain both male and female babies. Madres everywhere don’t want shackles.

Aagin, I am sorry but this seems like nothing more than political power issues.