What is sin, really?

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First, I do not intend, on this thread, to speak of specific sins, except as examples. Rather, I want to discuss the concept of Sin altogether.

I have been reflecting on this question. Why is something sinful and something else not?

Why is it sinful to kill a person, but not sinful to kill an animal for food?

Why is it sinful to look at a naked person with lust and not sinful to enjoy the beauty of a sunset?

In considering this, I find I am coming to the conclusion, though not a firm one, that sin is really about self-control and self-discipline. Controlling our passions and impulses and being at peace internally. Thus, anything that is bad for us mentally and spiritually is sinful. Anything that is neutral or good for us mentally or spiritually is not sinful.

A person who sins infrequently is often a very calm and peaceful person. They are in control of their passions and thoughts. They are disciplined in their conduct and calm in their demeanor. They have a high degree of inner peace.

Those who sin frequently, or even habitually (e.g. sex addicts, alcoholics, etc.) lack this self control to a degree. They periodically lose control of an impulse and they sin. This brings a degree of inner turmoil as their conscience is affected.

Masturbation, for example, is very sinful because it skews our view of the gift of sex.

Enjoying a sunset is not sinful because it helps us to be calm and can lead us to ponder about the wonders of God’s creation.

We all know that sin separates us from God. We also know that sin offends God. But why?

Taking this concept that something is sinful because it is bad for us further, we can answer the above questions.

God loves us so much that He does not want us to harm ourselves. And when we do harm ourselves (sin), it offends Him.

Imagine a mother watching a child hurt himself. That may be a tiny sliver of a picture of how God feels when we sin.

Or am I totally off my rocker.
 
This is about half of sin (conceptually speaking), I am thinking, the other half being obstinacy, pride.
 
What sin is, in my opinion, is failure to obey God.

God has given us commandments. Solely because of who He is, he deserves and should always get our obedience.

As to why he has given commandments about some things being sinful and not others, part of the answer is because He said so. He is God and we have no right to demand an explanation of Him (I.E. Job). His telling us what we must do is sufficient.

However, God in His graciousness has chosen to explain some of His reasons. One of them is what you have alluded to, because it’s for our benefit. We really harm ourselves with sin. If not at first, later. It also can drive us completely from Him, and man’s heart was made to enjoy a relationship with God. It cannot rest until it rests in Him. Therefore, God tells us what to avoid if we wish to have a relationship with Him.

Many sins also involve us wanting to have improper control of creation to the detriment of others. Others are like us wanting to be God even though we are not. We are thus competing with God instead of having a relationship with Him.

In conclusion, I don’t think you are off your rocker.
 
I think you’re on the right track, though what you mention about self-control and self-discipline would fall under the cardinal virtue of temperance. But there are three other cardinal virtues, against which we can sin, as well: prudence, justice, and fortitude. So there are other ways to sin other than by lack of self-discipline.

We can also sin against the theological virtues: faith, hope, and charity.

And you can approach the concept of sin by analyzing the seven capital sins: pride, lust, anger, envy, gluttony, greed, and sloth.

The classical definition of sin is “missing the mark.” What is the mark? It has to do with our human nature, which gives rise to the natural law theory in ethics. If we act contrary to our nature, we hurt ourselves. If we try to fly by leaping off a building, we will suffer the consequences. So, too, if we try to get pleasure in a disordered way, for example by masturbation, we will suffer the consequences (not just spiritually, but psychologically as well). You are definitely right when you say that sin is what harms us.

If you want to go into this more, I suggest that you read the moral theology of St. Thomas Aquinas in the Summa Theologiae. It is available online, and there are commentaries and summaries of it, as well (for example, Fr. Walter Farrell’s “Companion to the Summa”, also available online). Good authors to start with on this would be Ralph McInerny, Servais Pinckaers, Romanus Cessario, and Josef Pieper.

In particular, you could also check out the following books by Pieper:

The Concept of Sin
The Four Cardinal Virtues
Faith, Hope, Love

You are on the right track. I hope this helps! God bless…
 
Yes, thank you. I see your point.

So in addition to self control and self-discipline, I would add humility.

I believe all sin can be described as going against one of these to our spiritual or mental harm.
 
“So in addition to self control and self-discipline, I would add humility.
I believe all sin can be described as going against one of these to our spiritual or mental harm.”

You’ve made a good start, but sin is just not that simple. For example, self-discipline without temperance can lead to scrupulosity; humility without fortitude can become self-hatred; self-control without charity can become the kind of rigidity that drives people away, and even excludes God.

Satan is cunning, baffling, and powerful. If sin were easy to define, it would be easy to avoid. Ask anyone who is trying to lead a holy life!

That is why we have been given so many tools, starting with the Ten Commandments. Add in what JW mentioned: the cardinal and theological virtues, and the “seven deadlies.”

And of course, we have the example of our Lord’s life on earth, and the lives of the saints.

If St. Thomas Aquinas is a bit too heavy for you, try reading “The Story of a Soul” by St. Therese of Lisieux. She was a good-hearted girl who only wanted to serve God, and she still struggled with sin. It’s a good read and not depressing. Another good book is “Theology For Beginners” by Frank Sheed. It’s very well written. (I have ADD, and my eyes don’t glaze over when I read it, if you get my drift.)

And there’s always 1 Cor 13, which is where the 3 theological virtues came from. St. Paul’s description of love/charity… which of us can say we live up to it 24/7? And it comforts me so to hear him say we can’t understand it all down here on Earth. That quiets my mind when it gets to gnawing on things.

It occurs to me that you may not have a Bible handy, so here it is:

1 If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 If I give away all I have, and if I deliver my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.
Code: 
 **4** Love is patient and kind; love is not jealous or boastful; **5** it is not arrogant or rude. Love does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; **6** it does not rejoice at wrong, but rejoices in the right. **7** Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. 

 **8** Love never ends; as for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away. **9** For our knowledge is imperfect and our prophecy is imperfect; **10** but when the perfect comes, the imperfect will pass away. **11** When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child; when I became a man, I gave up childish ways. **12** For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall understand fully, even as I have been fully understood. **13** So faith, hope, love abide, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
1 Cor 13:1-13 (RSV)

Ruthie
 
“So in addition to self control and self-discipline, I would add humility.
I believe all sin can be described as going against one of these to our spiritual or mental harm.”

You’ve made a good start, but sin is just not that simple. For example, self-discipline without temperance can lead to scrupulosity; humility without fortitude can become self-hatred; self-control without charity can become the kind of rigidity that drives people away, and even excludes God.

Satan is cunning, baffling, and powerful. If sin were easy to define, it would be easy to avoid. Ask anyone who is trying to lead a holy life!

That is why we have been given so many tools, starting with the Ten Commandments. Add in what JW mentioned: the cardinal and theological virtues, and the “seven deadlies.”

And of course, we have the example of our Lord’s life on earth, and the lives of the saints.

If St. Thomas Aquinas is a bit too heavy for you, try reading “The Story of a Soul” by St. Therese of Lisieux. She was a good-hearted girl who only wanted to serve God, and she still struggled with sin. It’s a good read and not depressing. Another good book is “Theology For Beginners” by Frank Sheed. It’s very well written. (I have ADD, and my eyes don’t glaze over when I read it, if you get my drift.)

And there’s always 1 Cor 13, which is where the 3 theological virtues came from. St. Paul’s description of love/charity… which of us can say we live up to it 24/7? And it comforts me so to hear him say we can’t understand it all down here on Earth. That quiets my mind when it gets to gnawing on things.

It occurs to me that you may not have a Bible handy, so here it is:

1 If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3 If I give away all I have, and if I deliver my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.
Code: 
 **4** Love is patient and kind; love is not jealous or boastful; **5** it is not arrogant or rude. Love does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; **6** it does not rejoice at wrong, but rejoices in the right. **7** Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. 

 **8** Love never ends; as for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away. **9** For our knowledge is imperfect and our prophecy is imperfect; **10** but when the perfect comes, the imperfect will pass away. **11** When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child; when I became a man, I gave up childish ways. **12** For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall understand fully, even as I have been fully understood. **13** So faith, hope, love abide, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
1 Cor 13:1-13 (RSV)

Ruthie
 
How does masturbation skew our view of sex…it’s not sex. It’s exercising your palm (writing doesn’t do justice!)
 
Ruthie said:
“So in addition to self control and self-discipline, I would add humility.
I believe all sin can be described as going against one of these to our spiritual or mental harm.”

You’ve made a good start, but sin is just not that simple. For example, self-discipline without temperance can lead to scrupulosity; humility without fortitude can become self-hatred; self-control without charity can become the kind of rigidity that drives people away, and even excludes God.

Satan is cunning, baffling, and powerful. If sin were easy to define, it would be easy to avoid. Ask anyone who is trying to lead a holy life!

That is why we have been given so many tools, starting with the Ten Commandments. Add in what JW mentioned: the cardinal and theological virtues, and the “seven deadlies.”

And of course, we have the example of our Lord’s life on earth, and the lives of the saints.

If St. Thomas Aquinas is a bit too heavy for you, try reading “The Story of a Soul” by St. Therese of Lisieux. She was a good-hearted girl who only wanted to serve God, and she still struggled with sin. It’s a good read and not depressing. Another good book is “Theology For Beginners” by Frank Sheed. It’s very well written. (I have ADD, and my eyes don’t glaze over when I read it, if you get my drift.)

And there’s always 1 Cor 13, which is where the 3 theological virtues came from. St. Paul’s description of love/charity… which of us can say we live up to it 24/7? And it comforts me so to hear him say we can’t understand it all down here on Earth. That quiets my mind when it gets to gnawing on things.
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Thank you Ruthie. Much to ponder.

I have, by the way, read all the books you suggested. Though I have not gotten very far with Summa Theologea, only the first two volumes.

Being an engineer, I have this tendency to try to boil things down to the very essence. That is why I am trying to figure out why some things are sinful and others are not.

Defining something as sinful cannot be arbitrary. I am trying to discern the criteria. Once I have a good understanding of that, I think it will help me (name removed by moderator)rove my moral decision making as well as being able to better explain why something like murder or eating too much cake can be sinful.
 
rpp said:
In considering this, I find I am coming to the conclusion, though not a firm one, that sin is really about self-control and self-discipline. Controlling our passions and impulses and being at peace internally. Thus, anything that is bad for us mentally and spiritually is sinful. Anything that is neutral or good for us mentally or spiritually is not sinful.

A person who sins infrequently is often a very calm and peaceful person. They are in control of their passions and thoughts. They are disciplined in their conduct and calm in their demeanor. They have a high degree of inner peace.
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This comes close to saying that sin and virtue are about you. They are not.

This is the moral life:
To love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your mind, all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself. To sin, then, is to do otherwise.

Do you see, then, that virtue starts with realizing that your life is not about you? It is not about learning to make your life easy, like getting a boat through the rapids straight instead of sideways, or making yourself strong, so you can run about instead of dragging yourself through the dust. It is about conforming yourself to the law of love…and this is not a law of feeling, but a law of action.

Self-control and discipline are required of a person pursuing virtue because one cannot hand over to God that which is controlled by sin. You must not just avoid doing this thing or that thing. It is not about following the correct algorithm. It is about living a life. To live at all, you must love. To love is an action, and action requires that you are able to do that which you set out to do.

So why does virtue make a person peaceful, joyful, and so on? Because virtue, that is love, is precisely what you were made for. You are a vessel, a emptiness shaped by God to be a particular expression of Himself. You were made to know, love, and serve God, and you were made this way by the Author of all knowledge, all love, all service, all life. You were made in the image and likeness of God in order to willingly be filled with and to share directly in the very life of God Himself–which, I may add, is the only life that there is. All else is emptiness, nothingness, frustration, despair, and death.

Virtue is not about what you do. It is really not about you at all. It is about Who God is, and about ordering yourself accordingly.
 
rpp said:
First, I do not intend, on this thread, to speak of specific sins, except as examples. Rather, I want to discuss the concept of Sin altogether.

I have been reflecting on this question. Why is something sinful and something else not?

Why is it sinful to kill a person, but not sinful to kill an animal for food?

Why is it sinful to look at a naked person with lust and not sinful to enjoy the beauty of a sunset?

In considering this, I find I am coming to the conclusion, though not a firm one, that sin is really about self-control and self-discipline. Controlling our passions and impulses and being at peace internally. Thus, anything that is bad for us mentally and spiritually is sinful. Anything that is neutral or good for us mentally or spiritually is not sinful.

A person who sins infrequently is often a very calm and peaceful person. They are in control of their passions and thoughts. They are disciplined in their conduct and calm in their demeanor. They have a high degree of inner peace.

Those who sin frequently, or even habitually (e.g. sex addicts, alcoholics, etc.) lack this self control to a degree. They periodically lose control of an impulse and they sin. This brings a degree of inner turmoil as their conscience is affected.

Masturbation, for example, is very sinful because it skews our view of the gift of sex.

Enjoying a sunset is not sinful because it helps us to be calm and can lead us to ponder about the wonders of God’s creation.

We all know that sin separates us from God. We also know that sin offends God. But why?

Taking this concept that something is sinful because it is bad for us further, we can answer the above questions.

God loves us so much that He does not want us to harm ourselves. And when we do harm ourselves (sin), it offends Him.

Imagine a mother watching a child hurt himself. That may be a tiny sliver of a picture of how God feels when we sin.

Or am I totally off my rocker.
Click to expand...
Sin is rejecting God’s love.
 
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