What is the biggest dispute?

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Roblox84

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What are the roots of the dispute between Protestants and Catholics? Did it all start from the fact that Protestants believe when Christ gave authority to Peter, he also gave everyone in the world authority to interpret scripture and receive priestly powers and Catholics believe this power is only given to the Apostles? Or is it that protestants believe that everybody who believes in Christ is called the “church” and everyone in these so called “churches” receives higher powers?
 
Roblox84 said:
What are the roots of the dispute between Protestants and Catholics? Did it all start from the fact that Protestants believe when Christ gave authority to Peter, he also gave everyone in the world authority to interpret scripture and receive priestly powers and Catholics believe this power is only given to the Apostles? Or is it that protestants believe that everybody who believes in Christ is called the “church” and everyone in these so called “churches” receives higher powers?
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From a Lutheran perspective, Rob. Neither of the above answers would be a satisfactory explanation for the disagreement. Fundamentally, it is the issue over the basis or grounds upon which a man is righteous before the sight of God. In addition, the means or instrument by which man receives this righteousness. Are there authority issues involved? Certainly. However, much stems from that one disagreement.

To address what you raised, however, Christ did not give everyone the authority to interpret Scripture. Not everyone is a biblical exegete, scholar, or theologian. Higher powers? Well, every Christian receives the same priesthood, but not every Christian has the authority of a pastor.
 
Bluegoat said:
Which Protestants? Which Reformation?
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The ones that interpret scripture against tradition, self ordain. Basically the ones that changed most of the teachings or interpretations that were from the early times of Christianity.
 
Roblox84 said:
The ones that interpret scripture against tradition, self ordain. Basically the ones that changed most of the teachings or interpretations that were from the early times of Christianity.
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There is the Lutheran Reformation, the English Reformation, the Radical Reformation… the answer will depend on which group of people you are talking about. These were all separate groups with their own theological or political complaints.
 
Bluegoat said:
There is the Lutheran Reformation, the English Reformation, the Radical Reformation… the answer will depend on which group of people you are talking about. These were all separate groups with their own theological or political complaints.
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I guess I wasn’t aware that some Protestants also consider St.Peter was the head of the Church.
 
TriuneUnity said:
From a Lutheran perspective, Rob. Neither of the above answers would be a satisfactory explanation for the disagreement. Fundamentally, it is the issue over the basis or grounds upon which a man is righteous before the sight of God. In addition, the means or instrument by which man receives this righteousness. Are there authority issues involved? Certainly. However, much stems from that one disagreement.

To address what you raised, however, Christ did not give everyone the authority to interpret Scripture. Not everyone is a biblical exegete, scholar, or theologian. Higher powers? Well, every Christian receives the same priesthood, but not every Christian has the authority of a pastor.
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I completely agree with this post, even though I am not Lutheran.
 
Roblox84 said:
I guess I wasn’t aware that some Protestants also consider St.Peter was the head of the Church.
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Most Protestants, like most Catholics, believe that Jesus is the head of the Church.

More Protestants than you think are in agreement about the primacy of the Apostolic See. They have issues with its supremacy, which is a somewhat different thing. And you’ll find that most of the disagreement about the Papacy centers around whether the supreme authority of the Pontiff is an esse or merely a bene esse.
 
Palaeologos said:
Most Protestants, like most Catholics, believe that Jesus is the head of the Church.

More Protestants than you think are in agreement about the primacy of the Apostolic See. They have issues with its supremacy, which is a somewhat different thing. And you’ll find that most of the disagreement about the Papacy centers around whether the supreme authority of the Pontiff is an esse or merely a bene esse.
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I meant more of a decision maker rather then the actual head.
 
Palaeologos said:
Most Protestants, like most Catholics, believe that Jesus is the head of the Church.

More Protestants than you think are in agreement about the primacy of the Apostolic See. They have issues with its supremacy, which is a somewhat different thing. And you’ll find that most of the disagreement about the Papacy centers around whether the supreme authority of the Pontiff is an esse or merely a bene esse.
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Could you explain what esse and bene esse mean please? Thanks!
 
TriuneUnity said:
To address what you raised, however, Christ did not give everyone the authority to interpret Scripture. Not everyone is a biblical exegete, scholar, or theologian.
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Wouldn’t this then mean that the Church was established by him to do so?
 
T_More said:
Wouldn’t this then mean that the Church was established by him to do so?
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Yes. However, it does not fall to a caste system within the church to be the sole arbiters of interpretation and doctrinal decision. The Church does not equal the clergy. Even allowing that there is a central hierarchy within the church that interprets Scripture, it must still be held accountable to Scripture without any deviation thereof, nor must it be infallible to do so.
 
To whom did He give the authority and how do you gauge a credible authority?
TriuneUnity said:
To address what you raised, however, Christ did not give everyone the authority to interpret Scripture. Not everyone is a biblical exegete, scholar, or theologian. Higher powers? Well, every Christian receives the same priesthood, but not every Christian has the authority of a pastor.
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gurneyhalleck1 said:
To whom did He give the authority and how do you gauge a credible authority?
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Let me restate what I typed earlier, because it may have come across wrong. What I meant by that is that Christ did not give everyone the authority to interpret and apply Scripture to forming doctrine within the Church. He gave this role to pastors and teachers.(Eph. 4:11-12).

When the Holy Spirit calls someone to faith, He likewise calls that person to serve in the congregation of the faithful (2 Tim. 3:16-17). Personal interpretation, as defined by modern adherents of the more aptly titled solo scriptura view, hold to interpreting Scripure apart from the community of the faithful. However, God’s peopl meditate on Scripture together (1 Tim. 4:13). In view of this, that community then confesses its faith corporately.
 
Gotcha. Now I understand your context. But what happens when the “community” of the faithful turns apostate and liberal? In the ELCA the majority of the community has gone loony with ordaining practicing homosexuals, women pastors, and abortion and other things are becoming common place values. How does one trust the community made up of fallible people who will interpret and spin the Scriptures to fit the current agenda and the secular age they live in? I’m reminded of GK Chesterton’s statement that the Catholic Church is the only thing that keeps a man from becoming a child of his own age. The Episcopalians, ELCA Lutherans, some liberal Methodists, and several other formerly “mainline” Protestant groups have fallen in this direction…children of their age…
TriuneUnity said:
Let me restate what I typed earlier, because it may have come across wrong. What I meant by that is that Christ did not give everyone the authority to interpret and apply Scripture to forming doctrine within the Church. He gave this role to pastors and teachers.(Eph. 4:11-12).

When the Holy Spirit calls someone to faith, He likewise calls that person to serve in the congregation of the faithful (2 Tim. 3:16-17). Personal interpretation, as defined by modern adherents of the more aptly titled solo scriptura view, hold to interpreting Scripure apart from the community of the faithful. However, God’s peopl meditate on Scripture together (1 Tim. 4:13). In view of this, that community then confesses its faith corporately.
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gurneyhalleck1 said:
Gotcha. Now I understand your context. But what happens when the “community” of the faithful turns apostate and liberal? In the ELCA the majority of the community has gone loony with ordaining practicing homosexuals, women pastors, and abortion and other things are becoming common place values. How does one trust the community made up of fallible people who will interpret and spin the Scriptures to fit the current agenda and the secular age they live in? I’m reminded of GK Chesterton’s statement that the Catholic Church is the only thing that keeps a man from becoming a child of his own age. The Episcopalians, ELCA Lutherans, some liberal Methodists, and several other formerly “mainline” Protestant groups have fallen in this direction…children of their age…
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Well, let me ask you a question, gurney. When it comes to the mainline groups, like the ELCA or PCUSA, that adopted the liberal and apostate positions you described… does it take an infallible church body to say “wait a minute, what about 1 Corinthians 6:9?” You have to remember when it comes to “churches” like that, they begin with the presupposition that Scripture is not the infallible, inerrant word of God. They believe it to be a fully human document that is a product of its time, yet is full of pithy moral lessons and social activism. So how can they even seriously figure into the debate of proper, apostolic interpretation, when they don’t even believe that the prophets and apostles actually revealed anything through it?
 
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