What is the cause of poor catechesis?

[Tis_Bearself]

I must have had the weirdest mid-late 70s Catholic education ever.

We used the Baltimore Catechism (updated version, but still, Baltimore Catechism in the standard format) to prepare for First Communion and Confirmation. My biggest complaint with it was we didn’t get all the way through the books. But it was used.

We, and a lot of other Catholic high schools, had Latin classes up through at least the early 80s when I graduated. They were well attended by numerous kids who were thinking of going into medicine or law or some other super scholarly thing. I know this because we had intra-school language competitions which I was in and there were a reasonable number of Latin competitors, especially boys. We probably had at least 15-20 students taking 4 years of it at my girls’ school. The Latin Club booth was also very popular on club day at school when each club would have a booth. We wore togas and it was the John Belushi Toga Party era, need I say more?

 

[glencor63]

I should have studied the Roman-Catholic faith more in depth before converting. The Catholic Church has much to offer. I’ve grown tremendously over the decades, but it’s become clear that my worldview is more Protestant than Catholic. I thought I could reconcile myself to the teachings of the Church, but what I need and what the Catholic Church deems most important is in conflict. Hindsight is 20/20, unfortunately. I’ll start visiting other denominations.

 

[edwest211]

These academic standards did not drop by themselves, they were manipulated by people.

 

[1ke]

I’ll start visiting other denominations.

You are planted in the firm soil of the truth. Don’t leave it for the rocky soil, you will whither and die.

Do the hard work you accuse others of not doing and study the faith!

 

[glencor63]

I’ve studied the faith, but I no longer want my faith walk to be soley focused on sacraments and the Eucharist. Scripture is very important to me. I want a faith that has a high view of scripture. When all else fades away, God’s word remains. The sacraments could cease tomorrow, but God’s word will never pass away.

 

[1ke]

I’ve studied the faith, but I no longer want my faith walk to be soley focuses on sacraments and the Eucharist.

No one said that our faith walk is solely focused on the sacraments.

Scripture is very important to me.

As it should be to all Catholics. The Liturgy is filled with it, we are called to study it, and to preach and teach what has been passed down in Divine Revelation, the Church even offers an indulgence for scripture reading.

Although I’m not currently doing so, I led a bible study for over 10 years at my parish. Study of the Bible and the faith are indeed important.

There is no conflict with being Catholic and reading and studying Scripture.

I want a faith that has a high view of scripture.

That would be the Church— from whence scripture comes.

When all else fades away, God’s word remains.

Hmmm, that is sort of an odd sentiment. Divine Revelation - both Scripture and Tradition are given by God to the Church.

When all else passes away, God remains. And the people of God united to him in the Beatific Vision: the Church Triumphant.

The sacraments could cease tomorrow,

The sacraments will not cease, what an odd idea. Christ is with us always, even unto the end of the age. The sacraments flow from Christ to us for our benefit. God ordained it thus.

but God’s word will never pass away.

God’s word is not meant to be isolated from his Church.

 

[fide]

The first step should be (IMHO) catechizing the Catholic adults who do show up for Mass. The vast majority of them, anyway. By any means necessary they need to become convinced that they need formation in the Faith. Once formed, once the life of holy grace begins to grow in them, and approach maturity, the Holy Spirit will awaken and warm the heart of Christ in them, and effective reaching out - evangelization - can and will begin.

This whole decaying culture continues on a path of “dumbing down”, and the sleepy Church has not seen this same demonic work within her own body. She must awaken, to ever attain her vocation - but so far she continues taking her ease, seeing no “problem” - when there is already a grave crisis - within the gates.

 

[glencor63]

The Church deems the sacraments, especially the Eucharist to be the source and summit of our faith. Scripture is not given equal weight. My faith is both. I shouldn’t have to choose between scripture or sacraments. That’s like choosing between seeing or hearing.

 

[edwest211]

What do you want the Church to do? Will you contact the Vatican?

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Seems like your catechesis has now failed you yourself, OP.

Hope you find your way back to what is truly important, which is the Eucharist and sacraments.

 

[fide]

You will have great difficulty growing in the truth of Holy Scripture outside of the one true Church, the Catholic Church. Every non-Catholic Scripture study that you can find will eventually have to bend the truth of Scripture to fit their own faulty theology - which must, after all, justify their divisions that have fractured the one faith and the One Church. There IS only One, in Truth. Read Jn 17 - Jesus prayed:

Joh 17:20 "I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word,
Joh 17:21 that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:22 The glory which thou hast given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one,
Joh 17:23 I in them and thou in me, that they may become perfectly one, so that the world may know that thou hast sent me and hast loved them even as thou hast loved me.

There must be One Faith! And there is, in Truth, only One. God has led you to her; do not fall away.

 

[1ke]

My faith is both. I shouldn’t have to choose between scripture or sacraments.

The Church isn’t asking you to choose. It isn’t either/or.

 

[PetraG]

These academic standards did not drop by themselves, they were manipulated by people.

They were manipulated by people who thought memorization wasn’t an education. I see their point–I do remember the parrot-like nature things could seem to have–but they threw the baby out with the bathwater. Nobody wants to live in a concrete home with no windows and no light and nothing soft but memorizing a very concrete version of the faith can provide what a concrete foundation provides to a home. It isn’t the whole building, but it has a very vital place in making the building last through the storms.

 

[glencor63]

My faith is VERY important to me. I can defend it from scripture AND sacred tradition. I don’t take an either or approach. I believe in the true presence in the Eucharist. I believe in sacramental grace. I also highly esteem scripture. Why choose between them? They are equally important, however scripture goes with you everywhere. There may come a time when the sacraments are unavailable. There may not be any priests, but Jesus is our eternal high priest. His word remains when all else passes away.

 

[fide]

Here are some teachings from the Catechism:

Perseverance in faith
162 Faith is an entirely free gift that God makes to man. We can lose this priceless gift, as St. Paul indicated to St. Timothy: “Wage the good warfare, holding faith and a good conscience. By rejecting conscience, certain persons have made shipwreck of their faith.”<1 Tim 1:18-19> To live, grow and persevere in the faith until the end we must nourish it with the word of God; we must beg the Lord to increase our faith;<Cf. Mk 9:24; Lk 17:5; 22:32> it must be “working through charity,” abounding in hope, and rooted in the faith of the Church.<Gal 5:6; Rom 15:13; cf. Jas 2:14-26>

1100 The Word of God. The Holy Spirit first recalls the meaning of the salvation event to the liturgical assembly by giving life to the Word of God, which is proclaimed so that it may be received and lived:
In the celebration of the liturgy, Sacred Scripture is extremely important. From it come the lessons that are read and explained in the homily and the psalms that are sung. It is from the Scriptures that the prayers, collects, and hymns draw their inspiration and their force, and that actions and signs derive their meaning.<SC 24>
1101 The Holy Spirit gives a spiritual understanding of the Word of God to those who read or hear it, according to the dispositions of their hearts. By means of the words, actions, and symbols that form the structure of a celebration, the Spirit puts both the faithful and the ministers into a living relationship with Christ, the Word and Image of the Father, so that they can live out the meaning of what they hear, contemplate, and do in the celebration.

The Word of God
2653 The Church “forcefully and specially exhorts all the Christian faithful . . . to learn ‘the surpassing knowledge of Jesus Christ’ (Phil 3:8) by frequent reading of the divine Scriptures… Let them remember, however, that prayer should accompany the reading of Sacred Scripture, so that a dialogue takes place between God and man. For ‘we speak to him when we pray; we listen to him when we read the divine oracles.”’<DV 25; cf. Phil 3:8; St. Ambrose, De officiis ministrorum 1, 20,88: PL 16, 50>

1346 The liturgy of the Eucharist unfolds according to a fundamental structure which has been preserved throughout the centuries down to our own day. It displays two great parts that form a fundamental unity:

• the gathering, the liturgy of the Word, with readings, homily and general intercessions;
• the liturgy of the Eucharist, with the presentation of the bread and wine, the consecratory thanksgiving, and communion.
  **The liturgy of the Word and liturgy of the Eucharist together form “one single act of worship”**;<SC 56> the Eucharistic table set for us is the table both of the Word of God and of the Body of the Lord.<Cf. DV 21>

The Church as Church holds Scripture in extremely “high regard”. Very, very sadly I agree, the Church does not always seem to hold it as high as she ought. It IS the Word of God.

 

[fide]

it’s become clear that my worldview is more Protestant than Catholic.

I think you have to say your worldview would be “more non-Catholic than Catholic” - because the term “a protestant worldview” is not clear in itself - it is very ambiguous: which "protestant worldview do you mean? Episcopal? Pentecostal? Church of Christ? Unitarian? Community Bible Church? Salvation Army? Presbyterian? – and which iteration or version of Baptist might you include?

Blessed Cardinal John Henry Newman (to be canonized “a saint” on October 13 in Rome) once responded to his friends, non-Catholic as he also was, at the time - who questioned how in the world could he resolve the many “difficulties” in the Catholic Faith that he himself wrote about as a non-Catholic! (He was soon to enter the Catholic Church.)
He responded, “A thousand difficulties do not make one single doubt.”

If God gave you the faith to believe the truth of the Church, do not allow it to be taken away by difficulties!

 

[glencor63]

“When all else fades away, God’s word remains”.

Why is this an odd sentiment? Jesus said, “Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away”.

 

[glencor63]

Perhaps, High Church Anglican.

 

[fide]

Would you trade the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth of divine revelation - entrusted to His One Church - for a body of doctrine one iota less than that?

 

[1ke]

Jesus is the Word.