What is the non-Catholic Response to Mary Apparitions?

[Reuben_J]

What a great response, Pastor. It is the approach that I take regarding invocation as well - not convinced she can hear us, but millions of the centuries have gained great comfort believing that Mary and the saints not only pray for us (they do), but they can hear what our individual requests for intercession are.

With God, all things are possible, including possible apparitions of His mother for the benefit of the faithful.

Jon

I just love this Protestant.

 

[JonNC]

=Jimmy B;6601322
Don’t non-Catholic Christians, who believe in the protestant doctrine, which allows for personal interpretation of the bible, believe that they have a “prophet like” power, where they receive a response directly from God, when reading the bible that allows them to know how to accurately interpret a particular bible verse?
I think here at CAF, this is often way overstated. Certainly, personal interpretation is not a doctrine anywhere I know of, and Lutherans particularly are required to hold to the confessions, not their own personal interpretation, on articles of faith.
And I’m not sure - you could probably tell me - that there are any scripture verses related to apparitions, anyway.

The fact that none of them agree with each other is a different story.

Considering that virtually none of the other Protestant groups have their roots in Lutheranism, I’m not surprised by this.
And Catholics agree with none of them or Orthodoxy. Its a sad state of affairs, isn’t it?

Jon

 

[coolduude]

Investigate all you want…if the Catholic Church needs a miracle, the Catholic Church is going to get a miracle.

Surely, you’re not suggesting that Catholics possess a monopoly on supernatural miracles?

Surely yes.

protestanterrors.com/#13

go to 12 and 13.

Yes, the RCC has the only 1st class miracles of any denomination.

 

[JonNC]

I just love this Protestant.

Thanks, Reuben

Jon

 

[Zatzat]

Yes, the RCC has the only 1st class miracles of any denomination.

Odd that the creator of the universe would make sure that only allow 16% of the worlds population could claim that they only have access to these supposed 1st class miracles.

 

[Reuben_J]

Thanks, Reuben

Jon

God bless you Jon. You always can teach me a thing or two in witnessing and apologizing. If you must know, that’s more effective than any eloquence and knowledge that we often times want to flaunt.

I will put it at the back of my mind that you are my favorite Martian, er, I mean Protestant.

 

[TriuneUnity]

God bless you Jon. You always can teach me a thing or two in witnessing and apologizing. If you must know, that’s more effective than any eloquence and knowledge that we often times want to flaunt.

I will put it at the back of my mind that you are my favorite Martian, er, I mean Protestant.

Jon and I do follow Martian Luther, after all! :whacky:

 

[Jimmy_B]

I think here at CAF, this is often way overstated. Certainly, personal interpretation is not a doctrine anywhere I know of, and Lutherans particularly are required to hold to the confessions, not their own personal interpretation, on articles of faith.
And I’m not sure - you could probably tell me - that there are any scripture verses related to apparitions, anyway.

Considering that virtually none of the other Protestant groups have their roots in Lutheranism, I’m not surprised by this.
And Catholics agree with none of them or Orthodoxy. Its a sad state of affairs, isn’t it?

Jon

Jon,

There are so many different versions of non-Catholic Christianity today that it’s hard, not to overly-generalize and I apologizes for that. I complain here all the time when I read something regarding the Catholic Church , which has been overly generalized and yet, I did the same thing here…again…I’m working on trying to be more specific.

When I post comments like this I would hope that you know me well enough by now, to know that I’m usually addressing the more modern sects, which have appeared in the last hundred years or so.

We both know that the further a denomination gets from Catholicism, time wise, the less “Catholic” they are, meaning the less they share with the Catholic Church. The Sacraments are a good example.

A review of Luther’s 95 Thesis, shows very few differences, some of which were reconciled during Catholic Reformation. As time went on though, Luther found more to disagree with in the Catholic Church and then Calvin found things in Luther’s beliefs to disagree with and so on, to the mess we find ourselves in today and that’s truly unfortunate.

I believe the best chance we have of true ecumenicalism, is with the early Churches and we should all pray, Protestant and Catholic, for true ecumenicalism but not in a way that diminishes, minimized or damages the Body of Christ and true faith and morals.

The Catholic Church has a lot in common with the early Protestant Churches and If I weren’t Catholic (including our sister Churches), I’d probably be Lutheran and that’s because I know I’d have a friend there.

Thanks for your post Jon. Now I have to go to another one of my threads here and address a really well worded Protestant response, to one of my poorly written, overly generalized posts…

God Bless

 

[Non_Serviam]

I use a modified version of Matthew 24:23-26, and leave them alone. Even if there are one or more true apparitions to encourage people, chasing after none of them means not being seduced by one or more false apparitions in the bunch.

Besides, nothing essential to salvation can be in the message, else it would have been taught by an Apostle and not an apparition. If it was essential, it would have been declared from the beginning.

Think of this as a form of Pascal’s Wager. I don’t bet on any apparition as what I might win pales in comparision to what I might lose.

 

[BernadetteM]

I have heard many preachers/people on television religious shows proclaim that God just spoke to them and then go on and tell the audience what God wanted to impart to them.

I have also been to fundamentalist style churches where people will stand up and say they just got words from God that they are to share.

Does anyone believe this happens to certain people on a daily basis, as some act like they have a open communication with the Father.

It is highly more likely that our Lord has sent His Holy Mother to convey messages to a chosen person. The people the Lord uses are usually young children with very little knowledge about Church teachings or people who are not educated and lead very simple lives. I must ask how these little ones and the others can make up stories about something they know nothing about.

Of course there are frauds in every church and some people are so desperate for a sign that they will accept ridiculous signs i.e. the face of Jesus or Mary on a piece of toast. But I think most people ignore these types of claims.

The Church is very careful before declaring an apparition as true. Many times the child/person who claims to have seen Mary are put through hell by the authorities within and without the Church.

It is up to each individual whether they choose to believe in a vision or not.

Some protestant churches claim miracles all the time and direct contact with God. I have no idea if all their members accept these as true.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette

 

[TriuneUnity]

I have heard many preachers/people on television religious shows proclaim that God just spoke to them and then go on and tell the audience what God wanted to impart to them.

I have also been to fundamentalist style churches where people will stand up and say they just got words from God that they are to share.

Does anyone believe this happens to certain people on a daily basis, as some act like they have a open communication with the Father.

I don’t believe it for a minute. If someone tells me they received a “word from the Lord,” I will kindly ask them which chapter and verse they got it from.

 

[Reuben_J]

Jon and I do follow Martian Luther, after all! :whacky:

Goodness, really?

Aw, just ignore her Jon. The pun was unintended and in a stroke of whackiness she just compromises my compliment.

Seriously, if you believe that apparition is a possibility then why not embrace the major apparitions that have been accredited as possibly genuine by religious experts?

 

[Eric_Hilbert]

**Either discuss the subject like adults or the thread will be closed and infractions, and bannings will be handed out. **

 

[Jimmy_B]

Here is one of the sites that I used…

 

[JonNC]

=Jimmy B;6602239]Jon,

There are so many different versions of non-Catholic Christianity today that it’s hard, not to overly-generalize and I apologizes for that. I complain here all the time when I read something regarding the Catholic Church , which has been overly generalized and yet, I did the same thing here…again…I’m working on trying to be more specific.

When I post comments like this I would hope that you know me well enough by now, to know that I’m usually addressing the more modern sects, which have appeared in the last hundred years or so.

We both know that the further a denomination gets from Catholicism, time wise, the less “Catholic” they are, meaning the less they share with the Catholic Church. The Sacraments are a good example.

Most of the time, Jimmy, I post these types of clarifications, not for people like you who have an understanding of the differences, but the some who don’t.

A review of Luther’s 95 Thesis, shows very few differences, some of which were reconciled during Catholic Reformation. As time went on though, Luther found more to disagree with in the Catholic Church and then Calvin found things in Luther’s beliefs to disagree with and so on, to the mess we find ourselves in today and that’s truly unfortunate.

I believe the best chance we have of true ecumenicalism, is with the early Churches and we should all pray, Protestant and Catholic, for true ecumenicalism but not in a way that diminishes, minimized or damages the Body of Christ and true faith and morals.

I believe you are right, here. We have much in common, likely a good bit more than those of the more modern Protestant movements.

The Catholic Church has a lot in common with the early Protestant Churches and If I weren’t Catholic (including our sister Churches), I’d probably be Lutheran and that’s because I know I’d have a friend there.

More than one, Jimmy, and the feeling’s are mutual.

Thanks for your post Jon. Now I have to go to another one of my threads here and address a really well worded Protestant response, to one of my poorly written, overly generalized posts…

Honestly, you’re one of the better ones here.
Jon

 

[JonNC]

Goodness, really?

Aw, just ignore her Jon. The pun was unintended and in a stroke of whackiness she just compromises my compliment.

Seriously, if you believe that apparition is a possibility then why not embrace the major apparitions that have been accredited as possibly genuine by religious experts?

Sometimes the best puns are unintended, and I really appreciate the kind words.

I think the key word is “possibly”, at least for me, Reuben. So, I embrace the possiblility that some of the apparitions are genuine, and I remain unwilling to condemn those that see that possibility as closer to reality. This is not and should not be an issue between Lutherans and Catholics.

Jon

 

[Reuben_J]

Sometimes the best puns are unintended, and I really appreciate the kind words.

I think the key word is “possibly”, at least for me, Reuben. So, I embrace the possiblility that some of the apparitions are genuine, and I remain unwilling to condemn those that see that possibility as closer to reality. This is not and should not be an issue between Lutherans and Catholics.

Jon

Jon, I have come across you so often in this forum and every time I always came out feeling good. In a time where genuine compliment is hard to come by and when it comes it can be drowned in a torrent of skeptism of distrust. I was sincere and I just wanted to let you know.

The favorite Martian thing comes from the movie/novel My Favorite Martian. We can be world apart because of our differences in religion. It can make us like aliens from different planets. Well, wars were even fought because of them (religions). But despite that, one can always find goodness (even among the aliens) that one likes and can identify with.

To be a Christian for me is always a struggle. It is never easy to love like Him let alone be like Him. When I see another Christian exudes it and because I do not have it, it warms my heart because it is always a mirror image of me which I do not have. Faith is a long journey of learning.

Regarding apparitions of Mary, I perfectly understand Protestants’ position on them. I am not asking them to believe nor even trying to sell the idea to them. If they believe the way we do they would become Catholics. So that is not the issue to me. I am grateful, not because you may agree but because of your charity on this subject.

Anyway, I note that Lutherans are rather close to Catholics on this, and of course I am glad to hear that.

God bless.

 

[Richard_Kastner]

All good points.

Don’t non-Catholic Christians, who believe in the protestant doctrine,

Protestantism is not a denomination and as far as I know, while the various denominations in Protestantism do have doctrinal similarities they do not have a common doctrinal database.

which allows for personal interpretation of the bible,

1Cor.12: 1Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
10To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
13For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Jimmy, apparantly this “prophet like” power is given unto men. To deny it is to deny the word of God and call God a liar. Now while I am sure that this is not your intention it is quite clear that the Spirit is given to men.

1Cor.2:11For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

12Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

13Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Jn.14:14If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

15If ye love me, keep my commandments.

16And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

17Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

18I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

Jn.14:26But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

God Himself shall put His law in our inward parts and write them on our hearts.

Jer.31:33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

How will He do that?

1Jn.2:27But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

By the anointing of the Holy Spirit made possible by Jesus Christ.

 

[Jimmy_B]

Protestantism is not a denomination and as far as I know, while the various denominations in Protestantism do have doctrinal similarities they do not have a common doctrinal database.

Hello Richard Kastner,

Your comments are in the color blue, my response in black -

There is no Protestant denomination that I am aware of that allows for personal interpretation of the bible.

Definition:

 

[Jimmy_B]

We got a little off topic here, the question is -

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What is the non-Catholic response to Mary Apparitions?