What is the Orthodox opinions on Pope?

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Now this is kind of childish. The one with the burden of proof is the one making a claim. When the Orthodox make claims, you are equally entitled to ask for proof. But when you make claims supply quotations and are then unwilling to supply some context, be it more text from the same author, the historical context, political context, etc., behind the quotation, it severely weakens your argument, because quotations are easily taken out of context. What I am trying to point out to you is that the argument between the Orthodox and Catholics literally fills thousands upon thousands of pages, with thousands of historical documents being analysed in an attempt to truly understand the situation. To think that you can “win” the argument or “prove” the papacy by using five or six quotations from the fathers is somewhat naive.
Actaully, it is the Orthodox posters who initailly responded to the title of this post, so, you all have been making claims that the RCC is false. We have responded with why YOUR claims are wrong…including my post about St Ostatus. I am still waiting for you to show me just how St Ostatus didn’t really mean what he said. This is how debates work (back and forth with support for your side). One side doesn’t get to say, “NOooooooo, we won’t give you proof!!! You’re just wrong!” That sounds pretty childish. We may have provided 5-6 quotes from the early fathers, but that’s 5-6 quotes more proof than you have provided. Refute them or provide quotes that say the opposite is true.
 
See The Christian East and the Rise of the Papacy written by Aristeides Papadakis in collaboration with John Meyendorff. It basically details how the papacy changed drastically in nature with the Gregorian reforms, and the reaction this change garnered in the East. This is also not unknown to Catholic scholarship on the matter. Francis Dvornik also points out quite well the same thing in his much shorter book Byzantium and the Roman Primacy.
How interesting. I’ll check it out and give my view on it. I more concerned with the “changes” and see if doctrines were changed. I have not read of any doctrinal changes.
 
Actaully, it is the Orthodox posters who initailly responded to the title of this post, so, you all have been making claims that the RCC is false. We have responded with why YOUR claims are wrong…including my post about St Ostatus. I am still waiting for you to show me just how St Ostatus didn’t really mean what he said. This is how debates work (back and forth with support for your side). One side doesn’t get to say, “NOooooooo, we won’t give you proof!!! You’re just wrong!” That sounds pretty childish. We may have provided 5-6 quotes from the early fathers, but that’s 5-6 quotes more proof than you have provided. Refute them or provide quotes that say the opposite is true.
If you’re going to use his writings as a prooftext, at least give him the courtesy of spelling his name correctly. It’s Optatus.

I already gave you the context for Optatus. He used the papacy as a polemic against the Donatists who believed in Six Endowments (St. Optatus argued that they numbered five, not six) as being marks of the Church, the first of which was the Cathedra. Optatus turns the Cathedra (by which the Donatists meant the legitimate right to be bishop of a See) on its head by claiming that the Cathedra is the Cathedra Petri and furthermore, it is rooted in the bishop of Rome. It would be reasonable to give St. Optatus the benefit of the doubt, and think that he actually believed in this. However, when we investigate the corpus of the Patristic literature we find that St. Optatus’ claims are hard to use as real evidence, because nowhere else in the patristic literature is a concept of Five or Six Endowments to be found, outside of the context of this debate with the Donatists. On this account alone, there is great difficulty in trying to assert that St. Optatus’ opinion reflects the true mind of the fathers. And then it also doesn’t account for passages where St. John Chrysostom claims that Flavian was “another Peter” who had inherited the chair of Peter. As I was pointing out earlier, there are no slam dunk passages in the fathers (otherwise the debate would be over in a single Catholic Answers tract on the papacy). You seem to be frustrated that I don’t treat your quotation from St. Optatus in such a way, but this is precisely how arguments get carried out. Just as there are no slam dunk arguments for or against the existence of God (no matter how much this upsets Richard Dawkins) there are really no slam dunk arguments for or against the papacy either. The arguments need to be a bit more sophisticated than that.
 
How interesting. I’ll check it out and give my view on it. I more concerned with the “changes” and see if doctrines were changed. I have not read of any doctrinal changes.
The Dvornik book is an interesting overview of the history of East and West, although it is difficult to obtain.
 
The Dvornik book is an interesting overview of the history of East and West, although it is difficult to obtain.
I have a book written by a Roman Catholic priest discussing the history of the West and East. It is not biased at all and I truly mean it.
 
I have a book written by a Roman Catholic priest discussing the history of the West and East. It is not biased at all and I truly mean it.
It’s not Dvornik, though, is it (I ask because Dvornik was a Roman Catholic priest too)? 😃
 
I am a Eastern Catholic so I am under the pope and believe in papal supremacy. The Orthodox only find the pope to be the first among equals, they believe in papal primacy but not papal supremacy. Evidence is Matt 16: 18-20 obv, the pure significance peter has over all the other apostles, and the early church fathers. Plus Ironically all 4 of 5 of the first churches are now in MUSLIM territory, and owned by Muslims, the only church that hasn’t been moved around because of attack is Rome. IDK just my 2 cents, tomorrow I will post a better defense for it, I am very tired right now(5:12 am lol)
Speaking about Churches in muslim territory. I think that the muslims that persecute the Church in these places have a special place in hell, especially since in their own “holy book” it says to respect the people of the book (Christians and Jews). So they cannot exactly plea ignorance, even if it was written in a book of lies.
 
I will repeat a previous post of mine until someone can prove that what is said is really not what was meant by the saint who wrote it. And yes, if you are going to come on a Catholic apologetics website and accuse the Roman Catholic Church of making up new teachings, then yes,** you **have the burden of proof.
I’ve been endorsing a book here and I suggest if you are really interested in the subject that you go and buy it. For me to post a few exerpts from the book will not do the information contained in it justice. The book is actually composed of several studies by different people so it is best to get the complete picture from each author by reading the entirety of their studies.
Donatists are not the true church, but Optatus is clear that the true church is the one which recognizes Peter as head of the apostles…the one which recognizes Peter’s chair as the “single” chair which maintains unity. The Orthodox Church does not, so…it’s not the true church:
You have two wrong assumptions here.

First. the Orthodox do recognize Peter as head of the Apostles and as the Rock where Christ built his Church upon. Their understanding of Peter’s role in the Church is different from the understanding of Roman Catholics. Just because they are not in communion with the Pope of Rome and submit to him the way Catholics do does not mean they do not recognize Peter’s role. And it does not mean Peter is absent in their Church. From their perspective, Peter is there.

Second, that the source of unity is Peter’s chair. This is not even present in Scripture. If this is true, don’t you think this is such an important aspect of the faith that no New Testament writer even thought of spelling it out clearly?
In the city of Rome the Episcopal chair was given first to Peter, the chair in which Peter sat, the same who was head — that is why he is also called Cephas — of all the apostles, the one chair in which unity is maintained by all. Neither do the apostles proceed individually on their own, and anyone who would [presume to] set up another chair in opposition to that single chair would, by that very fact, be a schismatic and a sinner. . . . Recall, then, the origins of your chair, those of you who wish to claim for yourselves the title of holy Church" (The Schism of the Donatists 2:2 [circa A.D. 367]).
From the Orthodox point of view, this chair exists in every local Church. As long as the bishop professes the faith of Peter (as in Matthew), then the chair of Peter is there.
U-huh? :confused: If there exist “ranks” apparently one is above another. The military has ranks and it means some is always above another and at the same time one can be below someone else.
Ranks doesn’t mean one is over the other. In the Eastern Slavic Churches the priests, deacons, minor orders and laity will address the Bishop as Vladyka or Vladyko. It means in English as “Master”. That is subordination. The Bishop does not address the Metropolitan or the Patriarch as “Master”. They address them by their honorific address, “His Beatitude”, “His Holiness”, “His Excellency”, etc. Even the Pope will call a Patriarch or Major Archbishop as “His Beatitude”.

I think this is why we see things the way we see things. When Corinth asked for help from Rome, we immediately assume it was subordination. To us the only reason why one Church will call on another Church to settle its issues is because it is subordinate to that Church. But that is not the case. In my work I can call on a coworker to settle a disagreement about work between me and another coworker. That third party doesn’t have to be our manager, doesn’t even have to be in our department. Who knows, maybe Corinth called on Rome because they are far away that they will be neutral about the issue. Nearby Churches may be intimate of the situation and have their biases. The real answer, we don’t know. But it is our mindset looking for subordination which causes us to imagine there is subordination there. In fact there is nothing in the text that points to that.
Re: The similarity between the High Priest and the Pope (so I don’t have to reinvent the wheel):

Source: catholic.com/quickquestions/is-the-pope-similar-to-the-high-priest-in-the-old-testament (emphasis mine)

When I brought up the High Priest originally, I was perhaps just trying to show that in two other institutions God had set up, there is one on top in authority (I brought up the Old Covenant and the family as you know.) My understanding of the High Priest was that he was in authority over the other Priests (is this correct?)
Yes, just as a bishop is over his priests. But a bishop is no over other bishops. Peter was the leader AMONG the Apostles, not the leader OF the Apostles. His leadership does not place him above everyone else. Leadership doesn’t always mean other people are subordinate to you. And you will see this fact even today on Business books talking about leadership.
About my models, if I’m not mistaken, you are right that there is not “another level of ordination” for the Pope. So the model of:

Pope
Bishops
Priests
Deacons

(if I’m not mistaken) would have 3 levels of ordination but 4 offices. Again I think that it’s oversimplified in that it doesn’t contain Patriarchs, Metropolitans, etc. I’m under the impression that these are other offices too.
But there are many offices. Among bishops there are many offices, not just bishop and pope. The subordination of the priest to the bishop is not because of the office of the bishop purely, but by who the bishop is by virtue of his ordination. So the Pope really does not belong to this ranking list no matter how you twist the logic. The relationship of the Pope to the other bishops is not the same as the relationship of the bishops to the priests, deacons and laity.
 
Speaking about Churches in muslim territory. I think that the muslims that persecute the Church in these places have a special place in hell, especially since in their own “holy book” it says to respect the people of the book (Christians and Jews). So they cannot exactly plea ignorance, even if it was written in a book of lies.
This post is judgmental and is not even related to the topic of this thread.
 
…]

Yes, just as a bishop is over his priests. But a bishop is no over other bishops. Peter was the leader AMONG the Apostles, not the leader OF the Apostles. His leadership does not place him above everyone else. Leadership doesn’t always mean other people are subordinate to you. And you will see this fact even today on Business books talking about leadership.

But there are many offices. Among bishops there are many offices, not just bishop and pope. The subordination of the priest to the bishop is not because of the office of the bishop purely, but by who the bishop is by virtue of his ordination. So the Pope really does not belong to this ranking list no matter how you twist the logic. The relationship of the Pope to the other bishops is not the same as the relationship of the bishops to the priests, deacons and laity.
Constantine TG,

I’ll just respond briefly here and let you have the last word here.

A Bishop does not have authority over other Bishops as I understand it but I believe that the Bishop of Rome holds the office of the Papacy and as such, holds an office which includes universal jurisdiction. If you are talking about philosophies of business leadership such as say “servant leadership” being a servant and leading like this doesn’t negate the authority of the leader; if the servant leader is the CEO he has certain authority over those he (or she ) is leading. As you probably know, “SERVANT OF THE SERVANTS OF GOD” is “A title given by the popes to themselves…” (source: Meehan, Andrew. “Servus servorum Dei.” The Catholic Encyclopedia. Vol. 13. New York: Robert Appleton Company, 1912. 25 Jul. 2012 http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/13737a.htm.)

I suppose we will agree to disagree on the role of St. Peter in regards to the other Apostles as I believe that he was the leader of the Apostles and He was chosen by Jesus among them. I believe that “among them” and “of them” may be a distinction without a difference.

I agree there are many offices among Bishops other than Pope (I had mentioned Patriarchs, Metropolitans, etc. but didn’t include them in my overly simplified diagram.)
Please recognize too that with my (overly simplified) diagram shows a hierarchy of authority. It doesn’t have to deal with the other relationships you bring up. Do you agree that my model is a hierarchy of authority (with the aforementioned offices and perhaps others removed) in the Catholic Church?
 
As an aside,

I just received my copy of “THE EASTERN CHURCHES AND THE PAPACY” by Rev. S. Herbert Scott today. Rev. S. Herbert Scott seems to be have been an Anglican and wrote the book as such (although I admittedly didn’t know it at the time.) Does anyone have any experience with this book or can confirm that Rev. S. Herbert Scott was an Anglican?

Thanks
 
Constantine TG,

I’ll just respond briefly here and let you have the last word here.

A Bishop does not have authority over other Bishops as I understand it but I believe that the Bishop of Rome holds the office of the Papacy and as such, holds an office which includes universal jurisdiction. If you are talking about philosophies of business leadership such as say “servant leadership” being a servant and leading like this doesn’t negate the authority of the leader; if the servant leader is the CEO he has certain authority over those he (or she ) is leading. As you probably know, “SERVANT OF THE SERVANTS OF GOD” is “A title given by the popes to themselves…” (source: Meehan, Andrew. “Servus servorum Dei.” The Catholic Encyclopedia. Vol. 13. New York: Robert Appleton Company, 1912. 25 Jul. 2012 http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/13737a.htm.)
But Canon Law itself confirms that the other bishops are subordinate to the Pope. Other bishops cannot even ordain a bishop without the Pope’s approval, even those who belong to a different jurisdiction (ie. Eastern Churches). There are so many aspects of the Church that the Pope has control over, even those that should belong to the bishops themselves.

And don’t get me wrong, I don’t think the Pope having control of the entire Church as its “captain” is not entirely a bad thing. But there is a difference between one who guides and one who controls. The fact that the Pope can do thing unilaterally means that every other bishop is not his equal.
I suppose we will agree to disagree on the role of St. Peter in regards to the other Apostles as I believe that he was the leader of the Apostles and He was chosen by Jesus among them. I believe that “among them” and “of them” may be a distinction without a difference.
Anyone who denies Peter’s leadership among the Apostles is in denial. But the fact is, there is no proof anywhere that the other Apostles are subordinate to him. Even in the opening of Acts, while Peter led the Apostles into a “synod” if we would like to call it that, the decision wasn’t his unilaterally. He gathered the other 10. If he is who the Pope is today, he could have just said that he was deciding on who the replacement of Judas was. Or that he was casting lots by himself. But no, he did everything with the other 10. As leader, he guided them to follow prophesy, but nothing was done unilaterally.
I agree there are many offices among Bishops other than Pope (I had mentioned Patriarchs, Metropolitans, etc. but didn’t include them in my overly simplified diagram.)
Please recognize too that with my (overly simplified) diagram shows a hierarchy of authority. It doesn’t have to deal with the other relationships you bring up. Do you agree that my model is a hierarchy of authority (with the aforementioned offices and perhaps others removed) in the Catholic Church?
Well, unfortunately yes, that is how is it in the Catholic Church.
 
You have two wrong assumptions here.

First. the Orthodox do recognize Peter as head of the Apostles and as the Rock where Christ built his Church upon. Their understanding of Peter’s role in the Church is different from the understanding of Roman Catholics. Just because they are not in communion with the Pope of Rome and submit to him the way Catholics do does not mean they do not recognize Peter’s role. And it does not mean Peter is absent in their Church. From their perspective, Peter is there.

**Yes, that is the Orthodox opinion, but the quote (and others) is talking about being in communion with the ONE chair of Peter…not the many chairs that the Orthodox seem to think = Peter. **

Second, that the source of unity is Peter’s chair. This is not even present in Scripture. If this is true, don’t you think this is such an important aspect of the faith that no New Testament writer even thought of spelling it out clearly?

**The quote (and many others) make it clear that we are talking about a single chair that stands above the others. And since when does there have to be Scriptural basis? That sounds Protestant Sola Scriptura to me. Do quotes of the Early Fathers only = Sacred Tradition when it agrees with Orthodox theology? Where are the Early Father quotes that support the Orthodox view? **
 
Oh they get pretty fringe at that point. 😃 I find its difficult to ignore the preponderance of evidence which supports the Papacy in Patristics, History, Councils and through time.

The Orthodox study The Primacy of Peter (St. Vladimir’s Seminary Press, 1992) by John Meyendorff states on St. Clement of Rome and the ante-Nicene period (before 325 AD) –

“Let us turn to the facts. We know that the Church of Rome took over the position of ‘church-with-priority’ at the end of the first century. That was about the time at which her star ascended into the firmament of history in its brightest splendor…Even as early as the Epistle to the Romans, Rome seems to have stood out among all the churches as very important. Paul bears witness that the faith of the Romans was proclaimed throughout the whole world (Rom 1:8)…we have a document which gives us our earliest reliable evidence that the Church of Rome stood in an exceptional position of authority in this period. This is the epistle of Clement of Rome…We know that Clement was ‘president’ of the Roman Church…” (Afanassieff from Meyendorff, page 124)

“The epistle [Clement of Rome to the Corinthians] is couched in very measured terms, in the form of an exhortation; but at the same time it clearly shows that the Church of Rome was aware of the decisive weight, in the Church of Corinth’s eyes, that must attach to its witness about the events in Corinth. So the Church of Rome, at the end of the first century, exhibits a marked sense of its own priority, in point of witness about events in other churches. Note also that the Roman Church did not feel obliged to make a case, however argued, to justify its authoritative pronouncements on what we should now call the internal concerns of other churches. There is nothing said about the grounds of this priority…Apparently Rome had no doubt that its priority would be accepted without argument.” (Afanassieff from Meyendorff, page 125-126)

“Rome’s vocation [in the “pre-Nicene period”] consisted in playing the part of arbiter, settling contentious issues by witnessing to the truth or falsity of whatever doctrine was put before them. Rome was truly the center where all converged if they wanted their doctrine to be accepted by the conscience of the Church. They could not count upon success except on one condition – that the Church of Rome had received their doctrine – and refusal from Rome predetermined the attitude the other churches would adopt. There are numerous cases of this recourse to Rome…” (Afanassieff from Meyendorff, page 128f, 133)

“It is impossible to deny that, even before the appearance of local primacies, the Church from the first days of her existence possessed an ecumenical center of unity and agreement. In the apostolic and the Judaeo-Christian period, it was the Church of Jerusalem, and later the Church of Rome – ‘presiding in agape,’ according to St. Ignatius of Antioch. This formula and the definition of the universal primacy contained in it have been aptly analyzed by Fr. Afanassieff and we need not repeat his argument here. Neither can we quote here all the testimonies of the Fathers and the Councils unanimously acknowledging Rome as the senior church and the center of ecumenical agreement. It is only for the sake of biased polemics that one can ignore these testimonies, their consensus and significance.” (Schmemann from Meyendorff, page 163-164)

Kenneth Whitehead asks in his wonderful apologetics book One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic: The Early Church was the Catholic Church (Ignatius Press, 2000) –

“We must ask: What Church existing today descends in an unbroken line from the apostles of Jesus Christ (and possesses the other essential marks of the true Church of which the Creed speaks)? Further, what Church existing today is headed by a single, recognized, designated leader under the headship of Peter? To ask these questions is to answer them. Any entity claiming to be the Church of Christ – his body! – must demonstrate its apostolicity, its organic link with the original apostles, on whom Christ manifestly established his Church. Nothing less can qualify as the apostolic Church that Jesus founded.” (Whitehead, page 36)
 
But Canon Law itself confirms that the other bishops are subordinate to the Pope. Other bishops cannot even ordain a bishop without the Pope’s approval, even those who belong to a different jurisdiction (ie. Eastern Churches). There are so many aspects of the Church that the Pope has control over, even those that should belong to the bishops themselves…
The last two Popes spoke on this and we wait.
And don’t get me wrong, I don’t think the Pope having control of the entire Church as its “captain” is not entirely a bad thing. But there is a difference between one who guides and one who controls. The fact that the Pope can do thing unilaterally means that every other bishop is not his equal…
Right
Anyone who denies Peter’s leadership among the Apostles is in denial. But the fact is, there is no proof anywhere that the other Apostles are subordinate to him. Even in the opening of Acts, while Peter led the Apostles into a “synod” if we would like to call it that, the decision wasn’t his unilaterally. He gathered the other 10. If he is who the Pope is today, he could have just said that he was deciding on who the replacement of Judas was. Or that he was casting lots by himself. But no, he did everything with the other 10. As leader, he guided them to follow prophesy, but nothing was done unilaterally…
Well we sorta addressed this already, also here.

google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=6&sqi=2&ved=0CGEQFjAF&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aboutcatholics.com%2Fworship%2Fproof_reason_papal_office%2F&ei=vyMRUJ-GBeyN6QG40ICAAw&usg=AFQjCNGOqwPKqGZFhROO3oSNGdQXw3KMSg&sig2=CkZFJ0e-VLlvN88xKuYfxA
 
While it is true that the Pope appoints bishops, and it is certainly different from the processes seen in Orthodoxy (here’s how the Coptic Orthodox will chose their Pope, for example), does anyone really know how this works? Do we really think that the Pope just decides on his own? How can he possibly know all those who might be most eligible and worthy across the entire span of the Catholic Church community?

Those of us who are Eastern Catholics in non-Patriarchial churches know that nominations are made, and first considered by the Congregation for the Eastern Churches. While the final decision is that of the Pontiff, it is made with the recommendation of the Congregation, having consulted the local Church and considering the nominations made.

I admit I am less familiar with the process as regards Latin Church hierarchs, but there must be some similarities, and I know national conferences of bishops are involved. Otherwise, given history, we might have had Italian bishops placed in dioceses all over the globe.
 
Yes, that is the Orthodox opinion, but the quote (and others) is talking about being in communion with the ONE chair of Peter…not the many chairs that the Orthodox seem to think = Peter.

The quote (and many others) make it clear that we are talking about a single chair that stands above the others. And since when does there have to be Scriptural basis? That sounds Protestant Sola Scriptura to me. Do quotes of the Early Fathers only = Sacred Tradition when it agrees with Orthodox theology? Where are the Early Father quotes that support the Orthodox view?
There are no “many chairs,” plural, but ONE chair of Peter, and in accordance with the Tradition handed down from the Apostles through the Fathers of the Church, that chair is the seat of every bishop. The normal example being the oft-used quote of St. Cyprian in reference to his own bishopric in the context of a local schism in the North African church:
St. Cyprian of Carthage:
The Lord says to Peter: “I say to you,” he says, “That you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church” . . . On him [Peter] he builds the Church, and to him he gives the command to feed the sheep [John 21:17], and although he assigns a like power to all the apostles, yet he founded a single chair, and he established by his own authority a source and an intrinsic reason for that unity. Indeed, the others were that also which Peter was , but a primacy is given to Peter, whereby it is made clear that there is but one Church and one chair. So too, all [the apostles] are shepherds, and the flock is shown to be one, fed by all the apostles in single-minded accord. If someone does not hold fast to this unity of Peter, can he imagine that he still holds the faith? If he [should] desert the chair of Peter upon whom the Church was built, can he still be confident that he is in the Church?

Then there’s the issue of why, if the chair of Peter is given to a single super-ordinary bishop and not to all bishops, was St. Peter’s [first and longest-held] office as Bishop of Antioch subordinate to his office in Rome? As in, why, by Roman logic, would the Successor of Peter the Patriarch of Antioch not be successor of Peter as the one Vicar of Christ, the Infallible Universal Pontiff and Head of all the Church on Earth, et al, instead of the Patriarch of Rome? The answer of course is because the ONE Chair of Peter is the seat of ALL bishops, and Rome’s primacy of honor was given by the Church because of its unifying usual-orthodoxy, its traditional foundation by Sts. Peter and Paul, and because of its original political relevance in the Empire (the same political-relevance reason Constantinople was later raised in honor above even the Petrine Sees of Antioch and Alexandria); not because St. Peter happened to be last seen alive within the city limits of Roma, or because the last guy he lived to ordain a bishop happened to be Linus/Cletus/Clement. The Church of Rome as a whole was significant for many reasons, but not [because of] its particular bishop, for the Patriarch of Antioch holds the same pedigree as the Patriarch of Rome in that regard.
Oh they get pretty fringe at that point. I find its difficult to ignore the preponderance of evidence which supports the Papacy in Patristics, History, Councils and through time.
You cannot ignore the primacy, honor and priority of the Church of Rome found clearly in patristics, history and the Councils, but it’s difficult to ignore the preponderance of evidence which refutes the papacy in patristics, history and the Councils (Pope Victor rebuked by the Church instead of authoritatively considered, Pope Stephen backing down from prevailing favor of St. Cyprian’s position, the Meletian and Photian schisms where the pope of Rome’s appointment of bishop was duly and thoroughly ignored, etc. etc. etc.). I always find it curious that Roman Catholics see evidence of the modern papacy in the Councils - the Ecumenical Councils are the preeminent refutory bodies of evidence against papal supremacy. Not one pope of Rome presided over one Ecumenical Council, and neither did any pope of Rome decide any Ecumenical Council. In fact, a pope of Rome or two was anathematized by a council or two. The Second Council of Constantinople didn’t even bother to try to include Pope Vigilius, any of his bishops or any bishops from Italy at all for that matter, and was held explicitly against his wishes; the Fathers of the Fifth Ecumenical Council were forbidden by him to convene, but not one of the 152 Fathers apparently saw any authority for him to do so, because the council convened, ended and was decided completely without the pope of Rome’s presence or representation (let alone his approval) and entirely in the face of his forbidding, and Vigilius only later accepted the acts of the council in defeat. There is hardly a shred of evidence for any authority from Rome beyond honorary precedence, let alone universal ordinary authority, being recognized at any of the Ecumenical Councils. The strongest event in favor of Rome would be the Tomos of Pope St. Leo being accepted to define the Council of Chalcedon, but the Tome was put to scrutiny, compared to St. Cyril’s writings, examined for orthodoxy, disagreed with by many of the Fathers of the council, submitted to editing, etc. before it was determined to contain the faith of St. Cyril and thus the Faith of the Church.
 
There are no “many chairs,” plural, but ONE chair of Peter, and in accordance with the Tradition handed down from the Apostles through the Fathers of the Church, that chair is the seat of every bishop. The normal example being the oft-used quote of St. Cyprian in reference to his own bishopric in the context of a local schism in the North African church:

Then there’s the issue of why, if the chair of Peter is given to a single super-ordinary bishop and not to all bishops, was St. Peter’s [first and longest-held] office as Bishop of Antioch subordinate to his office in Rome? As in, why, by Roman logic, would the Successor of Peter the Patriarch of Antioch not be successor of Peter as the one Vicar of Christ, the Infallible Universal Pontiff and Head of all the Church on Earth, et al, instead of the Patriarch of Rome? The answer of course is because the ONE Chair of Peter is the seat of ALL bishops, and Rome’s primacy of honor was given by the Church because of its unifying usual-orthodoxy, its traditional foundation by Sts. Peter and Paul, and because of its original political relevance in the Empire (the same political-relevance reason Constantinople was later raised in honor above even the Petrine Sees of Antioch and Alexandria); not because St. Peter happened to be last seen alive within the city limits of Roma, or because the last guy he lived to ordain a bishop happened to be Linus/Cletus/Clement. The Church of Rome as a whole was significant for many reasons, but not [because of] its particular bishop, for the Patriarch of Antioch holds the same pedigree as the Patriarch of Rome in that regard.

You cannot ignore the primacy, honor and priority of the Church of Rome found clearly in patristics, history and the Councils, but it’s difficult to ignore the preponderance of evidence which refutes the papacy in patristics, history and the Councils (Pope Victor rebuked by the Church instead of authoritatively considered, Pope Stephen backing down from prevailing favor of St. Cyprian’s position, the Meletian and Photian schisms where the pope of Rome’s appointment of bishop was duly and thoroughly ignored, etc. etc. etc.). I always find it curious that Roman Catholics see evidence of the modern papacy in the Councils - the Ecumenical Councils are the preeminent refutory bodies of evidence against papal supremacy. Not one pope of Rome presided over one Ecumenical Council, and neither did any pope of Rome decide any Ecumenical Council. In fact, a pope of Rome or two was anathematized by a council or two. The Second Council of Constantinople didn’t even bother to try to include Pope Vigilius, any of his bishops or any bishops from Italy at all for that matter, and was held explicitly against his wishes; the Fathers of the Fifth Ecumenical Council were forbidden by him to convene, but not one of the 152 Fathers apparently saw any authority for him to do so, because the council convened, ended and was decided completely without the pope of Rome’s presence or representation (let alone his approval) and entirely in the face of his forbidding, and Vigilius only later accepted the acts of the council in defeat. There is hardly a shred of evidence for any authority from Rome beyond honorary precedence, let alone universal ordinary authority, being recognized at any of the Ecumenical Councils. The strongest event in favor of Rome would be the Tomos of Pope St. Leo being accepted to define the Council of Chalcedon, but the Tome was put to scrutiny, compared to St. Cyril’s writings, examined for orthodoxy, disagreed with by many of the Fathers of the council, submitted to editing, etc. before it was determined to contain the faith of St. Cyril and thus the Faith of the Church.
Different views on St Cyprians Unity

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Fifth Council

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Council of Ephesus

“Philip, presbyter and legate of [Pope Celestine I] said: ‘We offer our thanks to the holy and venerable synod, that when the writings of our holy and blessed pope had been read to you, the holy members, by our holy voices, you joined yourselves to the holy head also by your holy acclamations. For your blessedness is not ignorant that the head of the whole faith, the head of the apostles, is blessed Peter the apostle. And since now [we], after having been tempest-tossed and much vexed, [have] arrived, we ask that you order that there be laid before us what things were done in this holy synod before our arrival; in order that according to the opinion of our blessed pope and of this present holy assembly, we likewise may ratify their determination’” (Acts of the Council, session 2 [A.D. 431]).

Council of Constantinople I

“The bishop of Constantinople shall have the primacy of honor after the bishop of Rome, because his city is New Rome” (canon 3 [A.D. 381]).

Council of Chalcedon

“Bishop Paschasinus, guardian of the Apostolic See, stood in the midst [of the Council Fathers] and said, 'We received directions at the hands of the most blessed and apostolic bishop of the Roman city [Pope Leo I], who is the head of all the churches, which directions say that Dioscorus is not to be allowed to sit in the [present] assembly, but that if he should attempt to take his seat, he is to be cast out. This instruction we must carry out” (Acts of the Council, session 1 [A.D. 451]).

“After the reading of the foregoing epistle [The Tome of Leo], the most reverend bishops cried out: ‘This is the faith of the fathers! This is the faith of the apostles! So we all believe! Thus the orthodox believe! Anathema to him who does not thus believe! Peter has spoken thus through Leo!’” (ibid., session 2).
 
Yes, that is the Orthodox opinion, but the quote (and others) is talking about being in communion with the ONE chair of Peter…not the many chairs that the Orthodox seem to think = Peter.

The quote (and many others) make it clear that we are talking about a single chair that stands above the others. And since when does there have to be Scriptural basis? That sounds Protestant Sola Scriptura to me. Do quotes of the Early Fathers only = Sacred Tradition when it agrees with Orthodox theology? Where are the Early Father quotes that support the Orthodox view?
Saying that there are multiple chairs is like saying there are multiple Jesus because every church has the Eucharist.
 
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