What is the pull of Islam?

  • Thread starter Thread starter rien
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Islam offers the “virtue” of superficial simplicity–and as CS Lewis pointed out 50+ years ago, why should’nt it?–It was made up by a human being. God, however, is NOT bound by our concepts of simplicity

The reality is, that even with a supposed single source (Muhammed) the develop of Islamic teaching during his 22 years of preaching his “revelations” was a twisty, contradictory path–hence the concept of “abrogation”–a post facto (after the fact) way of disclaiming/ignoring earlier teachings that were no longer convienient to Muhammed. Additionaly, the koran we have today is about 1/4 of Muhammed’s teachings–the rest were sifted out a generation or more after his death during the 3rd Caliph’s reign–anything THAT Caliph deemed inauthenitic or non-inspired was left out (exactly the sort of process the Da Vinci code supporters WRONGLY accuse the Catholic Church of doing).

I STRONGLY suggest that anyone interested in Islam check out these books for some unvarnished history of the Koran and Muslim society:

amazon.com/Sword-Prophet-History-Theology-Impact/dp/1928653111/sr=8-1/qid=1162414086/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-9760338-0638349?ie=UTF8&s=books

and

amazon.com/Politically-Incorrect-Guide-Islam-Crusades/dp/0895260131/sr=8-3/qid=1162414086/ref=pd_bbs_3/104-9760338-0638349?ie=UTF8&s=books

Also, one should also check out the history of “American Prophet”, Joseph Smith Jr.–someone else who also claimed non verifiable revelations, fouinded is own religion, revised the original theology several times to suit his purposes–and was well on the way to establishing a theocratical state.

amazon.com/No-Man-Knows-My-History/dp/0679730540/sr=1-1/qid=1162414338/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-9760338-0638349?ie=UTF8&s=books
 
Salaam Rien;
I am a Muslim.
Some people will tell that converts to Islam do that because they needed a change, they got feed up with the life style they were living and wanted a rigorous system to direct their lives.
The question asked is: why would people undertake such a huge and drastic change (as is the change of one’s belief system) to another belief system if the later has no good in it? But what is the good that people find in Islam?
Praying five times a day looks tough.
Fasting a whole month from sunrise to sunset, looks tough as well.
Giving annually 2.5% away of one’s wealth is not encouraging. Etc.

I think that people convert to Islam because they find the ultimate place for their soul to rest. That place is called the belief in the absolute and uncompromising oneness of God, it all start there. The Prophet of Islam spent 13 years of his life teaching his people one thing: Tawhid (Oneness of God); once there, everything else becomes so easy and actually becomes a source of joy and peace. The prayers, the fasting, the Zakat (tax for the poor) all become not hinders but beloved acts of worship.

Islam has another thing which lacks in other religions. Islam has the hidden acts of worship which translate the true belief in God and keep His remembrance living and vibrant.

Who knows if the person standing in prayer is clean (has done the ablution), safe the person itself and…God? So cleanliness becomes an act of worship, a proof in one’s heart of belief in God and a remembrance of Him.

Who knows if the person standing in prayer has done (if married) the whole bath after sexual intercourse as required by Islam, safe the person itself and…God? So taking a complete bath after sexual intercourse for the married becomes an act of worship, a proof in one’s hearth in belief in God and a remembrance of God.

Who knows that the person during the month of Ramadan is fasting or not, safe the person itself …and God? So fasting becomes an act of worship, a proof in one’s hearth of belief in God and a remembrance of Him throughout the whole day.

Who knows that the person has given the due share out of his wealth to the poor and the needy, safe the person itself…and God? So giving the Zakat becomes a proof into one’s hearth of true belief in God an obedience to Him and an act of worship.

Prayers, Fasting, Ablution before prayer, whole bath after sexual intercourse and many other acts of worship, are all preceded by the spoken or non-spoken “intention” which takes place into one’s breast, no one hears it safe the person itself and God. The intention is to declare “My God I intend to do such and such”. Not that God does not know what we are about to do, but this is part of the ongoing (spoken or non-spoken) dialog between God and the Muslim, a quasi continual remembrance. This is one of the secrets of why the Muslims observe their religious duties and look fervent when performing them. The relationship between God and the Muslims is so deep and a source of the much needed internal peace.

My dear Friend;
Don’t think I am trying to influence you. We Muslims believe that it is God who guides to Him whom He wishes. And As Allah said:” O My servants, I have forbidden oppression for Myself and have made it forbidden amongst you, so do not oppress one another. O My servants, all of you are astray except for those I have guided, so seek guidance of Me and I shall guide you, O My servants, all of you are hungry except for those I have fed, so seek food of Me and I shall feed you. O My servants, all of you are naked except for those I have clothed, so seek clothing of Me and I shall clothe you. O My servants, you sin by night and by day, and I forgive all sins, so seek forgiveness of Me and I shall forgive you. O My servants, you will not attain harming Me so as to harm Me, and will not attain benefiting Me so as to benefit Me. O My servants, were the first of you and the last of you, the human of you and the jinn of you to be as pious as the most pious heart of any one man of you, that would not increase My kingdom in anything. O My servants, were the first of you and the last of you, the human of you and the jinn of you to be as wicked as the most wicked heart of any one man of you, that would not decrease My kingdom in anything. O My servants, were the first of you and the last of you, the human of you and the jinn of you to rise up in one place and make a request of Me, and were I to give everyone what he requested, that would not decrease what I have, any more that a needle decreases the sea if put into it. O My servants, it is but your deeds that I reckon up for you and then recompense you for, so let him who finds good, praise Allah and let him who finds other than that blame no one but himself”

Salaam.
Joseph.
 
meedo said:
Hello ,

If you want to meet people who are converts to islam then go to www.whyislam.org

If you want a great mainstream site about islam then go to

www.islamonline.net

if you have any questions you can also PM me or post the questions on this site .

best regards,

meedo
Click to expand...
Oh geez!

Will I ever come across a serious testimony?!

All these protestants convert cuz they have chaos in their lives. They are so ignorant of Jesus and scriptures, is it any wonder they search for other avenue. Typical of these Islamic converts.

All those testimonies are about feeling good stuff. It tells me nothing about the meat of the religion, just the shell.

Give me a convert who was a knowledgeable Catholic, then I will re-think on Islam!
 
hehe i wonder why would one count on conversion stories 😃 there are plenty of converts to Christianity…there is a Christian Egyptian paltalk with lots of converts who give testimonies it takes 1 a week to listen to all of them! as one convert to islam said : Islam is the simplification of Judeo-Christian scriptures…indeed for Muhammad picked and chose what suited him and what he thought to have understood, setting apart Jesus’ New Covenant because obviously it did not suit him…he took some rabbis’ interpretations, and gave his own interpretations on other things…Islam IS simple because it is man-made 😉
 
I think part of the pull of Islam is that it is new to many westerners. A person can practice the faith without being made fun of by western media.

In a generation or two it will be interesting to see how Islam stands up to the same scrutiny and mockery that Christians put up with for following their faith.
 
Hello everyone,…

I too at one time was searching for Truth. Islam was one of the religions that also appealed to me. However, being a student of philosophy, I had to authentically search for truth from all angles, not just a subjective viewpoint. When reading the Qur’an, I asked myself questions concerning the abrogation of verses. Can
God who is Truth, tell a lie? Why in the Qur’an, are God’s perfect attributes necessarily sustained by His creation. If the Qur’an is eternal then who is God compassionate and merciful toward before ‘time’ begins?

To further your quest, ask yourself these questions, read ‘Fides et Ratio’ by our late Holy Father John Paul II. Also reading Summa Contra Gentiles wouldn’t hurt either.

God Bless
OptimusPrimefan
 
sandmountainsli said:
The Qur’an, he claimed, was a series of revelations he received directly from a nameless Lord.
Click to expand...
I Muhammad claimed the Qu’ran was revealed to him by an angel. It wasn’t even God Himself, but a messenger of God. The Spirit warns us through Paul:
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! (Galatians 1:8)

You are not alone in your temptation rein. Lately and in the past I myself have had my faith cracked by the claims of Islam. But you have to remember that Islam was not even recognized as a religion at first, just a somewhat of a ‘heresy’ called Mohammedanism. Read this article here

The faith that I have left is kept alive for me by the Holy Spirit. I have always been fond of Him and He has a very profound effect on me. Whenever I have doubts or confusion I pray to the Spirit and then I think ‘Wait, if I’m praying to the Spirit who not only spoke through the Scriptures over thousands of years by many people, but also was given to me by Christ, than how could I doubt Christ?’

The pull of Islam is that it seems so simple and spiritual. Praying 5 TIMES A DAY!! That sounds very devoted. But Christ commands Christians to pray CEASEINGLY! Just try it: it’s not easy. That’s why I pray the Liturgy of the Hours which is basically a Christian upgrade from the Muslim prayer habits. It gives me a sense of simple devotion along with a spiritual connection to God and every other Catholic in the world who is praying at the exact same time I am with the exact same prayer. I reccomend it.
 
deb1 said:
I think part of the pull of Islam is that it is new to many westerners. A person can practice the faith without being made fun of by western media.

In a generation or two it will be interesting to see how Islam stands up to the same scrutiny and mockery that Christians put up with for following their faith.
Click to expand...
Exactly. It’s kind of a popular fad here in the West right now.

And this too shall pass…
 
As to praying 5 times a day, even very small Catholic (and other Christian) children already do that! Our 4 and 3 year old grandchildren pray when they awake, before every meal, and again when they go to sleep—5 times. Their prayers are usually short, some of them are memorized and some extemporaneous. Whenever they are in the car they pray for a safe journey, if an ambulance or other vehicle with emergency lights go by, they pray for the safety of the people involved in that emergency—I can go on and on.

The culture of the west will change for the better if those who believe in Christ simply stand up for him. When my children were playing ball and a parent would use the Lord’s name in vain because of some mistake, I would say loud enough for the person to hear: “Blessed be the name of the Lord”---- that parent soon minded his tongue regarding the name of the Lord, and I did not have to do anything more than that.
 
Muhammad was heretic? yes. Just analyze the crucifixion account in the Quran and ahadith and read Basilides the heretic…they match 😉 someone else was crucified…yea sure :rolleyes:

Rodrigo Bivar had a good link here on CAF about legends Muhammad put in his book…you can look for it.

finally, why would one believe a man who quoted a rabbi’s interpretation in Mishna Sanhedrin and said it is the direct word of God?:rolleyes:

Jesus warned us beforhand 👍
 
inJESUS said:
someone else was crucified…yeah sure :rolleyes: :
Click to expand...
The excuse of the millenium is…“it was his twin brother who was crucified, not Him.”:rolleyes:

Oh come on!! You could try a little harder than that!

In the words of Doctor Spock “Humans are highly illogical…”
 
Rocky said:
As to praying 5 times a day, even very small Catholic (and other Christian) children already do that! Our 4 and 3 year old grandchildren pray when they awake, before every meal, and again when they go to sleep—5 times. Their prayers are usually short, some of them are memorized and some extemporaneous. Whenever they are in the car they pray for a safe journey, if an ambulance or other vehicle with emergency lights go by, they pray for the safety of the people involved in that emergency—I can go on and on.

The culture of the west will change for the better if those who believe in Christ simply stand up for him. When my children were playing ball and a parent would use the Lord’s name in vain because of some mistake, I would say loud enough for the person to hear: “Blessed be the name of the Lord”---- that parent soon minded his tongue regarding the name of the Lord, and I did not have to do anything more than that.
Click to expand...
i agree. Our Lord asked us to pray always. We fast not only for a month ( +), but many days a week…our fasting month does not involve luxurious food after breaking it…many eat only vegetables for more than a month…you don’t “feel” our fasting because we should NOT make it public…the unity Islam offers is not alien to us 🙂 our Christians fathers lived in unity and love…things changed now in the West because of some people who want it Godless, but you can revive the old traditions and give the example of our early fathers…after all, we are the light of the world…and light shines in darkness 👍
 
scapularkid8 said:
The excuse of the millenium is…“it was his twin brother who was crucified, not Him.”:rolleyes:

Oh come on!! You could try a little harder than that!

In the words of Doctor Spock “Humans are highly illogical…”
Click to expand...
depends who 😉

in hadith you will find a dozen names for the one who was crucified instead :eek:

read this :

Ibn Abu Hatim has narrated from Ibn Abbas saying: "'When Allah wanted to lift him up to heaven, Jesus came to his companions in the house. There were twelve people, with some from among his disciples. He had just a bath, and his head was still dribbling with water. He said to them: ‘There are those among you who will disbelieve in me twelve times after he had believed in me! Then he said: 'Who will from among you take my likeness and be killed in my place, so will become in my rank?’ A young youth came forwards. But Jesus said to him: ‘Sit down! Then he repeated the same question, and the same youth stood up and came forwards, and said: ‘I.’ Jesus said: ‘You are the one,’ and then the likeness of Jesus was put on him, and Jesus was lifted up to the heaven from the window of his house.

HILARIOUS!! 😃

Can we substitute Spock’s word “humans” with something else?😛
 
Don’t pay any attention to conversion stories. It’s argumentum ad verecundiam. Faith is a personal issue - you don’t convert because someone else does. Your faith is not true or false because someone else converted into or out of your religion.

For every Christian priest who converts to Islam, there is a a Muslim who converted to Christianity. There is a celebrated case of an al-Azhar sheikh who converted to Christianity but the Muslims never tell you about him. He was Sheikh Muhammad Mansour who converted to Christianity in 1894 and chose the name Michael.

There is also a recent al-Azhar scholar who converted to Christianity but I have forgotten his name.

The growth of Islam is mostly due to demographics and birth rates - not through conversion anyway, at least in the Western world.

In the US, for instance, the estimates range from 20,000 to 100,000 per annum. That is very low consider we have almost 300 million population and we take in 1 million immigrants, mostly Catholics from South America, a year.

There is also evidence that of those converts 75% leave Islam within 5 years. Most converts are black convicts who are converted in jail - where they are vulnerable and are prone to accept a black brotherhood for a sense of gang identity and protection. The other major group of converts are white women marrying Muslims.
 
According to Ibn Humyad- Salamah- Ibn Ishaq: The rest of the apostles were assaulted, viciously exposed to the sun, tortured, and dishonorably paraded. The Roman king, who ruled over them and who was an idol-worshiper, heard this. He was told that a man among the Israelites, subject to his rule, WAS ASSAULTED AND SLAIN. The man had announced to them that he was God’s messenger. He performed miracles, revived the dead and healed the sick. He created a bird of clay, breathed into it, and it flew, by God’s permission. He told them of hidden things. The king exclaimed, ‘But why did you not mention this to me, about him and them? By God, had I known, I would not have let them have a free hand against him!’ Then he sent for the apostles and snatched them from the hands of the Israelites. He asked the apostles about the faith of Jesus and about his fate. They told him, whereupon he embraced their faith. The king released Sergius, and concealed him. He took **THE WOODEN CROSS WHICH JESUS HAD BEEN CRUCIFIED, AND HE HONORED AND PRESERVED IT BECAUSE JESUS HAD TOUCHED IT. **The king became thus became an enemy of the Israelites, and killed many of them. From this arose Christianity in Rome." (Tabari, pp. 123-124)

According to Ibn Humayd - Ibn Ishaq, an impeccable authority - Wahb bin Munabbih al-Yamani: **God allowed Jesus the son of Mary, to die at three o-clock in the day; then He took him unto Himself." **al-Tabari vol.4 p.112

:whacky:
 
inJESUS said:
According to Ibn Humyad- Salamah- Ibn Ishaq: The rest of the apostles were assaulted, viciously exposed to the sun, tortured, and dishonorably paraded. The Roman king, who ruled over them and who was an idol-worshiper, heard this. He was told that a man among the Israelites, subject to his rule, WAS ASSAULTED AND SLAIN. The man had announced to them that he was God’s messenger. He performed miracles, revived the dead and healed the sick. He created a bird of clay, breathed into it, and it flew, by God’s permission. He told them of hidden things. The king exclaimed, ‘But why did you not mention this to me, about him and them? By God, had I known, I would not have let them have a free hand against him!’ Then he sent for the apostles and snatched them from the hands of the Israelites. He asked the apostles about the faith of Jesus and about his fate. They told him, whereupon he embraced their faith. The king released Sergius, and concealed him. He took **THE WOODEN CROSS WHICH JESUS HAD BEEN CRUCIFIED, AND HE HONORED AND PRESERVED IT BECAUSE JESUS HAD TOUCHED IT. **The king became thus became an enemy of the Israelites, and killed many of them. From this arose Christianity in Rome." (Tabari, pp. 123-124)

According to Ibn Humayd - Ibn Ishaq, an impeccable authority - Wahb bin Munabbih al-Yamani: **God allowed Jesus the son of Mary, to die at three o-clock in the day; then He took him unto Himself." **al-Tabari vol.4 p.112

:whacky:
Click to expand...
AAAAAHHHHHH!!

“(Guess who’s) are highly illogical…”😆
You’ve brought my faith to new heights inJESUS. God Bless you!! (still laughing)…
 
There are plenty of ahadith that will make you really laugh 😃 but let’s not derail the thread and for charity’s sake ( hard when it comes to people insulting Jesus but well, am trying :o )
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top