What is the pull of Islam?

  • Thread starter Thread starter rien
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Hi rien:

I find your posts very fascinating. Why? Because a little over three months ago I converted to Islam - and for the next three months of my life, I was miserable.

There’s a lot of beauty about Islam, ranging from the connection of the community, the strict devotion to no one but God, and even holidays such as Ramadan have a mystical appeal to them, I’ll grant you. On the surface, it’s a very simplistic religion relatively free from scandal (aside from terrorists and insurgents), but, at it’s core, is a very confused religion. Not only that, but in the West, and as a Westerner, our scope of Islam is particularly limited. Many Western Muslims either condemn or attempt to justify the actions perpetrated in Islamic countries such as Saudia Arabia or Iran, and they are right to do so, but (in truth), while the message of Islam preaches one thing, its adherents practice another. You may sense the same thing in some Christians: Jesus preached one thing but Christians act another way. This is human nature, for one, and is a reason why you shouldn’t judge a religion based on who practices it, but on what the religion preaches. Do you accept a religion that condemns someone to death by stoning for adultery, or a religion that teaches foregiveness and compassion for the weak in spirit?

You cite that large numbers of people are converting to Islam - but have you stopped to consider the number of Muslims who are converting to Christianity? I can vouch for this because several Muslims have e-mailed friends of mine and said, willingly, “I’m leaving Islam and converting to Catholicism.” I know that you’re in a period of your life where you’re feeling that your “cradle religion” has let you down, where you see the world of men acting in un-Christian ways, etc. But if your source and basis for all of this is the media, then you need to stop and consider that even the media is guilty of tunnel vision. How often have you read a story about Catholics who work soup kitchens every weekend? Or how often have you heard about the good Catholic lady who rescued a whole shelter of kittens from euthanasia out of the goodness of her heart? Rarely if ever, I suspect. Instead, the media, like any good tabloid, loves to focus on scandal, it loves to sling mud, and it loves to uncover what’s wrong with anything - whether that thing be politics, education, or even religion.

If you focus on the world of men, then yes, you’re going to see flaws, even in the Church - and as a Christian, you should understand why…because we are imperfect and sinful. The only perfect beings are God and Jesus Christ, and the only sinless individuals are Jesus and his mother, the Blessed Virgin Mary. Muslims believe and claim that Muhammed, like Jesus, was sinless - but after engaging in an online discussion with several Muslims, I not only uncovered hadith (“sayings of the prophet”) which record that even Muhammed was once an idolater, but that it is a complete logical fallacy that Muhammed should claim to be sinless. What does it matter that Muhammed is not sinless after all, you may be asking yourself? It matters for two reasons: the first reason is because Muhammed calls all Muslims to love him more than one’s own self (Who does that sound like? Sounds to be like Muhammed wants to usurp Jesus’ throne…) - and the second reason is because it is doctrine to believe that Muhammed was sinless…and I, along with a few others, were able to systematically prove it is a false doctrine. This should matter to you because the Church Fathers have repeatedly, time and again, proven the sinlessness and perfection of Christ…and it is a fact which even Muslims cannot dispute.
 
Islam is not the great euphoria you might think it to be. Sure, there are some people who have been able to assimilate into the religion fairly easily and without too much trial - but the stories you’re not reading about are the ones where the conversion process did not happen without an intense emotional trial. In fact, I knew (and still know) a girl who converted to Islam a little over a year ago and she experienced the worst emotional rollercoaster for the next 6-8 months that I pray nobody should ever have to endure. For 6-8 months she had to deal with the fact that she rejected Christ in favor of the man Muhammed. For the next 6-8 she had to deal with the fact that she felt as if she betrayed God, and was no better than Judas. In fact, she’s still Muslim, but anyone who knows her can tell she’s still unhappy and unsatisfied with life, and she spends much more of her time trying to convince herself why she’s not Christian than she does praising the unity of Islam. You may find it hard to believe, but she doesn’t even accept the Muslim teaching regarding Jesus’ lack of crucifixion…a teaching all Muslims are required to accept for no other reason than for Christ to be crucified would undermine the crux of all of Islam - and yet we have solid historical proof of Christ’s crucifixion.

If the unity of Islam were so great, then why do I know Muslim sisters whose husbands have left them for other women with no financial support, and other Muslims are not helping? If the unity of Islam is so great, how come, during the time period I was Muslim, I didn’t see more brothers and sisters welcoming all converts instead of hanging out with their designated ethnic group? If the unity of Islam is so great, why are so many leaving?

Please be aware during your time reading material by Islamic scholars and non-Christians that when you are doing so then you are reading about Islam justified by Islam. It’s called “circular reasoning,” and it’s faulty. Anytime a non-Muslim scholar attempts to study the history of Islam, he/she immediately gets branded an Orientalist and their (often high-quality research) gets consigned to the level of “junk” by Muslims simply because it doesn’t fit with what Qur’an tells them. Christianity, on the other hand, has endured 2000 years of criticism by heretics, secularists, historians, and even philosophers…and the Church has not only learned from these criticisms, but it still holds strong. In your studies, compare this to Islam which is deathly afraid of any criticism.

You may be asking yourself, now, ‘Why did you convert to Islam when you originally thought all of these things?’ But you must realize that I did not originally think these things, but it was only when I was in through the doors of Islam that I began to realize the amount of hypocrisy, the amount of needless bashing of all non-Muslims (including Christians and Jews), and the fact that Muhammed was truly no prophet but just a very intelligent man who was capable of transforming the theologies of Christianity and Judaism into a system pragmatic enough for 7th century Arabs. When I realized this, my soul ached, I cried and I cried because I acknowledged that I had turned my back on the true God for the non-truth. It was at this point that I returned back to Catholicism in full force because I, for one, recognize the truth that Jesus, as God, who died for our sins, preached.
 
I’m confused on one point.

Why would anyone hold the aborrent actions of some Catholics (such as in the priest scandal) against the religion, but then ignore the abhorrent actions of Muslims (such as terrorists)?

What am I missing? Why is one elevated to representative of the religion and the other not?
 
I’m confused on one point.

Why would anyone hold the aborrent actions of some Catholics (such as in the priest scandal) against the religion, but then ignore the abhorrent actions of Muslims (such as terrorists)?

What am I missing? Why is one elevated to representative of the religion and the other not?
or why would one change his religion because the West is immoral? will his conversion make the West moral?
 
I think part of the pull of Islam is that it is new to many westerners. A person can practice the faith without being made fun of by western media.

In a generation or two it will be interesting to see how Islam stands up to the same scrutiny and mockery that Christians put up with for following their faith.
Western media are scared silly by the thoughts of retribution of Muslims if their faith is denigrated. At least the Muslims back up their beliefs by trying to control those who would make fun at their expense and the threat of retribution weighs heavy in the secular media world.
 
I’m having a very tought time buying into the authenticity of this thread.

The original poster seems to be a cradle Muslim pretending to have been a Christian of every major branch. What happened to the links of supposed “mass conversions of Slavs, Russian priests, and fundamentalists in the South U.S.” (see his claim in post #5). Where’s the proof?

“Door-to-door Muslim missionaries”? I still have never heard of friendly Muslim missionaries in the first place…? I’m still trying to be fair by convincing myself that Islam must have spread through missionary activity throughout the ages, and not conquest, but there’s hardly any historical account of authentic, peaceful, and large-scale Islamic missionary activity. So far it seems Islam had spread rapidly by 3 factors - conquest and quick implementation of Islamic rulers and governements, (this still goes on today ie: Somalia, Islamic Rep. of Iran, Hezbollah in southern Lebanon) severe penalties of renouncing Islam or marrying outside the faith, and the current enormously high birth rates among Muslim nations.

What’s the pull of Islam? - that its a reactionary belief system aimed at simplifying and eliminating Divine mysteries (such as God’s immanence, the priesthood, the Sacraments, the Incarnation, etc.) while relaxing the moral code towards others, thus appealing to those who don’t understand or want the profound of God.
 
My little bit regarding the lure of Islam …yes, its seeming simplicity may be a factor …like that fruit in The Garden , that the tempter ask Adam and Eve to have …may be nothing siginificant seemed lost to them at the time - other than a feeling of shame and the alienation between them as well the loss of trust towards The Father and thus wanting to make covers for themselves …yet we can see the effects of that fall down through centuries …

Or we have King Solomon…filled with wisdom (? of mostly human / worldly kind ) and yet in the end , fell away - did not have a heart filled with love for God …

Mohammed himself portray the same - the violence and immorality that came to be part of his later years !

In trying to decide between the two faiths, the easiest path might be - take some of the best in either faith and ask - where does the Way lead to …lives filled with love and dedication …even for the enemies, or life of being more and more under seemingly easy to follow rules , yet is the focus on truly loving God with all heart ( and inturn All that belong to Him )…or life of more and more rigid rules …later leading to forced conversions , urge to kill off all who do not fit the mold , then turning on each other …

The care and discipline as well as the structure - the need for that Father authority that possibly the mosques and mullahs provide also is a lure … which sadly, in The Church , for the time being is obscured by sensationalism and more …also , having more of a freedom, to be at ones own level of spiritual growth, is sadly neglected by many …

yet, we hope, times are coming - when The Father will be glorified more and more in The Church …

As to our Lord’s prayer , that ’ they be one that the world may believe ’ - well , our Lord’s words , as the author Himself , have its share of Mystery …for the believing world , (and there are many ! ) that see The One Church and rejoice - for its abundant and heroic saints …miracles …and Truth …and love …yes , we love the children of Islam as well ( how could we not - esp. since Islam is a heresy from The Church ) and always , include in the prayers - ’ have mercy on us and the whole world ’ - yes the prietsly role of The Church, for the whole world …that benefit from it ; from the lives of countless priests …in mission lands and inner cities , jails and hospitals and those who and work and pray with them !

Peace !
 
I think some people are drawn to Islam because it empowers the male ego. True respect for women is a non issue in Islam. Violence in the name of God is a good thing. Hate is allowed against certain countries and races and religions.

Everything the male ego needs to be inflated with Gods permission <-----(very tempting). Yet if these Islamic converts watched a few Taliban executions on the internet they might run screaming into there nearest Catholic Church.

I wonder what the retention rate is on Islamic converts. Many people are searching and experimenting these days because they are thirsting for spirituality in there lives.

-D
 
I’m confused on one point.

Why would anyone hold the aborrent actions of some Catholics (such as in the priest scandal) against the religion, but then ignore the abhorrent actions of Muslims (such as terrorists)?

What am I missing? Why is one elevated to representative of the religion and the other not?
Exactly!👍
 
Salaam Darrel;
40.png
Darrel:
I think some people are drawn to Islam because it empowers the male ego. True respect for women is a non issue in Islam.
What if I tell you that in 5 converts, 4 are female! This is despite all the propaganda about how Islam oppresses women.

Salaam.
Joseph.
 
Salaam Darrel;

What if I tell you that in 5 converts, 4 are female! This is despite all the propaganda about how Islam oppresses women.

Salaam.
Joseph.
Many of the converts in the US are female. Lots of these gullible women are emotionally unstable, before they “fall in love” with some Muslim who sweet-talks them into marrying and later forces them to convert.

And I know it’s standard practice in Islam to label any facts you don’t like “propaganda” but the plain truth is that Islam has several explicit teachings which oppress women. Denying it won’t change anything.
 
Salaam Darrel;

What if I tell you that in 5 converts, 4 are female! This is despite all the propaganda about how Islam oppresses women.

Salaam.
Joseph.
Is that true? I’d like to see documented evidence of this 4 in 5 claim. Thanks. All we hear is “it is said…” But who’s saying it? If true, why? Need data, thanks again.

What I do know though, is that more Muslim females are becoming suicide bombers in Iraq, Palestine, Russia, and elsewhere. And these female suicide bombers are coming from many nations including European.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_suicide_bomber

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Widows

news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/12/1213_041213_tv_suicide_bombers.html

militantislammonitor.org/article/id/1353
 
Salaam Exolare;
40.png
exoflare:
Many of the converts in the US are female. Lots of these gullible women are emotionally unstable, before they “fall in love” with some Muslim who sweet-talks them into marrying and later forces them to convert.
There is nothing you can do about it, it is happening every day, probably as we speak; and wait for the BIG DAY, I feel it very near.
And I know it’s standard practice in Islam to label any facts you don’t like “propaganda” but the plain truth is that Islam has several explicit teachings which oppress women. Denying it won’t change anything.
OK, it is not propaganda, you are telling the truth.
You can’t imagine the huge brain power which is put into attacking Islam from every angle possible. Where is the result? More converts! Truth stands from falsehood.
Typical Muslim triumphalism isn’t it.

Salaam.
Joseph.
 
Many of the converts in the US are female. Lots of these gullible women are emotionally unstable, before they “fall in love” with some Muslim who sweet-talks them into marrying and later forces them to convert.

And I know it’s standard practice in Islam to label any facts you don’t like “propaganda” but the plain truth is that Islam has several explicit teachings which oppress women. Denying it won’t change anything.
it is true that many females convert because of a man they want to marry and vice versa. Am not sure though if these women knew that Allah allows men to beat disobediant women.
 
Well, Joseph, your personal pride is not up on trial here. Don’t feel so compelled to defend the indefensible when you don’t even have to…
 
Joseph, at first I thought you were just being sarcastic in that last reply. Now I’m starting to think it may have been serious? :confused:
 
No Joseph it is not about triumphalism…we people do NOT care about numbers, especially that Jesus told us beforehand that we must endure till the end and warned us about false prophets deceiving even the elect; so that’s really no problem to people who know their faith.

It is much easier to know about non-Muslims converting to Islam because no one gets life threat. It is the huge numbers of Muslims who convert to Christianity without declaring it that makes people think nothing is happening.

Muslims themselves admit that 75% of converts to Islam leave it within 5 years and are wondering about the massives of Muslims converting each year to Christianity. These are Muslims talking on Al-Jazeera, not propaganda. But again, if they convert we feel happy for they found the true path, not to boast about it cuz boasting means that someone needs others to convince himself.
 
I’m still trying to be fair by convincing myself that Islam must have spread through missionary activity throughout the ages, and not conquest, but there’s hardly any historical account of authentic, peaceful, and large-scale Islamic missionary activity.
Southeast Asia/Indonesia; much of Africa; and parts of Central Asia (some areas were conquered, but Islam spread way beyond those areas if I’m not mistaken). The Mongols converted to Islam after conquering the Muslims!

The “central” Islamic lands were conquered first and then converted; in the more peripheral areas (outside the contested frontier with Christianity) it was often the other way round.

Edwin
 
Am not sure though if these women knew that Allah allows men to beat disobediant women.
They know. Although mine is not disobediant, I beat her twice a day, in the morning and in the evening ; she obeys Allah, she does not retaliate.🙂 The day she does, I am dead.:love:

Salaam.
Joseph.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top