What is truth?

[Don_Hepler]

I believe that truth has been lost, though we all claim to have it. We even will argue, and claim low here or low there. Come listen to me, not to them. they don’t have it. Where do we get the authority, to claim pure truth. The Savior is not here to straighten your minds on the subject, and If he were here, who of all would recognize him? I have seen many so call painting of him, by artist who would like to think that this is him ( likeness.) Do you think he would listen to your arguments even now. You hold this Bible in your hand, everyone holds it, and yet you all speak a different language concerning it.
You claim authority, and what is that? Authority, to do what? To some, you claim a direct line. History is nothing but someones opinion. You cannot trace authority. it is not on paper, it is not a certificate. It is a unseen power, that can heal the blind, the deaf, the mute, the withered hand, the dead raised to life again. The Authority of God cannot be passed on from one wicked man to another. A man, that has true authority will continue to do what Christ did when he was here. He will do the same, that is how you will know who really has what he professes. There will be no sick among you. If you truly believe what is written. Ask, what really is in your heart. Do you really believe in Christ, those who are sick, ask this question, do you really believe, if so, why is there so much confusion among you. God is not a God of confusion. Why are you still arguing over truths, is it because you know not the Master? Get prepared for he is coming. And if you are not ready to receive his light, because you have not truly repented, you will know you were preaching false doctrine. Can you afford, really afford to lead the pure in heart astray with your philosophy mingled with scripture?

 

[FightingFat]

Hi Don!

I believe that truth has been lost, though we all claim to have it. We even will argue, and claim low here or low there. Come listen to me, not to them. they don’t have it. Where do we get the authority, to claim pure truth. The Savior is not here to straighten your minds on the subject,

That is why we must retain an authentic Apostolic nature to our faith. In all her teachings, the Church looks to an Apostolic source. In this way, she does not deviate from the deposit of faith God made through Jesus to the disciples by His spoken word.

and If he were here, who of all would recognize him? I have seen many so call painting of him, by artist who would like to think that this is him ( likeness.) Do you think he would listen to your arguments even now. You hold this Bible in your hand, everyone holds it, and yet you all speak a different language concerning it.

Hopefully, he would recognise the faith he deposited and the Church he established by the four marks and by the eucharist. If you believe in God, you must believe that he had an intention that the message of the Gosepel should endure, or else why should He send His son? He promised the Holy Spirit would watch over and guide His Church, and that the Church would never be overcome, so we have faith.

You claim authority, and what is that? Authority, to do what?

Authority to make Christ visable to all peoples. Authority to preach the Gospel in integrity.

To some, you claim a direct line. History is nothing but someones opinion. You cannot trace authority. it is not on paper, it is not a certificate. It is a unseen power, that can heal the blind, the deaf, the mute, the withered hand, the dead raised to life again. The Authority of God cannot be passed on from one wicked man to another. A man, that has true authority will continue to do what Christ did when he was here. He will do the same, that is how you will know who really has what he professes. There will be no sick among you. If you truly believe what is written. Ask, what really is in your heart. Do you really believe in Christ, those who are sick, ask this question, do you really believe,

If you study the story of the Bible you will see that many are called but few follow. The history of Israel is one of covenant promise and redemption. A history of failure, of God’s goodness and man’s turning away.

if so, why is there so much confusion among you.

Is there? If there is I don’t see it! Last week I was in Montriond in the French Alps and was able to go to mass on Sunday and join in with everything. In fact I can walk into a Catholic Church any where in the world and know that they will be in communion with me. Is that confusion??? Can anyone else say the same?

God is not a God of confusion.

But the adversary is and he is hard at work here I think!

Why are you still arguing over truths, is it because you know not the Master? Get prepared for he is coming. And if you are not ready to receive his light, because you have not truly repented, you will know you were preaching false doctrine. Can you afford, really afford to lead the pure in heart astray with your philosophy mingled with scripture?

I think that last statement there illustrates that you know you are right and everyone else is wrong. Fundamentalism is a dangerous position where ever you meet it my friend. Only a sith deals in absolutes

 

[fellowChristian]

Just something about Authority

Luke 10:16

16 “He who hears you hears Me, and he who rejects you rejects Me, and he who rejects Me rejects Him who sent Me.”

And there it is in Scripture!

Authority from the Father given to the Son and from the Son to men.

And what does the Son say?

Reject the men,reject Him and the Father.

**Matthew 16:19 **
19"I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."

“whatever you” Why didn’t Jesus say “whatever I”?.

Luke 9

1And He called the twelve together, and **gave them power and authority **over all the demons and to heal diseases.

Can Jesus do that?

He’s God.He can do it however He wants

**Matthew 10:40 **

40"He who receives you receives** Me**, and he who receives **Me **receives Him who sent Me.

There it is again! Jesus saying that if we reject the men whom He gave authority we reject the Son and the Father!

**Matthew 18:18 **

18"Truly I say to you, **whatever you **bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven; and **whatever you **loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.

What ever they decide on earth is still in effect in heaven.Jesus did not say “whatever** I** bind on earth”

John 13:20

20"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who receives **whomever I send receives Me; and he who receives Me receives Him who sent Me." **

**“Whomever”! **
The choice is not up to us!

List of Popes
newadvent.org/cathen/12272b.htm

How old is your church?
staycatholic.com/how_old_is_your_church.htm

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

“What is truth?”

This is the same question Pontius Pilate asked Jesus.

All while he has Truth standing right before his very yes…

 

[Don_Hepler]

I want to thank you for your quick response. I do not question what you quote from the scriptrues, Gandaifthewhite/ for they are true. But now that I have your minds, lets see what we see. Fightingfat. Thank you, I to am a fighter. I am a instructor in Wing Chun Kung Fu. And you know that this Art of fighting is the only one and true religion. Just kidding. Let us reason for a moment. I have enjoyed fighting since I was 10. I started out in Judo, then GoJu Kai Karate, then Aikido, then Sholin Kung Fu, and end up in Wing Chun because with all my knowledge in the art of fighting, I could not beat Wing Chun. They were fast, and I couldn’t hit them. Though each art has it’s truths in fighting ( by the way I wrestled in high school and college.) and are very effective, and though I study for many years in these arts. thinking that this was the best one, the only true one. I ventured out and found the best of the arts and spent 15 years training. I look back and can see the beauty of these arts but there is only one that trains you how to fight. But look around us, look at all the faiths. They are all good but there is only one true faith. And unless you are willing to look around to test the waters and are not afraid of the gangs, the doctrines, afraid to give up one fighting art for another, that all your training in one art is enough for you, that you couldn’t conceive giving up in all that training and start at the bottom. If you are willing to grow to expand your understanding, to enlarge your vision. And are willing to train with the best, Then I invite you to listen, and ponder, and pray

 

[FightingFat]

I want to thank you for your quick response. I do not question what you quote from the scriptrues, Gandaifthewhite/ for they are true. But now that I have your minds, lets see what we see. Fightingfat. Thank you, I to am a fighter. I am a instructor in Wing Chun Kung Fu. And you know that this Art of fighting is the only one and true religion. Just kidding. Let us reason for a moment. I have enjoyed fighting since I was 10. I started out in Judo, then GoJu Kai Karate, then Aikido, then Sholin Kung Fu, and end up in Wing Chun because with all my knowledge in the art of fighting, I could not beat Wing Chun. They were fast, and I couldn’t hit them. Though each art has it’s truths in fighting ( by the way I wrestled in high school and college.) and are very effective, and though I study for many years in these arts. thinking that this was the best one, the only true one. I ventured out and found the best of the arts and spent 15 years training. I look back and can see the beauty of these arts but there is only one that trains you how to fight. But look around us, look at all the faiths. They are all good but there is only one true faith. And unless you are willing to look around to test the waters and are not afraid of the gangs, the doctrines, afraid to give up one fighting art for another, that all your training in one art is enough for you, that you couldn’t conceive giving up in all that training and start at the bottom. If you are willing to grow to expand your understanding, to enlarge your vision. And are willing to train with the best, Then I invite you to listen, and ponder, and pray

Thanks Don, nice analogy and I agree 100% with what you say as it happens. I also started training early and wandered through a few styles learning as I went, bizzarely we have a lot in common- I studied judo from 7 to about 11, Goju Kai for 6 years, quite a bit of ju-jitsu and ended up with Wing Chun.

Same is true of my theological searching. I have prayed, I have pondered and I have listened and I am a Catholic because nothing else could beat it, because I believe it is the one true faith and because it brings me closer to Jesus than anything I have experienced before. So where do we go from here my friend?

 

[Don_Hepler]

Who’s your Sifu? Isn’t Wing Chun the most awesome powerful fighting system?
Let’s see where shell we go? well with your background in wing chun this maybe a little challenging, however I am a Jo Gau and will become a Sifu (maybe) Lets take a look at this a little differently.
Everyone believes in Jesus, that is a no brainer. however I have studied the Catholic church and several others along the way. I use to date Catholic Girls in my growing up years. I would attend church with them and I would talk to their Fathers and found them interesting. I am going to approach this a little differently. When I was training in Wing Chun my Sifu brought Ip Ching to our summer camp, I believe, for the reason, was to show our true lineage to the students. While we were in the training, Ip Ching took some time to tell us the Story about his father Yip Man, and those who trained with him the true master. He said that many of these students would quite before they were really trained. They went out and started schools claiming they could train you in true Wing Chun. And that they had the authority and lineage to Yip Man. He said (Ip Ching) how these students would for money train them in want we would call watered fighting art. They change the forms, and the principals. Do you see where I am going with this. They claimed authority which they did not have, they were good fighters, and if you didn’t know the truth behind the deceivers, you would say this is true Wing Chun. There is a picture of Yip Man and my sifu looks good. But can their authority and lineage truly be traced. But Yip Man said, when these students came in contact with his students, it told a different story. Now there are many Wing Chun Schools All claiming they have the true lineage but are not. How do you tell?, by their fighting skills, you don’t change the fighting skills. and the true lineage of the instructor who teaches true fighting principals. True lineage can be traced. But if the master dies and the lineage also. Then you will only have deceivers playing the part that they are the trainers. That the master past it on to me, just before he died. From then on we believe. Ponder it.

 

[mawwee]

I would venture to say that truth has not been lost… even though the rise of relativism causes so many people to question that the notion of truth even exists. Talking to people at university has shown me that even though many students claim ‘there is no truth, we only have opinions but never objective answers’… these very same people do still believe in justice. They still recognise that there are certain things in the world that go against justice… autrocities, torture, rape, murder etc. By believing in justice, one also believes in truth, as one recognises that there can be an ultimate right and wrong. The moral shades of grey in between is what causes confusion.

As for authority… that is where faith comes in. As Catholics we have faith that the Holy Spirit has inspired Church teachings. The authority is therefore not from the people within the Church, but from God Himself.

 

[FightingFat]

Who’s your Sifu?

James Sinclair www.ukwingchun.com

Isn’t Wing Chun the most awesome powerful fighting system?

It can be, certainly

Let’s see where shell we go? well with your background in wing chun this maybe a little challenging, however I am a Jo Gau and will become a Sifu (maybe) Lets take a look at this a little differently.
Everyone believes in Jesus, that is a no brainer. however I have studied the Catholic church and several others along the way. I use to date Catholic Girls in my growing up years. I would attend church with them and I would talk to their Fathers and found them interesting. I am going to approach this a little differently. When I was training in Wing Chun my Sifu brought Ip Ching to our summer camp, I believe, for the reason, was to show our true lineage to the students. While we were in the training, Ip Ching took some time to tell us the Story about his father Yip Man, and those who trained with him the true master. He said that many of these students would quite before they were really trained. They went out and started schools claiming they could train you in true Wing Chun. And that they had the authority and lineage to Yip Man. He said (Ip Ching) how these students would for money train them in want we would call watered fighting art. They change the forms, and the principals. Do you see where I am going with this. They claimed authority which they did not have, they were good fighters, and if you didn’t know the truth behind the deceivers, you would say this is true Wing Chun. There is a picture of Yip Man and my sifu looks good. But can their authority and lineage truly be traced. But Yip Man said, when these students came in contact with his students, it told a different story. Now there are many Wing Chun Schools All claiming they have the true lineage but are not. How do you tell?, by their fighting skills, you don’t change the fighting skills. and the true lineage of the instructor who teaches true fighting principals. True lineage can be traced. But if the master dies and the lineage also. Then you will only have deceivers playing the part that they are the trainers. That the master past it on to me, just before he died. From then on we believe. Ponder it.

1. I think that Ip lineage is the most watered down nonsense out there…Well, perhaps apart from Leung Ting.
2. If you tell a WC lineage by its fighting skills then in your analogy you tell Christianity by the fruits of the spirit…I’m still voting Catholic

 

[Don_Hepler]

Hi Don!

That is why we must retain an authentic Apostolic nature to our faith. In all her teachings, the Church looks to an Apostolic source. In this way, she does not deviate from the deposit of faith God made through Jesus to the disciples by His spoken word.

Hopefully, he would recognise the faith he deposited and the Church he established by the four marks and by the eucharist. If you believe in God, you must believe that he had an intention that the message of the Gosepel should endure, or else why should He send His son? He promised the Holy Spirit would watch over and guide His Church, and that the Church would never be overcome, so we have faith.

Authority to make Christ visable to all peoples. Authority to preach the Gospel in integrity.

If you study the story of the Bible you will see that many are called but few follow. The history of Israel is one of covenant promise and redemption. A history of failure, of God’s goodness and man’s turning away.

Is there? If there is I don’t see it! Last week I was in Montriond in the French Alps and was able to go to mass on Sunday and join in with everything. In fact I can walk into a Catholic Church any where in the world and know that they will be in communion with me. Is that confusion??? Can anyone else say the same?

But the adversary is and he is hard at work here I think!

I think that last statement there illustrates that you know you are right and everyone else is wrong. Fundamentalism is a dangerous position where ever you meet it my friend. Only a sith deals in absolutes

Are you talking about Christ dealing with the high priests. He being right they being wrong. Sometimes truth is hard when one eventually realizes that one has live a life of deception and not known it. (doesn’t a sith play in movies?)

 

[FightingFat]

Are you talking about Christ dealing with the high priests. He being right they being wrong. Sometimes truth is hard when one eventually realizes that one has live a life of deception and not known it. (doesn’t a sith play in movies?)

Yeah totally.

I think that you’re right. But I am more interested in my relationship with God than with the Church. I pray, I study the Bible and I work on my relationship with Jesus. I live my life through Christ. Am I still wrong? Aren’t we walking the same path?

 

[FightingFat]

BTW Heard about Wan Kam Leung’s visit to the UK?

ukwingchun.com/News.htm

Looks like a great day!

 

[davidv]

Yeah totally.

I think that you’re right. But I am more interested in my relationship with God than with the Church. I pray, I study the Bible and I work on my relationship with Jesus. I live my life through Christ. Am I still wrong? Aren’t we walking the same path?

Jesus’s relationships extended beyond the one He had with the Father. If we are to follow Him, our relationships also must extend beyond “me and Jesus”. This must include a community of faithful. In community, an agreed upon way of acting and interacting is essential. So, it is possible that we are walking the same path, but the probabilty that is the same is much smaller if it doesn’t include the community.

 

[FightingFat]

Jesus’s relationships extended beyond the one He had with the Father. If we are to follow Him, our relationships also must extend beyond “me and Jesus”. This must include a community of faithful. In community, an agreed upon way of acting and interacting is essential. So, it is possible that we are walking the same path, but the probabilty that is the same is much smaller if it doesn’t include the community.

Absolutley, and in fact Gadium et Spes makes man’s social nature explicit!

I’m trying to point out that my relationship with God would come before my adherance to any earthly institution.

 

[davidv]

Absolutley, and in fact Gadium et Spes makes man’s social nature explicit!

I’m trying to point out that my relationship with God would come before my adherance to any earthly institution.

If the Church were just “any earthly institution” than i would agree with you completely. But as a Catholic, I understand the Church to be much more than that. The Church is the body of Jesus here on earth.

 

[Don_Hepler]

Just something about Authority

Luke 10:16

16 “He who hears you hears Me, and he who rejects you rejects Me, and he who rejects Me rejects Him who sent Me.”

And there it is in Scripture!

Authority from the Father given to the Son and from the Son to men.

And what does the Son say?

Reject the men,reject Him and the Father.

**Matthew 16:19 **
19"I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."

“whatever you” Why didn’t Jesus say “whatever I”?.

Luke 9

1And He called the twelve together, and **gave them power and authority **over all the demons and to heal diseases.

Can Jesus do that?

He’s God.He can do it however He wants

**Matthew 10:40 **

40"He who receives you receives** Me**, and he who receives **Me **receives Him who sent Me.

There it is again! Jesus saying that if we reject the men whom He gave authority we reject the Son and the Father!

**Matthew 18:18 **

18"Truly I say to you, **whatever you **bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven; and **whatever you **loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.

What ever they decide on earth is still in effect in heaven.Jesus did not say “whatever** I** bind on earth”

John 13:20

20"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who receives **whomever I send receives Me; and he who receives Me receives Him who sent Me." **

**“Whomever”! **
The choice is not up to us!

List of Popes
newadvent.org/cathen/12272b.htm

How old is your church?
staycatholic.com/how_old_is_your_church.htm

Hello Fellow Christian: Quoting Scriptures is one thing. But true authority from God is another topic. In Math 3:11
I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire.
This is an example, John did not have the authority to give the Holy Ghost only the authority to baptism. We are not talking about scripture authority dealing with someone knowing more than the other, but a ordain man from God. Acts 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power…There must be a literal anointing of this power… John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you,…Christ must do the choosing and you must be ordained to this power. If the Holy Ghost comes upon a person, he is only bearing witness of the truth that is in the scriptures, but he will not bear witness, that this church is true and that this church is true and this one over here is true, for there is no confusion in him nor is there in God. There is only one truth, and only one path… straight and narrow and there is only one authority, govern by him and through him and of him. God does not give his authority to anyone, just because he wants it. But he must be chosen of God himself. I am not interested in how well you know the scriptures, the Baptists, the church of Christ, Catholics, Know them as well, This does not capture me, I am not interested in someone dazzling my mind, who can quote scripture and know not the meaning of how it applies. You are dealing with a 2000 year old book written by cleaver Jews, in a translated verison hoping the translation is correct. I guess that is why Revelations was shoved in the back, because, maybe no one could figure it out. Except the JW HA HA HA, I am sorry, they want so bad for their prediction to come true. But someday, they will say “I told you so” and they will be happy. I hope this explains my point of view. I give this to you to ponder. Some thing caught my eye at the bottom “How old is your church” Does that hold water? The question is where is your authority line. Trace it, if you can.

 

[Don_Hepler]

I would venture to say that truth has not been lost… even though the rise of relativism causes so many people to question that the notion of truth even exists. Talking to people at university has shown me that even though many students claim ‘there is no truth, we only have opinions but never objective answers’… these very same people do still believe in justice. They still recognise that there are certain things in the world that go against justice… autrocities, torture, rape, murder etc. By believing in justice, one also believes in truth, as one recognises that there can be an ultimate right and wrong. The moral shades of grey in between is what causes confusion.

As for authority… that is where faith comes in. As Catholics we have faith that the Holy Spirit has inspired Church teachings. The authority is therefore not from the people within the Church, but from God Himself.

I am interested in the Name MAWWEE, are you Native American? Ya ta hay, aw wa shen na

 

[Don_Hepler]

Yeah totally.

I think that you’re right. But I am more interested in my relationship with God than with the Church. I pray, I study the Bible and I work on my relationship with Jesus. I live my life through Christ. Am I still wrong? Aren’t we walking the same path?

Some how I delighted you and I had a little hard time finding you as I am still wonder my way through this forum. I thank you for your honesty. I think we can all say we are trying to follow those paths. I looked at the wing chun site you sent me. I’m impressed. Nice video work, I won’t make any comment. unless you want my thoughts on the school. How can you be wrong, when you are searching to become better in your relationship with the Godhead. I have to go. But later, I would like to talk to you, if that is ok

 

[mawwee]

I am interested in the Name MAWWEE, are you Native American? Ya ta hay, aw wa shen na

No I am not Native American, its my nickname.
What does that phrase mean?

 

[Don_Hepler]

No I am not Native American, its my nickname.
What does that phrase mean?

Greetings and have a great day the God of heaven is with you