what is vatican 2 and why is it contraversal ?

[Reuben_J]

Vatican II is an ecumenical council that is called by the pope. It is ‘ecumenical’ because ALL the bishops of the Catholic Church are involved in it. It was the 21st council of the Church.

Prior to this was the council called Vatican I. Both councils took place in the Vatican basilica rather than the Lateran basilica which is why most councils were called Lateran councils. Vatican I was suspended indefinitely by Pope Pius IX due to the Franco-Prussian War.

Pope John XXIII called for a new council in 1960. Preparation took two years. One of the first orders of ‘business’ was to vote on officially closing Vatican Council I and opening Vatican Council II, which the bishops did.

The council in itself was not controversial but it did open up a dialogue on several fronts, such as ecumenism and establishment of better relations with our Jewish brothers and sisters. It attempted to clarify a theology and the nature of the Church in all aspects of Christian life. One of the major changes was the permission to have the Mass said in the vernacular, and allowing the altar to be turned around facing the people. Traditional Catholics had a very difficult time with these changes. It was only under the present pope and John Paul II that the Latin Mass was promulgated once again as an extraordinary form of the Latin rite.

**The fact was, the Church was in seriously bad shape due to its persecution by Communism for more than half a century, and, in my opinion, the council SAVED the Church. What transpired afterwards would have been far worse if the council had not taken place and direction given. It has been only during the pontificates of popes John Paul II and Benedict XVI that the Church is returning to its roots.

What has been controversial was the total ignorance of what Vatican II documents actually said, and that, in the ‘spirit’ of the Council, all sorts of experimentation in liturgy and religious life was allowed by bishops throughout the world, the result being a mass exodus of Catholics to protestant denominations, low vocations to religious life, and the folding up of many religious orders. One good outcome was a more genuine involvement of the laity within the remnant Church itself, and now a greater evangelization throughout the world**.

Thanks for the information that leads to Vatican II.

Were you there during pre-Vatican II mass?

I totally agree that Vatican II ‘saved’ the Church simply because I believe in a Church that is led by the Holy Spirit and that the ‘Gate of Hell will not prevail against it’. I guess it is easier for us who grew up mainly during post-Vatican II to appreciate it. But I know that Vatican II came at a time when the Church needed the changes to keep with the ever changing trend of people’s spirituality brought about by wars, social changes and new technology.

God bless.

 

[MyRdmrLvs]

Is that not what is being done And was that not the reason that the RCC started in Latin because at that time in History Latin was the chosen language:shrug:

yes they used the common language. great idea! and when that language died out it was an equally great idea to switch to the new common language.

 

[MyRdmrLvs]

I totally agree. What could possibly be the down side of learning another language. I mean the more Education the more places a person can go in this world,

Think of the Job opportunities that we and our Children would have today if they had the honor of learning and reading Latin. I see no negative in this whatsoever.

I would love to be able to read a bible in Latin. I would call that a great gift from the church not a burden. And what would have been Great beings that I went to a Catholic School I could have learned it early in life.

If you want to learn a language to read the Bible in why not Greek or Hebrew so you dont have to read a translation. if you are going to read a translation you might as well read it in English. Sure taking the time to learn a language might enrich your life if its not a dead language!

 

[ralphinal]

If you want to learn a language to read the Bible in why not Greek or Hebrew so you dont have to read a translation. if you are going to read a translation you might as well read it in English. Sure taking the time to learn a language might enrich your life if its not a dead language!

Though Latin is a dead language, it still influences terms in both law and science in English, as well as many words that we use. If one speaks Spanish, Italian, or French, Latin is the base language that these are based on. Therefore, knowing Latin can enrich your life there, too.

As I mentioned earlier, Latin educated students outperform those who have not studied it on standardized tests and in school.

That does not mean that the Church should return the mass to Latin, but you cannot state that learning Latin is a waste of time. ON the contrary, it is very useful