What is wrong with the nanny state?

[LCMS_No_More]

The Bureaucrats ALREADY have bent over backwards double to force us to get rid of mercury thermometers. And now they are forcing us to bring in those compact fluorescent bulbs … and they have TONS of mercury in them. In some places, if you break one, then “legally” you are supposed to call in a haz mat team for the clean up … at YOUR expense.

This is an example of an easily refuted right-wing talking point. Check this out:

epa.gov/mercury/spills/index.htm

What to Do if a Fluorescent Light Bulb Breaks

Compact fluorescent lights (CFLs) are lighting more homes than ever before, and EPA is encouraging Americans to use and recycle them safely. Carefully recycling CFLs prevents the release of mercury into the environment and allows for the reuse of glass, metals and other materials that make up fluorescent lights.

EPA is continually reviewing its clean-up and disposal recommendations for CFLs to ensure that the Agency presents the most up-to-date information for consumers and businesses. Maine’s Department of Environmental Protection released a CFL breakage study report Exit EPA Disclaimer on February 25, 2008. EPA has conducted an initial review of this study and, as a result of this review, we have updated the CFL cleanup instructions below.

Pending the completion of a full review of the Maine study, EPA will determine whether additional changes to the cleanup recommendations are warranted. The agency plans to conduct its own study on CFLs after thorough review of the Maine study.

Fluorescent light bulbs contain a very small amount of mercury sealed within the glass tubing. EPA recommends the following clean-up and disposal guidelines:

Before Clean-up: Ventilate the Room

1. Have people and pets leave the room, and don’t let anyone walk through the breakage area on their way out.
2. Open a window and leave the room for 15 minutes or more.
3. Shut off the central forced-air heating/air conditioning system, if you have one.

Clean-Up Steps for Hard Surfaces

1. Carefully scoop up glass fragments and powder using stiff paper or cardboard and place them in a glass jar with metal lid (such as a canning jar) or in a sealed plastic bag.
2. Use sticky tape, such as duct tape, to pick up any remaining small glass fragments and powder.
3. Wipe the area clean with damp paper towels or disposable wet wipes and place them in the glass jar or plastic bag.
4. Do not use a vacuum or broom to clean up the broken bulb on hard surfaces.

Clean-up Steps for Carpeting or Rug

1. Carefully pick up glass fragments and place them in a glass jar with metal lid (such as a canning jar) or in a sealed plastic bag.
2. Use sticky tape, such as duct tape, to pick up any remaining small glass fragments and powder.
3. If vacuuming is needed after all visible materials are removed, vacuum the area where the bulb was broken.
4. Remove the vacuum bag (or empty and wipe the canister), and put the bag or vacuum debris in a sealed plastic bag.

Disposal of Clean-up Materials

1. Immediately place all cleanup materials outside the building in a trash container or outdoor protected area for the next normal trash.
2. Wash your hands after disposing of the jars or plastic bags containing clean-up materials.
3. Check with your local or state government about disposal requirements in your specific area. Some states prohibit such trash disposal and require that broken and unbroken mercury-containing bulbs be taken to a local recycling center.

Future Cleaning of Carpeting or Rug: Ventilate the Room During and After Vacuuming

1. The next several times you vacuum, shut off the central forced-air heating/air conditioning system and open a window prior to vacuuming.
2. Keep the central heating/air conditioning system shut off and the window open for at least 15 minutes after vacuuming is completed.

Hmmm…nothing about calling in HazMat. The hardest part would be bagging everything up and taking it to a recycling center. Ooh…tough stuff there.

 

[chewchoo]

do you really want someone telling you when to brush your teeth or how to wear your hair? oh, yeah, that’s excessive. but that’s what a nanny state will end up “doing for you”.

with all government, less is more. yes, some individuals may “abuse” certain freedoms, but beaucrats are much more abusive with your freedom.

 

[deb1]

This is an example of an easily refuted right-wing talking point. Check this out:

epa.gov/mercury/spills/index.htm

Hmmm…nothing about calling in HazMat. The hardest part would be bagging everything up and taking it to a recycling center. Ooh…tough stuff there.

I’m I loosing my mind or does the way that we are supposed to clean up these bulbs seem overly tedious just from your post! Right now, I just sweep up a broken, regular bulb and dump it in the trash. I might tell the kids to wear shoes for a short while until I get all the little shards up but we certainly don’t have to leave the room, open a window, turn off air or heating system!

. Have people and pets leave the room, and don’t let anyone walk through the breakage area on their way out.
2. Open a window and leave the room for 15 minutes or more.
3. Shut off the central forced-air heating/air conditioning system, if you have one.

Clean-Up Steps for Hard Surfaces

1. Carefully scoop up glass fragments and powder using stiff paper or cardboard and place them in a glass jar with metal lid (such as a canning jar) or in a sealed plastic bag.
2. Use sticky tape, such as duct tape, to pick up any remaining small glass fragments and powder.
3. Wipe the area clean with damp paper towels or disposable wet wipes and place them in the glass jar or plastic bag.
4. Do not use a vacuum or broom to clean up the broken bulb on hard surfaces.

Clean-up Steps for Carpeting or Rug

1. Carefully pick up glass fragments and place them in a glass jar with metal lid (such as a canning jar) or in a sealed plastic bag.
2. Use sticky tape, such as duct tape, to pick up any remaining small glass fragments and powder.
3. If vacuuming is needed after all visible materials are removed, vacuum the area where the bulb was broken.
4. Remove the vacuum bag (or empty and wipe the canister), and put the bag or vacuum debris in a sealed plastic bag.

Disposal of Clean-up Materials

1. Immediately place all cleanup materials outside the building in a trash container or outdoor protected area for the next normal trash.
2. Wash your hands after disposing of the jars or plastic bags containing clean-up materials.
3. Check with your local or state government about disposal requirements in your specific area. Some states prohibit such trash disposal and require that broken and unbroken mercury-containing bulbs be taken to a local recycling center.

Future Cleaning of Carpeting or Rug: Ventilate the Room During and After Vacuuming

1. The next several times you vacuum, shut off the central forced-air heating/air conditioning system and open a window prior to vacuuming.
2. Keep the central heating/air conditioning system shut off and the window open for at least 15 minutes after vacuuming is completed**

---

 

[vern_humphrey]

A Nanny state creates an enviroment of dependency, dependency on the state. Dependency equals slavery.

And anyone who doesn’t believe that need merely to go into any inner city in our large towns and see the effects of several generations of nanny care.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

I’m I loosing my mind or does the way that we are supposed to clean up these bulbs seem overly tedious just from your post! Right now, I just sweep up a broken, regular bulb and dump it in the trash. I might tell the kids to wear shoes for a short while until I get all the little shards up but we certainly don’t have to leave the room, open a window, turn off air or heating system!

. Have people and pets leave the room, and** don’t let anyone walk through the breakage area on their way out.
2. Open a window and leave the room for 15 minutes or more.
3. Shut off the central forced-air heating/air conditioning system, if you have one.

Clean-Up Steps for Hard Surfaces

1. Carefully scoop up glass fragments and powder using stiff paper or cardboard and place them in a glass jar with metal lid (such as a canning jar) or in a sealed plastic bag.
2. Use sticky tape, such as duct tape, to pick up any remaining small glass fragments and powder.
3. Wipe the area clean with damp paper towels or disposable wet wipes and place them in the glass jar or plastic bag.
4. Do not use a vacuum or broom to clean up the broken bulb on hard surfaces.

Clean-up Steps for Carpeting or Rug

1. Carefully pick up glass fragments and place them in a glass jar with metal lid (such as a canning jar) or in a sealed plastic bag.
2. Use sticky tape, such as duct tape, to pick up any remaining small glass fragments and powder.
3. If vacuuming is needed after all visible materials are removed, vacuum the area where the bulb was broken.
4. Remove the vacuum bag (or empty and wipe the canister), and put the bag or vacuum debris in a sealed plastic bag.

Disposal of Clean-up Materials

1. Immediately place all cleanup materials outside the building in a trash container or outdoor protected area for the next normal trash.
2. Wash your hands after disposing of the jars or plastic bags containing clean-up materials.
3. Check with your local or state government about disposal requirements in your specific area. Some states prohibit such trash disposal and require that broken and unbroken mercury-containing bulbs be taken to a local recycling center.

Future Cleaning of Carpeting or Rug: Ventilate the Room During and After Vacuuming

1. The next several times you vacuum, shut off the central forced-air heating/air conditioning system and open a window prior to vacuuming.
2. Keep the central heating/air conditioning system shut off and the window open for at least 15 minutes after vacuuming is completed

---

Masetti said something that was patently false (you have to get a hazmat team out). I didn’t say it wouldn’t be a little bit more work, I just pointed out that what Masetti said was untrue. Don’t move the goalposts (which is what you just did).

 

[deb1]

Masetti said something that was patently false (you have to get a hazmat team out). I didn’t say it wouldn’t be a little bit more work, I just pointed out that what Masetti said was untrue. Don’t move the goalposts (which is what you just did).

Don’t move the goal posts? No, sorry. You can’t make a statement and then decide how others respond to it.

I wish that we could limit how people respond to our posts. That would make my life a lot easier on this forum.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

Don’t move the goal posts? No, sorry. You can’t make a statement and then decide how others respond to it.

I wish that we could limit how people respond to our posts. That would make my life a lot easier on this forum.

Whatever.

Masetti said that if a CFL breaks in your home, you have to call a hazmat team and pay for it.

I provided evidence that this just isn’t true.

You come in an move the goal post from having to call a hazmat team to doing a few extra steps.

I call you on it.

You complain.

Am I missing something? I don’t think the problem is in what I said, it’s in what Masetti said and your moving the goal posts to make it seem that I’m not being truthful.

Sorry, but that’s not honest.

 

[vz71]

Masetti said something that was patently false (you have to get a hazmat team out). I didn’t say it wouldn’t be a little bit more work, I just pointed out that what Masetti said was untrue. Don’t move the goalposts (which is what you just did).

I believe the goalposts were sufficiently moved with the sarcastic note on your own part…

Ooh…tough stuff there.

Next time you may want to refrain from any commentary more then your intended words.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

I believe the goalposts were sufficiently moved with the sarcastic note on your own part…

Next time you may want to refrain from any commentary more then your intended words.

taking notes

No sense of humor allowed on CAF.

Noted and logged.

 

[Wolseley]

This is an example of an easily refuted right-wing talking point. Check this out:

epa.gov/mercury/spills/index.htm

Hmmm…nothing about calling in HazMat. The hardest part would be bagging everything up and taking it to a recycling center. Ooh…tough stuff there.

One of the sites I work at has an abandoned factory building. The security company who had the contract before we took it over kept encountering crackheads smoking dope inside at night; and crackheads being what they are, they were usually violent and unpredictable, so the officers from the other company, being forbidden to carry anything more than a flashlight, finally got to the point where they refused to enter the building.

Thus, the contract defaulted to us, because we’re an armed company, made up of former police officers and military veterans. In our company, we are required to be armed, and since we took on the contract, we’ve had no problems with crackheads or anyone else. A few have stopped by that used to get lippy with the other company, but when one of us walks out, their eyes tend to rivet on the handgun holstered on the right side, and they usually get very concilatory and docile in a hurry.

However, I digress. I say all of this as background to what I’m about to relate now.

This factory building probably had about 9,000 flourescent bar lights in it, which the crackheads and vandals all smashed, long, long ago. Walking through this building is like walking over crunchy gravel, due to all the smashed light tubes all over the floor. If you tried to clean this mess up according to the guidelines above, you wouldn’t be looking at a big job—you’d be looking at a career.

“I retired from my job after 30 years last week.”

“Oh, yeah? What did you do for a living?”

“I cleaned up smashed flourescent bar lights in an old factory building.”

 

[anthony022071]

Fred Reed:
I do not say these things from some evangelical libertarian hostility to all things governmental.

Fred Reed does sound like a libertarian,especially when he brings up government interference with the drug trade.

The fact is,middle class Americans are very concerned with maintaining a high standard of safety,security and cleanliness. That’s what we’re used to and that’s what we expect. We’re control-freaks. We don’t like the possibility of danger or chaos. We want to live in an environment which is completely rationally organized,safe and secure and hygenic,especially where children are involved. The reason why the American government is so meddlesome and snoopy and controlling is because many of us are the same way. In a “progessive” suburb such as the one I live in (Oak Park,Il) there is not much room for any kind of rowdiness,or things getting out of control,or things being left up to chance. People call the police at the drop of a hat,if they see anyone suspicious walking aimlessly around,or if there is a fight between kids after school,or if anyone utters threatening words. The people who live here want their property values and “standard of living” to go up,not down.

Middle-class Americans don’t want to live in the kind of rowdy,unhygenic,cultural environment that Fred Reed describes. Mexico might be a fun and liberating place to visit,but we wouldn’t want to live and work there.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

One of the sites I work at has an abandoned factory building. The security company who had the contract before we took it over kept encountering crackheads smoking dope inside at night; and crackheads being what they are, they were usually violent and unpredictable, so the officers from the other company, being forbidden to carry anything more than a flashlight, finally got to the point where they refused to enter the building.

Thus, the contract defaulted to us, because we’re an armed company, made up of former police officers and military veterans. In our company, we are required to be armed, and since we took on the contract, we’ve had no problems with crackheads or anyone else. A few have stopped by that used to get lippy with the other company, but when one of us walks out, their eyes tend to rivet on the handgun holstered on the right side, and they usually get very concilatory and docile in a hurry.

However, I digress. I say all of this as background to what I’m about to relate now.

This factory building probably had about 9,000 flourescent bar lights in it, which the crackheads and vandals all smashed, long, long ago. Walking through this building is like walking over crunchy gravel, due to all the smashed light tubes all over the floor. If you tried to clean this mess up according to the guidelines above, you wouldn’t be looking at a big job—you’d be looking at a career.

“I retired from my job after 30 years last week.”

“Oh, yeah? What did you do for a living?”

“I cleaned up smashed flourescent bar lights in an old factory building.”

If you did it by yourself, of course it would take a long time. There are companies that specialize in this sort of thing, you know…in and out in a matter of days.

Heck, right here in LA, most of the building (which are old) are full of asbestos-containing materials. The regulations for asbestos abatement (cleanup) are rather strict and the requirements to prevent exposure to workers and the public are rather…stringent…but the job manages to get done quickly and safely. Lots of old buildings have been abated, reinforced, and put back into service that way.

Funny that.

 

[vern_humphrey]

taking notes

No sense of humor allowed on CAF.

Noted and logged.

And this from the kid who objected to me using humor in another post.

 

[Wolseley]

If you did it by yourself, of course it would take a long time. There are companies that specialize in this sort of thing, you know…in and out in a matter of days.

Heck, right here in LA, most of the building (which are old) are full of asbestos-containing materials. The regulations for asbestos abatement (cleanup) are rather strict and the requirements to prevent exposure to workers and the public are rather…stringent…but the job manages to get done quickly and safely. Lots of old buildings have been abated, reinforced, and put back into service that way.

Funny that.

There is a company that’s looking at this building; they want to renovate it and make it into a upscale, trendy showroom for a furniture manufacturing firm. Personally, I think the best thing you could do with it is bulldoze it, but that’s me. I had to spend a hour or so last week squiring this guy around inside, making sure that he didn’t kill himself in there…the building has no electricity and it has mounds of jagged glass, ten-foot deep pits, grease pools, weak spots in the upstairs floors, and conveyors, electrical fixtures, and plumbing that have broken loose and hang down at eye level. The boss told me to go inside first and make sure it was safe for this guy to enter. Okay, so in we went.

He went into raptures about this building, and kept going on about what he envisioned, then asking me if I “could see it”. Finally I just laughed and said, "Mister, you look at this place and see what it could be; I look at it and see it as it is." I told him I think it’ll end up costing him more money to renovate this wreck than it would be to simply tear it down and build a new one, but hey, it’s his money. He said, “I look around here and all I see are possibilities----what do you see?” I said, “What I see is the possibility of a strung-out perp hiding behind every wall and shadow in here.”

He seemed distinctly uncomfortable when I prevented him from entering certain areas inside the building until I went in first and checked it out for him; at one point he said, "Do you really need to carry…that gun?" I just smiled and said, “You haven’t encountered any strange-acting druggies in here, sir. I have. Would you know how to handle them if they were in here?” He just averted his eyes and said nothing.

Anyhoo, yes, I know they’ll probably send in a contractor of some sort to clean this place up, but I still think the procedures listed above are maybe verging just a shade on overkill.

 

[Wolseley]

The fact is,middle class Americans are very concerned with maintaining a high standard of safety,security and cleanliness. That’s what we’re used to and that’s what we expect. We’re control-freaks. We don’t like the possibility of danger or chaos. We want to live in an environment which is completely rationally organized,safe and secure and hygenic,especially where children are involved.

Middle-class Americans don’t want to live in the kind of rowdy,unhygenic,cultural environment that Fred Reed describes. Mexico might be a fun and liberating place to visit,but we wouldn’t want to live and work there.

Good thing none of us lived back in the pioneer days, or even in the Old West, isn’t it? We’d have all starved to death rather than touch anything “uckie”.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

There is a company that’s looking at this building; they want to renovate it and make it into a upscale, trendy showroom for a furniture manufacturing firm. Personally, I think the best thing you could do with it is bulldoze it, but that’s me. I had to spend a hour or so last week squiring this guy around inside, making sure that he didn’t kill himself in there…the building has no electricity and it has mounds of jagged glass, ten-foot deep pits, grease pools, weak spots in the upstairs floors, and conveyors, electrical fixtures, and plumbing that have broken loose and hang down at eye level. The boss told me to go inside first and make sure it was safe for this guy to enter. Okay, so in we went.

He went into raptures about this building, and kept going on about what he envisioned, then asking me if I “could see it”. Finally I just laughed and said, "Mister, you look at this place and see what it could be; I look at it and see it as it is." I told him I think it’ll end up costing him more money to renovate this wreck than it would be to simply tear it down and build a new one, but hey, it’s his money. He said, “I look around here and all I see are possibilities----what do you see?” I said, “What I see is the possibility of a strung-out perp hiding behind every wall and shadow in here.”

He seemed distinctly uncomfortable when I prevented him from entering certain areas inside the building until I went in first and checked it out for him; at one point he said, "Do you really need to carry…that gun?" I just smiled and said, “You haven’t encountered any strange-acting druggies in here, sir. I have. Would you know how to handle them if they were in here?” He just averted his eyes and said nothing.

Anyhoo, yes, I know they’ll probably send in a contractor of some sort to clean this place up, but I still think the procedures listed above are maybe verging just a shade on overkill.

Actually, it’ll probably be a team of contractors under a General Contractor or some sort of project administrator.

In some cases, like asbestos or lead, they’d have to abate before they demolish anyway to prevent asbestos or lead dust from contaminating the air.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

Good thing none of us lived back in the pioneer days, or even in the Old West, isn’t it? We’d have all starved to death rather than touch anything “uckie”.

Hmm…looks to right hand

Middle class family

looks to left hand

Pioneer/old west family

Oh, I can see how they’re just so similar.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Hmm…looks to right hand

Middle class family

looks to left hand

Pioneer/old west family

Oh, I can see how they’re just so similar.

Actually, they were. Those who crossed the continent by covered wagor were mostly prosperous farmers – and their diaries make that plain. The Donner party is a good example.

My own grandfather drove a covered wagon across the prairie – from Nebraska to Oklahoma, in 1892. He was 14, and his father had gone on ahead to get land. He helped his father build a log cabin, and when they later moved into a more “modern” home, my grandfather and his new bride moved into the log cabin – where my father was born.

They were solidly middle class, and were deeply involved with the community – my grandfather was the Tax Assessor, became one of the first members of the Highway Patrol (at county level) and was killed in the line of duty. His younger brother was the Superintendent of Schools, along with being a successful farmer.

 

[cynic]

The government can’t prevent murderers from getting guns and they can’t catch murderers. So they go after law abiding citizens and prevent law abiding citizens from having guns for self-protection. In doing so they create a new class of criminals. The murderers still go about getting guns and ignoring the law. But now the government has a new class of easy to catch criminals … the law abiding citizen.

.

they can make it more difficult for guns to fall into criminals hands by limiting the ability to own and purchase them. How many handguns bought for self-protection get onsold, make their way into the black market.

 

[vern_humphrey]

they can make it more difficult for guns to fall into criminals hands by limiting the ability to own and purchase them. How many handguns bought for self-protection get onsold, make their way into the black market.

Yet when states pass “shall issue” laws, requiring permits to be issued to any citizen with a clean record who applies, murder rates and other violent crimes go down. In fact, there is a positive correlation between “gun control” and violent crime – the states and cities with the most “gun control” have the most violent crime.