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SnakeMauler
Guest
Anyone?
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FaithJoy
Guest
Yes, it looks more like a mafia or gang type of life. Starting in jails and prisons,having its own inside laws,making excuses for murder in the name of a faith. Also sounds almost satanic in other regards also.
That’s why muslims need Jesus the only Son of God. Then if they truly accept Christ there will be no torture of women,murder,and slave states.
That’s why muslims need Jesus the only Son of God. Then if they truly accept Christ there will be no torture of women,murder,and slave states.
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Kaninchen
Guest
Sounds like “Die Juden sind unser Unglück!” all over again.
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SnakeMauler
Guest
Whats that?
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Kaninchen
Guest
‘The Jews are our misfortune!’
From the ‘Beware The Great Jewish World Conspiracy’ era of German history.
From the ‘Beware The Great Jewish World Conspiracy’ era of German history.
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Justin1982
Guest
I have felt that our Blessed Mother is the bridge to the Muslims. Prayer for her intercession will be what turns the tides. Understanding Our Lady of Guadalupe and seeing what it is that She is standing on puts things into perspective.
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autdrew
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I have been reading The legacy of jihad, Islamic holy war & the fate of non muslims, by Dr. Andrew Bostom. It is an extensively researched & footnoted compilation of various 1st & secondary sources from many countries & types of people, from about 680 to present. It has numerous essays by leading muslim jurists, imams & scholars, from many places, ages & schools.
According to that, my previous reading & experience, I would say the article is accurate. I saw it happen in Dearborn Michigan while I grew up. They went halal in the school lunch program back in the 80’s.One of the high schools made the news by a tshirt contest they heald in which the winner was a world trade center type building with airplanes flying close. They couldnt understand the offense it caused.Apparently, we are too sensitive to insults & blow little things out of proportion.
I have really hoped that what I have learned is not a common mindset but I am afraid it is. The only religion of peace is islam because if you dont have islam, you dont have peace. It has been going on since the beginning, it has not stopped at any time, it is going on somewhere all the time. It is justified because all other beliefs are false or corrupt & they have been tasked with changing that. I find it sad that as far as we have come in seeing & treating people with equal dignity, our toleration will be seen as weakness.
According to that, my previous reading & experience, I would say the article is accurate. I saw it happen in Dearborn Michigan while I grew up. They went halal in the school lunch program back in the 80’s.One of the high schools made the news by a tshirt contest they heald in which the winner was a world trade center type building with airplanes flying close. They couldnt understand the offense it caused.Apparently, we are too sensitive to insults & blow little things out of proportion.
I have really hoped that what I have learned is not a common mindset but I am afraid it is. The only religion of peace is islam because if you dont have islam, you dont have peace. It has been going on since the beginning, it has not stopped at any time, it is going on somewhere all the time. It is justified because all other beliefs are false or corrupt & they have been tasked with changing that. I find it sad that as far as we have come in seeing & treating people with equal dignity, our toleration will be seen as weakness.
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swariffin
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Indeed history is repeating itself. In Indonesia, Islam was brought by muslim traders from the West (i.e Gujarat, India not the Europeans). First they evangelized the weak local native people whom the center of their kingdom were located far in the hinterland. They were peaceful at first. Once they gained enough followers, they attack the central kingdom and their leader became the new king. The teaching of Jihad against the “pagan” king who were positioned as the enemy of Allah, was surely a good motivators.
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DL82
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What about Turkey and Indonesia, both secular states with large Muslim majorities?
What about the 1000 years of Muslim history from the mid 900s to the beginnings of Saudi Wahabbism in the 19th century, when most Muslim countries were tolerant places (by comparison to many Christian and pagan states at the time) where science and philosophy flourished?
I’m wary of any approach that suggests that ‘people X’ are basically automatons, who all act the same, and are predisposed to do action Y whenever condition Z is met. Human beings are free. We are called as Christians to be salt and light, and to preach the gospel to all, which includes to Muslims. All human beings are free, and some will do good things, some will do bad things, regardless of how you label them.
What about the 1000 years of Muslim history from the mid 900s to the beginnings of Saudi Wahabbism in the 19th century, when most Muslim countries were tolerant places (by comparison to many Christian and pagan states at the time) where science and philosophy flourished?
I’m wary of any approach that suggests that ‘people X’ are basically automatons, who all act the same, and are predisposed to do action Y whenever condition Z is met. Human beings are free. We are called as Christians to be salt and light, and to preach the gospel to all, which includes to Muslims. All human beings are free, and some will do good things, some will do bad things, regardless of how you label them.
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autdrew
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The myth of tolerance is just that, a myth. Other religions were tolerated to the extent that they paid their poll tax with humility & felt themselves subjugated. At any time, any member of the group could do something that was an “insult” to islam & you lost your protected status.Even unjustified killing was rarely punished if the perpetrator was muslim. Mainly because dhimmi evidence was considered untrustworthy. There were laws regarding what Christians & Jews could wear to identify them,(jews had to wear yellow, christians blue) to put on their homes (which were not allowed to be built taller than any muslims) to identify them, you couldnt ride an animal with a saddle, if a muslim passed you, no matter where, you must dismount & let them pass. In Persia, in particular, others were considered unclean & there were laws saying if it was raining or snowing, you must stay inside because your uncleanliness could be washed off & flow on the street to the feet of an unsuspecting muslim.Separate baths, towels, dishes, not allowed in many establishments, rules on what jobs you could take. The ottomans had rules about dhimmis giving their eldest or best son to service to the empire, no question. If you refused or the child ran away, the parents were tortured or killed. It was dervisharme (I think that is the spelling) and it was later depicted by apologists as a “great honor”. I was just reading an account this morning from the Greeks, the tax collector in one area would brand Christians & Jews with a mark. If anyone was later discovered to not have the mark (I am guessing they converted to Christianity) he would cut off their arms & then behead them as an example.If they destroyed your church & plundered it for some perceived insult, you couldnt rebuild it without permission, which was often not granted. Church bells were not allowed in many places because it was an insult. Statues, crosses, anything Christian was often ordered removed. No processions, nothing outside of the building was usually allowed because of the insult.
We could go into the slavery issue in regard to tolerance. The Balkans were the place to go for white slave raiding, Sudan for black slave raiding (which continues) & many black males lost their lives being made eunichs for the harems. It is estimated a 90% casualty rate. Slave taking was abundant from the beginning. It was part of the reason women & children were technically spared from the sword (though not always in practice) because they could be given as gifts or sold for a price. As the west was giving up slavery & feeling ashamed over it, the muslim countries did not. Saudi Arabia gave it up in 1962, Yemen & Oman in the 70’s & I think one of them into the 80’s before giving it up officially. Piracy was commonplace & along with that was the capture of slaves, all the way up into Gaul. The first overseas conflict the new United States had was with muslim pirates.
Lastly, I am sure the Armenians would have something to say regarding the tolerance of the Turks. The 1st genocide of the 20th century was by turks against the Armenian Christians for which they were never punished. They tried to hide it as “rebellion” (a common excuse) during WW1, but they had been killing Armenians all the way back to 705, under the caliphate of Abd-al-Malik, when they captured all the magnates & leaders of the people, brought them together & burned them alive.
It has not been continuous persecution in all places but somewhere there is always a persecution happening.So regarding tolerance, it depends on who you ask. Some would say its not so bad, some had it worse than others, some had benevolent dictators, some had evil tyrants. But never were Christians & Jews considered to be full citizens with the SAME rights as muslims. Pagans, polytheists & others were treat FAR worse. Read the history of India. It is horrifying.
We could go into the slavery issue in regard to tolerance. The Balkans were the place to go for white slave raiding, Sudan for black slave raiding (which continues) & many black males lost their lives being made eunichs for the harems. It is estimated a 90% casualty rate. Slave taking was abundant from the beginning. It was part of the reason women & children were technically spared from the sword (though not always in practice) because they could be given as gifts or sold for a price. As the west was giving up slavery & feeling ashamed over it, the muslim countries did not. Saudi Arabia gave it up in 1962, Yemen & Oman in the 70’s & I think one of them into the 80’s before giving it up officially. Piracy was commonplace & along with that was the capture of slaves, all the way up into Gaul. The first overseas conflict the new United States had was with muslim pirates.
Lastly, I am sure the Armenians would have something to say regarding the tolerance of the Turks. The 1st genocide of the 20th century was by turks against the Armenian Christians for which they were never punished. They tried to hide it as “rebellion” (a common excuse) during WW1, but they had been killing Armenians all the way back to 705, under the caliphate of Abd-al-Malik, when they captured all the magnates & leaders of the people, brought them together & burned them alive.
It has not been continuous persecution in all places but somewhere there is always a persecution happening.So regarding tolerance, it depends on who you ask. Some would say its not so bad, some had it worse than others, some had benevolent dictators, some had evil tyrants. But never were Christians & Jews considered to be full citizens with the SAME rights as muslims. Pagans, polytheists & others were treat FAR worse. Read the history of India. It is horrifying.
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autdrew
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In what muslim country did science and philosophy flourished from 900-1900 in comparable ways? I am asking honestly. What was the contribution?
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Justin1982
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I’m curious as to what history you subscribe to? The Muslims invaded Europe during that time. Nothing says tolerance like invasion and slavery. Most of Spain was taken over during those 1000 years and many families lost their children to Muslim slave trade, boys castrated, converted and sold into slavery.
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Rumpelstiltskin
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You HIT the nail on the head.
Unfortunately. many people will turn a blind eye to this or choose to refrain from taking any constructive action against the ‘proliferation’. Because we cannot avoid Armageddon.
There’s no turning back now. The only thing we can do is to put forth our stand and prevent more people to falling in.
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Unfortunately. many people will turn a blind eye to this or choose to refrain from taking any constructive action against the ‘proliferation’. Because we cannot avoid Armageddon.
There’s no turning back now. The only thing we can do is to put forth our stand and prevent more people to falling in.
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Rumpelstiltskin
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I lived in Indonesia for 7 years back in the 80s. And I can tell you the country is trying VERY HARD to stop islamising the country further. There is currently still a strong ‘moderate’ group of muslims around and a relatively strong group of non-muslims holding the fort. But its not going to last very long. As for Turkey, the country is clearly not pro-shariah. If they were they would have plunged in some time ago. Again, just a matter of time.
You don’t put yourself at the edge of a cliff and then say you won’t jump. Because sooner or later, you will fall down (islamised under shariah), whether you like it or not.
The majority of muslims cannot pick their religion, but they know what they’ll be in for should they cave in to the pressures of the ruling Imams. Which incidentally are growing more and more fundamentalistic by the day.
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swariffin
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A good observation. I was born and live in Indonesia, and I agree with you completely. What city did you live in, brother?
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Rumpelstiltskin
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Jakarta. But I travel… Yogya, Riau etc.
Many people don’t know the dangers of islam and judge the religion by their peaceful ‘followers’. I put “” because those who truly follow islam in its fundamental forms are not peaceful.
I had lots of muslim friends & subordinates back then, so I know how they think. I once tested some of them by saying how 9/11 has made America more aware of the feelings of muslims. Immediately…some of them jumped and said “yes!..they deserved it those @##”. I kept quiet. Those who responded thus were normally very subdued & ‘moderate’ in their behavior. So, it came not just as a surprise but as a shocking revelation of what really runs deep in their veins.
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elwill
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During the Middle Ages, Muslim cities such as Baghdad, Istanbul, Cairo, Tripoli and Cordoba became cultural and intellectual centers where theologians, scholars, scientists, artists, writers, philosophers, mathematicians and others convened for scholarship, experimentation and discovery. The significant achievements made by Muslims from approximately 750 to 1500 A.D. led to the naming of this period as the Islamic Renaissance, or the Islamic Golden Age.
Muslims were at the forefront of discoveries in ophthalmology, anatomy, physiology, pathology, surgery, chemistry and pharmaceuticals during the Islamic Renaissance. Great advances were also made in astronomy and mathematics, as well as in architecture, art and literature.
Read more at Suite101: The Islamic Golden Age: Muslim Contributions During Islam’s Renaissance islam.suite101.com/article.cfm/the_islamic_golden_age#ixzz0tAATHsPf
you will find direct and brief answer for your honest question in this great vedio ,
youtube.com/watch?v=qf9T5JOuNyk
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Rumpelstiltskin
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2 things based on Historical facts.
1 - The golden age of islam is said to run from the 8th to the 13th century. The majority of the alleged ‘contributions’ occurred between 8th & early 10th century.
2 - The conquests or warring of the Islamic turks ran from the 7th to the 9th century.
Ask yourself a very SIMPLE QUESTION.
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HOW DOES A COMMUNITY OF WARRING BARBARIC TURKS TURN INTO GREAT SCHOLARS & ACADEMICS IN THE SHORT SPAN OF 1 CENTURY???**
What is obvious is either the Islamic golden age was a hoax or the warriors were studying for their exams and doing lab tests during the wars. The third possibility is these scholars & academics who were absorbed or ‘assimilated’ by the victors were not originally muslims.
Whatever contributions that islam claimed it made were obviously not to its credit. It was robbed from the non-muslims. This is an inevitable conclusion if one bothers to just sit down and think. (Even today, muslims are inhibited from learning secular knowledge…how then can such a faith produce scholars/academics?)
Yet there is a real reason why this hoax has to be perpetuated. To DRIVE the muslims towards the final islamisation of the world using this non-existent ‘dream’. It is a delusional goal-post. But one that must be told for them to drive “forward”.
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Moscati
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Mathematics, for one. “Algebra” is named for Muslim scholar Al-Khwarizmi’s “Al-jabr wa’l muqabalah”. And the Muslim physician Avicenna was the first to attempt something like a randomized control trial for medicines.
Many historians think that Muslim society’s main contribution was the preservation of ancient Greek scientific and philosophical knowledge. Most of it was completely lost to Christendom, and its rediscovery led to the Renaissance in Europe.
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