What Islam isnt? Sound's pretty accurate.

[elwill]

2 things based on Historical facts.

1 - The golden age of islam is said to run from the 8th to the 13th century. The majority of the alleged ‘contributions’ occurred between 8th & early 10th century.

2 - The conquests or warring of the Islamic turks ran from the 7th to the 9th century.

Ask yourself a very SIMPLE QUESTION.
**
HOW DOES A COMMUNITY OF WARRING BARBARIC TURKS TURN INTO GREAT SCHOLARS & ACADEMICS IN THE SHORT SPAN OF 1 CENTURY???**

It came in a time when Islam and the People of the Book living under the nation of Islam were politically united and lived in harmony. As usually said, our unity has always lead to our strength and on the other hand fitna is the source of our weakness.

Islamic rulers were very tolerant of conquered peoples, and welcomed conversion to the Islamic faith. All Muslims must learn Arabic, so they can read the Qur’an, the Islamic holy book. This common language helped to unite many different ethnic groups within the Islamic empire. It also made possible the easy exchange of knowledge and ideas.

Whatever contributions that islam claimed it made were obviously not to its credit. It was robbed from the non-muslims. This is an inevitable conclusion if one bothers to just sit down and think. (Even today, muslims are inhibited from learning secular knowledge…how then can such a faith produce scholars/academics?)

in the fact , these knowledge was raised from our faith , for example

1- Muslims have always had a special interest in astronomy. The moon and the sun are of vital importance in the daily life of every Muslim. By the moon, Muslims determine the beginning and the end of the months in their lunar calendar. By the sun the Muslims calculate the times for prayer and fasting. It is also by means of astronomy that Muslims can determine the precise direction of the Qiblah, to face the Ka’bah in Makkah, during prayer.

Seeking knowledge is obligatory in Islam for every Muslim, man and woman. The main sources of Islam, the Quran and the Sunnah (Prophet Muhammad’s traditions), encourage Muslims to seek knowledge and be scholars, since this is the best way for people to know Allah (God), to appreciate His wondrous creations and be thankful for them.

Muslims have always been eager to seek knowledge, both religious and secular, and within a few years of Muhammad’s mission, a great civilization sprang up and flourished. The outcome is shown in the spread of Islamic universities; Al-Zaytunah in Tunis, and Al-Azhar in Cairo go back more than 1,000 years and are the oldest existing universities in the world. Indeed, they were the models for the first European universities, such as Bologna, Heidelberg, and the Sorbonne. Even the familiar academic cap and gown originated at Al-Azhar University.

are you claim that muslims robbed the knowledge of nonmuslims ?
Muslim scholars studied the ancient civilizations from Greece and Rome to China and India. The works of Aristotle, Ptolemy, Euclid and others were translated into Arabic. Muslim scholars and scientists then added their own creative ideas, discoveries and inventions, and finally transmitted this new knowledge to Europe, leading directly to the Renaissance.

 

[Kaninchen]

Muslim scholars studied the ancient civilizations from Greece and Rome to China and India. The works of Aristotle, Ptolemy, Euclid and others were translated into Arabic. Muslim scholars and scientists then added their own creative ideas, discoveries and inventions, and finally transmitted this new knowledge to Europe, leading directly to the Renaissance.

I suppose the question is, why did the Islamic world lose its interest in conjectural science? Is an Islamic society doomed to lose its intellectual fertility when such fertility threatens Islamic certainties? Is there, in a sense, a limit to allowable knowledge?

 

[elwill]

I suppose the question is, why did the Islamic world lose its interest in conjectural science? Is an Islamic society doomed to lose its intellectual fertility when such fertility threatens Islamic certainties? Is there, in a sense, a limit to allowable knowledge?

let me repeat for you the words i cited above

our unity has always lead to our strength and on the other hand fitna is the source of our weakness.

we are not following the teaching of islam as we supposed to do , muslims societies are full of fitnah and conflicts in our days

someone above mentioned something about muslims robbed the others knowledge , so i want from you to see this program

youtube.com/watch?v=s_j70bwkSqQ

youtube.com/watch?v=AJnc6lB6pts

 

[autdrew]

Seeking knowledge is obligatory in Islam for every Muslim, man and woman. The main sources of Islam, the Quran and the Sunnah (Prophet Muhammad’s traditions), encourage Muslims to seek knowledge and be scholars, since this is the best way for people to know Allah (God), to appreciate His wondrous creations and be thankful for them.

I really would like to believe this, but then I see stories of girls schools being blown up, headmasters murdered, little girls having acid thrown in their faces,women murdered for running underground schools, parents threatened, all for going to get educated. The Taliban banned girls from education & many other muslim countries have tried to keep girls from learning until fairly recently. I have read of Imams & leaders of schools claiming that everything a boy ever needs to know is in the Koran & that is all he will be taught. Parents send their sons to school and his education consists of memorizing the Koran.It is obviously not the same for everyone, but these things happen regularly by self described true muslims. It is hard for me to take the statement that seeking knowledge is obligatory for muslims when it has been contradicted so often.
As for the peace & tolerance, I dont buy it one bit. I have read numerous accounts of people, both muslim & non muslim describing the laws & treatment of non muslims. People of the book have never been full citizens with the SAME rights as muslims. The only time they get the SAME rights is when the finally apostatize to islam. There have been periods when the treatment was not as harsh & periods when persecution was particularly horrifying. But never were muslims & non muslims the SAME.

 

[autdrew]

I am watching the Youtube video
Why did the 3rd Crusade need to be launched? Or the 1st one for that matter? Because a Jewish/Christian city considered holy, had been invaded & conquered & its people oppressed by an outside band of warriors that insisted everyone commit apostasy, live subjugated or die. After 400 yrs of invasions & slaughters & take over of almost every place Christians & Jews lived in the Mediterranean area, the Christians of Europe fought back. It took 400 years! Somehow, only the Christians get the fault for the Crusades, funny how that happened.
I am not understanding the part about accepting muslim control of Jerusalem & allowing Christian pilgrims & sudden Christians stole secret muslim knowledge? How did that happen?

It also says that all of the Mediterranean was for the muslims in the 13th century. How did that happen? It took 75 years of repeated attacks to finally conquer Sicily. Im pretty sure those people would have something to say about the tolerant “Golden Age”

Love the part of the video with the “scheming Pope” plotting nefarious (unproven) attacks on the poor tolerant muslims. I wonder where they got these “quotes” from.The “nightmare” of the evil churchmen looking down on the poor tormented muslim scholar is tooooooo funny!! So they stole his books? Proof of theft not forthcoming in this video.Amazing how they got it translated from Arabic to Latin and returned the book all before he woke up. Simply stating something was stolen does not make it so. Especially stealing from his bedside!

Seriously, the video is a propaganda piece from beginning to end. It shows one invention for keeping time & talks about how superior Arabic numerals were to Roman ones (and they are superior, I hate Roman numerials) the whole rest of the video speaks vaguely of muslim scientists being in the conquered territories & how those evil Christians & their church plotted to steal the Arabic knowledge but at the same time claims that they didnt want that knowledge to go to the people. Why steal it & have it translated if they didnt want the knowledge available? One thing it did say, it was quite common for books to be translated & not mention the original authors. Doesnt sound like a plot against muslims, it sounds like standard procedure for almost every book being translated for a period of time.

 

[Kaninchen]

let me repeat for you the words i cited above

our unity has always lead to our strength and on the other hand fitna is the source of our weakness.

we are not following the teaching of islam as we supposed to do , muslims societies are full of fitnah and conflicts in our days

someone above mentioned something about muslims robbed the others knowledge , so i want from you to see this program

youtube.com/watch?v=s_j70bwkSqQ

youtube.com/watch?v=AJnc6lB6pts

I wasn’t denying the Islamic World’s contribution at all - I was just wondering why a worldview that started of so promisingly ended up as, what seems to outsiders, a self-obsessed backwater.

 

[autdrew]

Video 2
So the Emperor died & those evil church men sent the poor scholar back to his land. The knowledge was packed up in a dark gallery & Leonardo & Galileo used them later. Apparently they got their ideas from them, the video implies.
If the church men thought they were so awful & evil, why have them translated, why keep them after expelling the scholar & why let them get into the hands of those they were trying to keep them from?

The video goes on to talk about how the muslims have an inferiority complex (their words not mine) because they dont know about their grandfathers contributions to science. I have to ask, in all seriousness, how come none of this information was retained & expounded upon in muslim countries? That cannot be blamed on the scheming church can it? The video claims that material was hidden in Europe for a century. That is a whole century of development in the muslim world. Why did that not happen? They cant have had the only copy of materials that important can they?
The ending, if the west confesses that its culture is from the arabic culture (say you stole it) then there can be mutual peace & understanding between two cultures. Amazing

I just watched video 1 again. Arabic numerals were from INDIA! It said it in the 1st minute & I skimmed over it the 1st viewing. Wonder how come the arabs dont confess their theft & live in peace with India?

 

[Thyme]

We already have a group of people trying to make an area of London under Sharia law!

 

[Kaninchen]

We already have a group of people trying to make an area of London under Sharia law!

Same sort of thing could be said of any group of cranks and their particular obsession.

 

[autdrew]

In the states we had some cab drivers for an airport insist they had a right to not pick up passengers who could be carrying alcohol in their luggage. I am certain the prohibition is on muslims drinking alcohol, not driving a suitcase in a trunk that carries a bottle of wine. We have laws about not being allowed to discriminate by cab drivers. Crazy that it turned into a religious rights debate when it is not a religious tenant.

 

[KathleenGee]

Arab scholars drew on Aristotle, neo Platonists, and other philosophers…but the Muslim imams began to draw away from critical thought for fear that philosophy would disprove the existence of God.

There was an immediate predecessor to St. Thomas Aquinas…who in turned used metaphysics stating that drawing from cause to effect, one can use the erudite tradition to prove the existence of God, or from the premise of cause to effect as Aristotle did.as cause …From the tradition established by St. Thomas Aquinas, thus formal use of reason drew scholarly theological studies.

The abandonment of metaphysics among Arab scholars also coincided with the degradation of women.

 

[SnakeMauler]

During the Middle Ages, Muslim cities such as Baghdad, Istanbul, Cairo, Tripoli and Cordoba became cultural and intellectual centers where theologians, scholars, scientists, artists, writers, philosophers, mathematicians and others convened for scholarship, experimentation and discovery. The significant achievements made by Muslims from approximately 750 to 1500 A.D. led to the naming of this period as the Islamic Renaissance, or the Islamic Golden Age.

Muslims were at the forefront of discoveries in ophthalmology, anatomy, physiology, pathology, surgery, chemistry and pharmaceuticals during the Islamic Renaissance. Great advances were also made in astronomy and mathematics, as well as in architecture, art and literature.

Read more at Suite101: The Islamic Golden Age: Muslim Contributions During Islam’s Renaissance islam.suite101.com/article.cfm/the_islamic_golden_age#ixzz0tAATHsPf

you will find direct and brief answer for your honest question in this great vedio ,
youtube.com/watch?v=qf9T5JOuNyk

And then in 2010…

All those cities became places where you’ll get persecuted Christian:blush:

No but seriously, do small contributions like Mathematics which weren’t really fullly developed or applied at all to society until by Christians centuries later really outweigh all the people that Muslims killed? Or even the virginity of that poor 9 year old girl that Muhammad took with a grin?

 

[Rumpelstiltskin]

Video 2
So the Emperor died & those evil church men sent the poor scholar back to his land. The knowledge was packed up in a dark gallery & Leonardo & Galileo used them later. Apparently they got their ideas from them, the video implies.
If the church men thought they were so awful & evil, why have them translated, why keep them after expelling the scholar & why let them get into the hands of those they were trying to keep them from?

The video goes on to talk about how the muslims have an inferiority complex (their words not mine) because they dont know about their grandfathers contributions to science. I have to ask, in all seriousness, how come none of this information was retained & expounded upon in muslim countries? That cannot be blamed on the scheming church can it? The video claims that material was hidden in Europe for a century. That is a whole century of development in the muslim world. Why did that not happen? They cant have had the only copy of materials that important can they?
The ending, if the west confesses that its culture is from the arabic culture (say you stole it) then there can be mutual peace & understanding between two cultures. Amazing

I just watched video 1 again. Arabic numerals were from INDIA! It said it in the 1st minute & I skimmed over it the 1st viewing. Wonder how come the arabs dont confess their theft & live in peace with India?

Islam is made up of tons and tons of claims that cannot be validated either by archaeologists, historians nor supported with religious consistencies. It is amazing to see how this religion can ‘flourish’ amidst so much un-qualified claims and produce so many ardent believers who are willing to waste away their lives for it.

Truly, this is Submission…Blind Submission.

.

 

[FaithJoy]

Islam is made up of tons and tons of claims that cannot be validated either by archaeologists, historians nor supported with religious consistencies. It is amazing to see how this religion can ‘flourish’ amidst so much un-qualified claims and produce so many ardent believers who are willing to waste away their lives for it.

Truly, this is Submission…Blind Submission.

.

The world’s history my friend in many respects.The history of the world had also controlling govt.s which contributed to that fact. That’s why the Church has been the only constant and sanity to keep us together.

 

[Kitsune633]

Islam is made up of tons and tons of claims that cannot be validated either by archaeologists, historians nor supported with religious consistencies. It is amazing to see how this religion can ‘flourish’ amidst so much un-qualified claims and produce so many ardent believers who are willing to waste away their lives for it.

Truly, this is Submission…Blind Submission.

 

[SnakeMauler]

Islam cannot be proven, there is no evidence of archeology, only Mecca of course, and of course, the Wahabbis of Saudi Arabia did try to destroy Muhammed’s tomb and other places like the houses and the such. Islam also destroys the historical past of a nation or culture. Heck, the Islamic Republic of Iran tried to destroy Persepolis because to their little Muslim brains, they represent “The Dark Times” or “The Times of Ignorance”. The Taliban of Afghanistan, they destroyed the Bamyan Buddhas, before the Arabs came and raped Afghanistan with their so called “religion of peace”, you had Hindus and Buddhists in the country and of course, when something from the past surfaces to remind the Afghans who they were before the “religion of peace” came, the Taliban says “Oh we have to destroy this because idoltrauous! ALLAHU ACKBAR!” and then BOOOOM!!! There goes the Buddhas of Bamyan, Islam has no respect for other cultures and nations, only their self-rightious ideals, their magic book of desert fables written by a madman who claimed to be a prophet of God.

 

[Kitsune633]

Kitsune633;6834864:

Don’t forget the Zoroastrians. Poor guys. They’re such an interesting religion but forwhatever reason people killed them all so there’s not much about them left.

Ah yes, the religion of the Persians/ Iranis before Muhammed came, interesting they are and there’s a few of them left and the Muslims use whatever power to persecute them or deny them basic rights. I mean, look at them, such an interesting people and now they reduced to numbers because of Islam. Islam isn’t a religion of peace, its a religion of intolerance. I mean, Copts in Egypt get persecutted because it says on their magic book of desert fables. Zoroasters, same reason as the Copts. Hindus in India and Pakistan, hey if there’s a religion that says to fight, kill, rape, murder, steal, enslave, and of course the Earth is flat, you’ll find all of that in Islam my friend. Islam is a one way ticket to ignorance and mediocreness, a one path to Hell and there.