What kind of veil is better?

[sponsaChristi]

I’m new here but I thought that someone could help me in discerning religious communities.

A friend told me that it is better to discern with convents and monasteries that wear the old veil and not those nuns who have changed their veils. I mean they still wear the habit, etc. However, I was thinking that orders like the Nashville Dominicans changed their veils and they seem to be OK. I looked at the Orders on the Institute for Religious Life page and lots of those orders modified their habit but they seem orthodox.

I guess I’m asking what criteria should I use. It’s so confusing!

Thanks!
SponsaChristi–I hope someday!

 

[GemmaRose]

Hi sponsaChristi . Welcome to CAF.

You say, “I guess I’m asking what criteria should I use. It’s so confusing!” I can tell you this: if you are trying to find a community, or judge a community, by how they dress, your criteria, and possibly your priorities, are all wrong.

A religious vocation is not playing dress-up.

Please forgive me if I sound harsh, but when a woman joins a convent, she becomes, in a very special way, a bride of our Crucified Lord, and she should remember every single day of her life that she will be clothed in garments more luxurious than any He wore in His entire Life, no matter what kind of veil is on her head.

You should first think of what you want to “do.” The religious or consecrated life is a vocation… it is what and who you are. What you “do” through that vocation is separate.

• Do you want to teach? Look for a teaching order. Try the Sisters of St. Joseph, among many others.
• Do you want to care for the elderly? Try the Little Sisters of the Poor.
• Do you want to care for the poor, sick and abandoned? Try the Missionaries of Charity (Mother Teresa’s community).
• Are you interested in ecumenism? Try the Franciscan Sisters of the Atonement (I’m pretty sure that’s their name).
• Do you have dreams of being a missionary? There are very many missionary communities.
• Do you want to be another St. Therese? Try the Carmelites. (They’re cloistered.)
• Do you have an attraction to Franciscan spirituality? There are very many different communities with a Franciscan charism. If you would like to be cloistered and Franciscan, then try the Poor Clares.
• Do you have a special devotion to Jesus Crucified? Try the Passionist nuns. (They’re cloistered also.)
• Do you have a devotion to the Precious Blood of Jesus? The Precious Blood Sisters are cloistered also.
• The Visitation Monastery in my neighborhood is cloistered, but they run a school for girls, so here you could teach during teaching hours and be cloistered the rest of the time.

There are dozens and dozens of different communities. I would suggest that you contact the Vocation Office of your Diocese and schedule an appointment where you can sit down and get some more information and some help and advice.

In the meantime, Google, girl, Google!

Good luck and God bless.

P.S. May I suggest also, go to Amazon.com and in the book section find the book “And You Are Christ’s” written by Fr. Thomas Dubay. It is an excellent, excellent book which has the best description of “vocation” that I have ever read, and speaks of the vows as no one else does. (Fr. Dubay is my very favorite author!)

 

[Claymont79]

Great advice from Gemma, I’ll pray for you when we do our family daily rosary.

 

[Sister_Rose]

Welcome!
If you want to focus on anything, make sure that they are in keeping with the teachings and authority of the Church.
Make sure they aren’t sisters in favor of abortion, or women priests, or things like that.
You can get yourself into some trouble with some in the old traditional habits also. There are groups out there that deny the validity of Vatican II and the authority of the Pope.
Don’t let yourself get too caught up in externals. The appearance of the habit of an order would be a poor reason to enter.
Pray about it. Listen to God. There may be something that you know you are looking for. For me I knew it would be a Franciscan community, some knew they were called to work with young people or to care for the sick…
But pray about it and let Him guide you.
You can’t shop for a religious community like you shop for a car.

 

[puzzleannie]

I’m new here but I thought that someone could help me in discerning religious communities.

A.

I guess I’m asking what criteria should I use. It’s so confusing!

Thanks!
SponsaChristi–I hope someday!

the criteria you should use is discerning what your vocation is with the help of a good spiritual director, and then discerning the religious order, if that is indeed your vocation. the only criteria you need for what to wear is the custom, usage and rules of that order. you don’t have to second guess that. picking an order because you like or don’t like the habit or veil is NOT a valid basis for discernment. makes as much sense using the color of habit as a reason to join or not join.

 

[PraiseGodxJMJ]

I’m new here but I thought that someone could help me in discerning religious communities.

A friend told me that it is better to discern with convents and monasteries that wear the old veil and not those nuns who have changed their veils. I mean they still wear the habit, etc. However, I was thinking that orders like the Nashville Dominicans changed their veils and they seem to be OK. I looked at the Orders on the Institute for Religious Life page and lots of those orders modified their habit but they seem orthodox.

I guess I’m asking what criteria should I use. It’s so confusing!

Thanks!
SponsaChristi–I hope someday!

Hey, I understand I have a religious calling myself. I feel called to become a Nun as well. Well. You need to let God steer you not other people. What do you want for yourself have Christ guide you and get a spiritual director. That is the best thing you could do. Oh and get Vocation magazines as your local convent to give you a VisionsGuide magazine they have good orders. Maybe you are called to the Cistercians Trappistine nuns or Benedictines, Franscicans. Or maybe you are called to Domician sisters even the carmelites. Carmelites are good too. Do what pleases your heart and ask God and MARY to guide you.

---

Whatever the Lord pleases He does, on heaven and on earth, in the seas and all deeps. Ps. 135 :grouphug:

 

[BSHoop96]

the only criteria you need for what to wear is the custom, usage and rules of that order. you don’t have to second guess that. picking an order because you like or don’t like the habit or veil is NOT a valid basis for discernment. makes as much sense using the color of habit as a reason to join or not join.

In giving her the benefit of the doubt, I assumed she was thinking that her friends were implying that possibly the orders that have changed their way of dress might be too liberal or unorthodox. I truly didn’t think she meant picking one by whether she liked the habit.

 

[PraiseGodxJMJ]

In giving her the benefit of the doubt, I assumed she was thinking that her friends were implying that possibly the orders that have changed their way of dress might be too liberal or unorthodox. I truly didn’t think she meant picking one by whether she liked the habit.

Thank you BSHoop, I agree with you there I feel called to wearing the habit and veil myself. I do not like how some orders have changed their way of dress it is way too liberal and unorthodox for me. I like traditionial like how Saint Therese of the little flower dressed or St. Catherine of Seinna, even St. Bernadette, or St.Rita! See I like it when nuns wear religious clothing like that. Not this liberal attire!

Do this for a commemoration of me. . .This sacrifice and sacrament is to be continued in the church, to the end of the world, to shew forth the death of Christ, until he cometh. But this commemoration, or remembrance, is by no means inconsistent with the real presence of his body and blood, under these sacramental veils, which represent his death; on the contrary, it is the manner that he himself hath commanded, of commemorating and celebrating his death, by offering in sacrifice, and receiving in the sacrament, that body and blood by which we were redeemed.

We as women really should be wearing our veils if you have short hair! but sadly no one is paying attention!

 

[BSHoop96]

Thank you BSHoop, I agree with you there I feel called to wearing the habit and veil myself. I do not like how some orders have changed their way of dress it is way too liberal and unorthodox for me. I like traditionial like how Saint Therese of the little flower dressed or St. Catherine of Seinna, even St. Bernadette, or St.Rita! See I like it when nuns wear religious clothing like that. Not this liberal attire!

Do this for a commemoration of me. . .This sacrifice and sacrament is to be continued in the church, to the end of the world, to shew forth the death of Christ, until he cometh. But this commemoration, or remembrance, is by no means inconsistent with the real presence of his body and blood, under these sacramental veils, which represent his death; on the contrary, it is the manner that he himself hath commanded, of commemorating and celebrating his death, by offering in sacrifice, and receiving in the sacrament, that body and blood by which we were redeemed.

We as women really should be wearing our veils if you have short hair! but sadly no one is paying attention!

In fairness to those who have changed their habit…I must say that *I don’t think *that just because a nun wears a more modern habit that it means that she is less devoted, dedicated or spiritual. My whole point was that perhaps the OP’s friends said look for ones with a veil because maybe THEY thought so.

 

[nunsense]

Without opening up the whole habit vs non-habit debate, I would like to mention that externals can be a reflection of our interior state of mind. Some people prefer receiving communion on the tongue because they feel it is more reverent (for them) to do so. Some people prefer the Mass in Latin because it feels more reverent (to them) this way. So some people prefer traditional habits and certain types of veils because it seems more reverent (to them).

Rosalind Moss doesn’t try to hide the fact that she considers the full-length, traditional habit to be a very important part of her new community - as a witness for Christ.

So I think it is quite acceptable for a woman to be concerned about whether or not a community wears a habit, and what type - if this is important to her.

That being said, the other posters here are certainly correct to point out that the habit is not THE reason for choosing any community. The first thing a discerner needs to do is to pray, and then pray, and then pray some more. Once a person decides to give their life to God, then they need to ask Him what He wants to do about it! If we want to make Him laugh, all we have to do is to tell Him “our” plans!

And there has been a lot of good advice here about checking out charisms and the type of work that a community does. The more a person discerns, although it might seem very confusing at first (sort of like a teenager trying to choose a college!), the more one starts to feel a sense of where God is calling them. I think of it a bit like cleaning out a garage - sometimes it seems messier at first with everything everywhere, but in the end, everything ends up where it belongs and looks great!

Anway, let God be involved in the choice - He has a vested interest in you

 

[drafdog]

Your diocesan vocations office will be able to help you. Go to the diocesan website and click on the vocations link. You will find contact information there and a real live person to talk to. Don’t rely solely on info from the web.

Matthew

 

[TotusTuusIesu]

No offense to your friend, but I think he or she may be confused on what a vocation truly is. A vocation isn’t a job you go out searching for, picking and choosing which to apply to with a certain criteria in mind based on looks. A vocation is the way in which you manifest your love in this world - your love for others and your love for Christ and His Church.

I go to a school run by the Nashville Dominicans, and I have to say that of all the active-contemplative orders I have come across in my own 7+ months of discernment, theirs is about the most traditional I’ve seen. Their veil is a veil, not a wimple. Their veil has not been modified much, really, other than that change from a wimple to a veil. I think that is probably what your friend was referring to as the “old veil.” Wimples - which cover the neck and wrap around the face to the back of the head, where they are tied under a veil - are worn today mainly by contemplative, cloistered congregations of traditional nuns. It used to be more commonplace for sisters to wear wimples, but since times have changed and so have apostolates, the sisters needed something a bit less restrictive for their activity level. Being that we live in a world where young people [myself included] need to physically see things, the sisters have to evangelize more physically than they used to have to in the days of convent-boarding schools (my school was originally one).

Anyway, don’t let other peoples’ perceptions of what makes a good religious order get in your way. If you are being called to religious life, Christ is calling you to be His BRIDE! That is SO extremely beautiful! I personally feel the call myself, and feel that part of being a religious is total death-to-self, including the donning of designer clothes, make-up, etc. It’s part of gaining new life in Christ, giving up all wordly clothes and possessions, and taking the religious habit and veil. In fact, our sisters wear white to symbolize purity, and in tradition, since St. Dominic wore white to symbolize the aforementioned purity. It is a sign, a reminder, as one sister said earlier tonight, actually, that, “Heaven is our goal. Now, we don’t know what Heaven looks like, but we do know that there is Light.” The black on the veil symbolizes death-to-self.

Naturally, keep praying incessantly about your vocation, and He will lead you to the right place. If you are looking for a “habited” congregation, there are a lot out there. I know I am a bit biased, being that I feel the call to our sisters’ congregation here, but if you contact Sr. Mary Emily www.nashvilledominican.org and hit Vocations], she can help put you in contact with different congregations in different orders, even, I’m sure. I keep referring to our sisters because they are one of the oldest congregations around and have links to a bunch of different communities, and also have a very solid vocations office with great retreats. I’m not of age to attend yet, but I know many former and current retreatants.

God bless you; you have my prayers!

PS - Excuse any errors in typing this up…it’s nearly 4 AM, but sleep just won’t come.

 

[Joannm]

No offense to your friend, but I think he or she may be confused on what a vocation truly is. A vocation isn’t a job you go out searching for, picking and choosing which to apply to with a certain criteria in mind based on looks. A vocation is the way in which you manifest your love in this world - your love for others and your love for Christ and His Church.

I go to a school run by the Nashville Dominicans, and I have to say that of all the active-contemplative orders I have come across in my own 7+ months of discernment, theirs is about the most traditional I’ve seen. Their veil is a veil, not a wimple. Their veil has not been modified much, really, other than that change from a wimple to a veil. I think that is probably what your friend was referring to as the “old veil.” Wimples - which cover the neck and wrap around the face to the back of the head, where they are tied under a veil - are worn today mainly by contemplative, cloistered congregations of traditional nuns. It used to be more commonplace for sisters to wear wimples, but since times have changed and so have apostolates, the sisters needed something a bit less restrictive for their activity level. Being that we live in a world where young people [myself included] need to physically see things, the sisters have to evangelize more physically than they used to have to in the days of convent-boarding schools (my school was originally one).

Anyway, don’t let other peoples’ perceptions of what makes a good religious order get in your way. If you are being called to religious life, Christ is calling you to be His BRIDE! That is SO extremely beautiful! I personally feel the call myself, and feel that part of being a religious is total death-to-self, including the donning of designer clothes, make-up, etc. It’s part of gaining new life in Christ, giving up all wordly clothes and possessions, and taking the religious habit and veil. In fact, our sisters wear white to symbolize purity, and in tradition, since St. Dominic wore white to symbolize the aforementioned purity. It is a sign, a reminder, as one sister said earlier tonight, actually, that, “Heaven is our goal. Now, we don’t know what Heaven looks like, but we do know that there is Light.” The black on the veil symbolizes death-to-self.

Naturally, keep praying incessantly about your vocation, and He will lead you to the right place. If you are looking for a “habited” congregation, there are a lot out there. I know I am a bit biased, being that I feel the call to our sisters’ congregation here, but if you contact Sr. Mary Emily www.nashvilledominican.org and hit Vocations], she can help put you in contact with different congregations in different orders, even, I’m sure. I keep referring to our sisters because they are one of the oldest congregations around and have links to a bunch of different communities, and also have a very solid vocations office with great retreats. I’m not of age to attend yet, but I know many former and current retreatants.

God bless you; you have my prayers!

PS - Excuse any errors in typing this up…it’s nearly 4 AM, but sleep just won’t come.

I met some of these sisters while studying at the Unviersity of Notre Dame this past summer. Maybe they will be there again. If I remember they were going for their education degrees.

 

[GemmaRose]

In my earlier post, I recommended the book written by Fr. Thomas Dubay: “And You Are Christ’s: The Charism of Virginity and the Celibate Life.”

Although the book was written primarily to understand the vocation to Gospel Virginity (which is way more than just the obvious) and how it is a totality of giving oneself, to understand a little of why I think this book is so fantastic, at the very outset he describes Gospel Virginity as “a love affair of the most enthralling type.”

How much more that is than the worldly view of it as “giving up sex”!

Fr. Dubay speaks of an imaginary survey being taken on the subject and supposes that even among those with the most positive view of it being a freeing for apostolic service, most do not understand it as being in love with God.

In another chapter, he gives the most marvelous description of vocation that I’ve ever read. He describes how so many people, even religious, do not understand the difference between vocation and career. I love the following:

While a career is a mode of making a living [work] and contributing to the earthly welfare of the human community [apostolic works], a vocation is a call from the Divine Persons to a way of life. It is a beckoning, an invitation to give oneself totally to another person in accordance with the divine plan. [Thus, marriage is also deemed to be a vocation.] Superficial writers and speakers could have thought of the idea of a temporary vocation only because they were not thinking of a vocation at all. They were thinking of a career, an impersonal commitment to a job to be done. To be head over heels in love as a divine invitation seems to have escaped their vision of the evangelical counsels.
. . .
The most basic vocation is the call to love the Lord God with our whole heart, soul, mind, and strength…

However this general vocation is to be made concrete according to divinely planned ways of life: the threefold radical counsels, the priesthood, marriage. Scripture does not present singleness as such a vocation, for it does not include a self-gift to another. Rather it is a readiness for a self-gift. The God of revelation does call some men to the ministerial office in the Church. He calls some men and women to complete chastity, radical poverty, and a new obedience [for consecrated people not in religious life, the vows are lived in accordance with their secular lives], all for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. And he calls others to marriage and family life.

**

Well, I would love to quote the whole book, but…

To sum up, this book is excellent for anyone considering any form of consecrated life and talks not only about the main topic (Gospel Virginity) but delves into how vocation involves the totality of one’s being.

 

[simon_op]

Well, the one I use is reformed already few years ago. For which I am grateful I didn’t like it when I entered the Congregation. I used to it, but still…When I received it I already knew that what it means is far more important. The rest was just…the rest. But I am happy that it was decided to change it - we look similar to the Nashville Dominicans now - I am the Dominican of another branch.
We still are orthodox. I hope that we change of the veil is just - the change of the veil.
Now about the discernment - pray. God will show you the place when He will find you ready.

 

[sponsaChristi]

Thanks for all your replies and thoughts. I probably should’ve said more because many of you thought that I didn’t know what kind of life I believe God is calling me to or that I was making a decision just on the habit.
I feel called to the contemplative life and am looking at an Order that has variations among the different monasteries. I never gave the kind of veil a thought but then my friend said what she did and it kinda threw me and I was confused.

 

[yinekka]

Once you decide on the order you in which you are interested think about the habit. Those close fitting old style head gears can be very, very uncomfortable in summer. My mother used to speak of the Brown Joeys whose faces were bright red and sweating in the Australian summer.

Brown Joeys - Mary McKillop nuns