What Makes Catholicism the Only Church?

[guanophore]

That’s not what Jesus said. The Word says believe on Him and repent. Jesus NEVER says have your infants water baptized.

Well, setting infants aside, why did Jesus give the commandment to be baptized, and why did the Apostles teach that this was the way people entered the church?

Water baptism is unnecessary.

Are there also other things Jesus commanded that you think are unnecessary, like keeping the commandments?

The thief on the cross was not water baptized yet he was saved. Please don’t tell me about “baptism of desire” because it doesn’t exist.

I certainly hope it does, especiallly in your case! however, God can save whoever He wants, however He wants. He commanded us to be baptized, so we are bound by His commandment. He can do it other ways if He wants.

And no, the RCC is not the true church. It is unfortunate that so many people are deceived into believing such a lie. Millions of people are being lead astray because the message of confession and penance has replaced true Gospel of Jesus which is of a true heartfelt repentance toward sin.

How do you know if a person has “true heartfelt repentance toward sin”? I mean, is it right for you do judge whether Catholics who have gone to confession are truly sorry, or not?

You must be born-again of the spirit. Believe and repent. Completely turn away from your sins. If you are doing something you know you shouldn’t be doing… Jesus said… “sin no more”

Mat 7:14
Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

It is very Catholic of you to say that!

If the RCC was the one true church… this verse would be false. With over 1billion members… that’s 1 out of every 6 people in the World are Catholic… that’s hardly considered “few”. That seems to disqualify the RCC as the one true church based on size alone.

I have to admit that there do seem to be a great many “nominal” Catholics (in name only) who do not practice their faith. There are others that practice a form of godliness, lacking the power thereof. I don’t think it is my place to sort the tares from the wheat, though.

The Word says “find” the narrow way. RCC membership guarantees you nothing.

I am not sure what “RCC membership” means. It is not like people carry cards, or something…pay dues?

Gal 3:27-28
27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

All persons who are validly baptized are considered “members” of the body of Christ.

I am born-again and I am saved. I live a life of repentance and love. At this very moment, I know that I would go to Heaven if I were to die.

Jesus gave us 2 commandments if we are to follow Him. Love God with all your heart, soul, and mind… AND love others. I haven’t broken this commandment.

Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Many of us have experienced you comments on this forum as quite unloving, believers. You have a very uncharitable attitude toward Catholics, Catholicism, and various Catholic devotions.

There is no one righteous. Jesus came to call us sinners to repentance. I suggest you repent. Stop this nonsense of confession and penance. That won’t get you saved. If you sin… Jesus said “sin no more”. He didn’t give anyone penance. If you do happen to sin… confess it unto the Lord and not a man given the title of “father” by your church.

Psa 32:5
I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said, I will confess my transgressions unto the LORD; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah.

Obviously something happened to you that changed your heart, and you were able to turn to God. This is a good thing, and a great gift of grace. I do not understand, however, why you think that Jesus did not give anyone penance, or may I just don’t understand what you think penance is? Penance comes from the same root word as “repent”, to regret, to turn away. Is ths a semantics problem?

I understand that you don’t “get” the Apostolic succession and the office of the priesthood, but aside from that, I don’t understand what the disagreement is with “repentance” vs “penance”. Do you understand my confusion here?

 

[guanophore]

Faith in Jesus IS NOT a religious institution. Your religious institution didn’t give us the Word of God. God did. God may have used the RCC to help preserve the Word for a time with all her power and might. But that’s all. Your denomination was branded by Constantine and forced onto the real believers thru the ages. Faith in Jesus only believers have always existed. Not under a brand name like the RCC but in the hearts of a few. You would have known them by their love and not by artifacts.

I think we are in agreement that Jesus is not a religious institution. He did establish a Church, though, and he does have a body here on earth, of which all validly baptized persons are members. God chose to use the church to produce and preserve His written and oral word.

I see that you have been misinformed about history. I am surprised that you said in another post that “history books were written by man” and should not be given any credence, and yet now you are saying that the Catholic church was “branded by Constantine”. I would like you to give your sources for this. Also, I would like to understand what you mean by “branded”. Neither one of these concepts (Constantine and branded) are in the bible, so you must be getting them somewhere else.

For the record, I agree with you that force has been wrongly used to impose “faith” on people throughout recorded history. It is wrong.

I will confess to the Lord. Sorry… I believe the Word of God only.

Psa 32:5
I acknowledged my sin unto thee, and mine iniquity have I not hid. I said,** I will confess my transgressions unto the LORD**; and thou forgavest the iniquity of my sin. Selah.

It is good that you are confessing your sins to God. Confessing them to a priest is also confessing them to God. The priest represents Jesus to us. It is very good to hear from somone with skin and vocal cords “your sins are forgiven, go, and sin no more”.

 

[guanophore]

I will confess to the Lord. Sorry… I believe the Word of God only.

Actually, this turns out not to be the case, which is why you brought up false information about Constantine and his relationship to the Catholic Church.

What you’re not understanding is that the “church” does not refer to the RCC but the body of believers. You keep going on and on about how you think every time “church” is mentioned it refers to the RCC. “church” refers to the body of believers. Believers means those who have faith in Jesus only.

True, but “faith in Jesus only” is very inclusive. It means faith in the Apostolic Succession that He established, and His sacred word, both written, and oral. That is why we say to those who reject this, they are also rejecting Christ.

By the way… check out your signature. You say except you do penance you shall perish.

That is a VERY false statement.
You should be saying “except you REPENT you shall perish.”

It is the SAME VERSE believers! We are just looking at two different translations. Here is a clip from a Protestant commentary:

Luke 13:3

Except ye repent ean (NT:1437) mee (NT:3361) metanoeete (NT:3340). Present active subjunctive of metanoeoo (NT:3340), to change mind and conduct, linear action, keep on changing. Condition of third class, undetermined, but with prospect of determination.
(from Robertson’s Word Pictures in the New Testament, Electronic Database. Copyright (c) 1997 by Biblesoft & Robertson’s Word Pictures in the New Testament. Copyright (c) 1985 by Broadman Press)

the root translated “repent” or “do pennance” here is metanoia. It means to make a one eighty, to change one’s attidutes, actions, and expressions and make them consistent with what God requires. A present active subjective means that this is to be a continuing action in the present, not something that is done once, and finished, but ongoing.

Hope this helps.

 

[guanophore]

As some of you already know, I’m a cradle Catholic who was never really serious about the Church and its traditions. I had a personal relationship with God and did my best to lead a decent life, and that was good enough for me.

As I’m trying better to understand the Catholic faith, a question popped into my head: how do Catholics know that their faith is the only one brought forth by God? What if we have it all wrong and the Catholic faith is not righteous with God?

The CAtholic Church is certainly not the only one “brought forth by God”. As scripture teaches us:

Rom 1:20
20 Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made."

God has been revealing HImself to mankind since the He created human beings.

He revealed Himself more specifically to Abraham. Christians, Jews, and Muslims all trace their faith back to Abraham.

He reavealed himself more specifically to Moses, from which Judiasm developed. Through Judiasm, God revealed His messiah
" You (samaritans) worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews." John 4:22

Out of Judaism, Catholicism was born, and all the first Catholics were Jews beginning with Mary, and all the Apostles. Our faith has been handed down to us in an unbroken succession from those Apostles. Are there certain things that make you concerned that Catholicism has missed the mark?

 

[Claude_Kenneson]

Yes… you have a bishop over you and a pope over them. That’s not what the Word of God teaches.

A true New Testament church of God would NEVER give the title of “father” to any of it’s preachers. However, the RCC has no problem giving the title of “father” to it’s priests. A true NT church of God reserves the title of Father for God himself.

We also give the title of “father” to our earthly male parents. “Honor your father…” See Mark 7:10-11 But we know that we are forbidden to give to any man the position that belongs to God alone, who is our Supreme Father. That is the thought conveyed in the passage of “Call no man on earth your father…”