What new revelation does the holy Koran contain?

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Hinduism has talked about the commonality of all religions for thousands of years. Unity of nations and international organizations has been initiated by many secular and political leaders independent of Bahaullah/Bab (I still don’t think international relations is the domain of religious leaders, although they should always support them by preaching peace and unity).

Of course Muhammad created progress in the Arabian peninsula, but for Iran I think Islam was a step back instead of better progress (that’s when many Zoroastrian refugees escaped to India). For the other countries like Turkey, India - progress and development may have been just as quick (maybe quicker) without Islam - difficult to say.

Of course, once an empire is created by conquest and slaughter, the empire becomes a center for progress and development (the Roman empire also had progress in terms roads built, trade increased) - that is no reflection or the result of the religion practiced - perhaps it would have been even better with some other religion than with Islam.

But Arabia definitely needed Islam to get rid of tribalism, superstition, illiteracy and general backwardness…
Progress could not have been quicker without Islam dear brother. The evidence for was how much Arabia was languishing behind Europe in terms of development (before Muhammad) and how much it progressed PAST Europe and indeed influenced European progress AFTER Muhammad.

It really was a golden age.

That’s what the holy Quran brought 🙂

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Progress could not have been quicker without Islam dear brother. The evidence for was how much Arabia was languishing behind Europe in terms of development (before Muhammad) and how much it progressed PAST Europe and indeed influenced European progress AFTER Muhammad.

It really was a golden age.

That’s what the holy Quran brought 🙂

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You are in denial. I think the progress if any, was in spite of the Koran, not because of it.

The Koran, if anything, enforces the status quo and stifles innovation (scientific, economic, social - everything). This story is probably apocryphal but it is said that when they burnt the library at Alexandria, the Caliph said ‘if the books agree with Koran, they are superfluous, so burn them. It the books disagree, then they definitely should be burnt’

Islamic veneration of the Koran is itself a form of idolatry.
 
Tawheed is more than disbelieving in Jesus as the second person of the Trinity. Tawheed not in the in the New Testament-- the opposite is there. Trinitarians believe that God died on a cross. The Old Testament says that God neither sleeps, nor slumbers, but in the book of Mark, Jesus is sleeping on a boat.

Believing that God died is the opposite of Tawheed, because people die. Allah is beyond death, so to say that He died is contrary to Tawheed.

Is Tawheed it in the Old Testament, though? that is debatable.
We believe Jesus had both a Divine and Human nature (when He became man), it was His human nature that slept, and it was His human nature that died on the Cross and was resurrected on the third day.

The other thing that I don’t understand, is that I have heard that the Koran say’s that Jesus didn’t actually die on the cross and that he was a prophet and not the Son of God or Messiah.

The first thing is strange, because I am sure the Romans knew how to crucify people properly, they had been doing it for a long time, and it was St Longinus who pierced the heart of Jesus on the cross to make sure he was dead, as they were breaking the other two criminals legs so they wouldn’t be on the Cross during Passover and yet would still die, he also died quicker because of the scourging that took place beforehand.

I would also be more inclined to believe the ones who were around at the time and witnessed the events (even close to it), than Muhammad writing about it around 600 years later and somehow superseding everyone else over what occurred.

The second part about Jesus not being the Son of God or Messiah, I don’t understand, because I find it hard to believe that the Pharisees could demand His death on account of ‘Blasphemy’ if He only said or implied or meant that He was just a Prophet.
It is the one that is needed. As it is with all the Holy Words of God.

And their hearts are sealed so that they do not understand.
  • Surah at-Tawbah, 9:87
Allah has sealed their hearts so that they do not know.
  • Surah at-Tawhab, 9:93
We seal their hearts so they cannot hear (the Truth).
  • Surah al-A’raf, 7:100
22.46. Do they never travel about the earth (and view all these scenes with an eye to learn lessons), so that they may have hearts with which to reason (and arrive at truth), or ears with which to hear (God’s call)? For indeed, it is not the eyes that have become blind; it is rather the hearts in the breasts that are blind.

Regards Tony
This to me, sounds like simply a copy of what Jesus quoted to the Pharisees from Isaiah
"The Gospel of Matthew:
13 This is why I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. 14 With them indeed is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah which says:

‘You shall indeed hear but never understand,
and you shall indeed see but never perceive.

15
For this people’s heart has grown dull,
and their ears are heavy of hearing,
and their eyes they have closed,
lest they should perceive with their eyes,
and hear with their ears,
and understand with their heart,
and turn for me to heal them.’
As far as miracles are concerned. Muhammad was an illiterate man yet here we are 1400 years later still trying to understand a Book revealed to Him. How can an illiterate man produce a Book that can have 1.6 billion followers?
Because, I believe like any good error, to tread water it must contain some truth to it. Which I believe Muhammad had taken from the Old and New Testaments.

Anyway, just some of my thoughts, I hope this has helped

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh
 
Not one Person, one Spirit (the Word) which manifests itself on earth in a human form, as attested in the Bible Techno.

1 Tim3:6 And evidently great is the mystery of godliness, which was manifested in the flesh, was justified in the spirit, appeared unto angels, hath been preached unto the Gentiles, is believed in the world, is taken up in glory.

2 Tim1:10 But is now made manifest by the illumination of our Saviour Jesus Christ…

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So, 8 Spirits (the word) was speaking through Baha’u’llah?
 
Progress could not have been quicker without Islam dear brother. The evidence for was how much Arabia was languishing behind Europe in terms of development (before Muhammad) and how much it progressed PAST Europe and indeed influenced European progress AFTER Muhammad.

It really was a golden age.

That’s what the holy Quran brought 🙂

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The middle east has always languished behind Europe and continues to do so to this day. The so called golden age stopped when if bahai claims were true that the New revelation or thing God desired to bring was a better civilisation, we would have seen the modern west originate in the middle east, but it didn’t.
 
8 spirits?

Where did you find that from?

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Abraham, Krishna, Zoroaster, Moses, Buddha, Jesus Christ, Muhammad, Báb… what are they… spirits, people or word, and how do they relate to Baha’u’llah ?
 
The Promised One of all the peoples of the world hath appeared. All peoples and communities have been expecting a Revelation, and He, Bahá’u’lláh, is the foremost teacher and educator of all mankind.
–‘ABDU’L-BAHÁ

From where, or from who… does this prophecy talk about this “Promised One” and does this prophecy give the name… Bahá’u’lláh ?
 
Abraham, Krishna, Zoroaster, Moses, Buddha, Jesus Christ, Muhammad, Báb… what are they… spirits, people or word, and how do they relate to Baha’u’llah ?
When you read the word “manifest” what do you think it means Techno?

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The Promised One of all the peoples of the world hath appeared. All peoples and communities have been expecting a Revelation, and He, Bahá’u’lláh, is the foremost teacher and educator of all mankind.
–‘ABDU’L-BAHÁ

From where, or from who… does this prophecy talk about this “Promised One” and does this prophecy give the name… Bahá’u’lláh ?
Wrong thread Techno

You really should start a Baha’i thread for yourself, or go visit the Baha’is in New Orleans

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Not one Person, one Spirit (the Word) which manifests itself on earth in a human form, as attested in the Bible Techno.

1 Tim3:6 And evidently great is the mystery of godliness, which was manifested in the flesh, was justified in the spirit, appeared unto angels, hath been preached unto the Gentiles, is believed in the world, is taken up in glory.

2 Tim1:10 But is now made manifest by the illumination of our Saviour Jesus Christ…

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You keep twisting the Bible, this has nothing to do with Baha’u’llah.

New Living Translation

Without question, this is the great mystery of our faith: Christ was revealed in a human body and vindicated by the Spirit. He was seen by angels and announced to the nations. He was believed in throughout the world and taken to heaven in glory.

1 Timothy 3:16
 
You keep twisting the Bible, this has nothing to do with Baha’u’llah.

New Living Translation

Without question, this is the great mystery of our faith: Christ was revealed in a human body and vindicated by the Spirit. He was seen by angels and announced to the nations. He was believed in throughout the world and taken to heaven in glory.

1 Timothy 3:16
The great mystery has been revealed 🙂

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Not only do I not see in those words what you claim, Im not even sure how what you posted is an explanation. I don’t even know what you are saying. How is Baha’u’llah or the Bab or any other claimant relevant to this passage?
 
Not only do I not see in those words what you claim, Im not even sure how what you posted is an explanation. I don’t even know what you are saying. How is Baha’u’llah or the Bab or any other claimant relevant to this passage?
This is why I didn’t respond to your last post in this thread Syro.

Techno keeps on deviating the subject towards Baha’i and repeatedly asks questions which must be answered so that misunderstandings are not recorded.

Unfortunately ignorance of the Baha’i teachings is abounding…

I hope we can return to The Quran and its relevance again.

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Why should we choose Muhammad over Jesus, Muhammad was not known for miracles.Jesus came loaded with miracles just to prove who he was.
Might I just add that those who look for signs and wonders are, according to the Bible, following the example of Satan in Matthew 4.

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Might I just add that those who look for signs and wonders are, according to the Bible, following the example of Satan in Matthew 4.

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When I was with you, I certainly gave you** proof **that I am an apostle. For I patiently did many signs and **wonders and miracles **among you.

2 Corinthians 12:12

Servant19 … Satan knew full well that Jesus was a prophet by the miracles he was doing. What he did not know is whether Jesus was the** Only begotten Son of the Father** this information was kept from him.Matthew 4 is about the Devil’s attempt to ascertain this specific bit of information…for if the Devil knew that Jesus was truly the Son of God he would have never instigated the Crucifixion, and thus sealing his own fate to doom, and opening up the Gates of Heaven for mankind.
 
When I was with you, I certainly gave you** proof **that I am an apostle. For I patiently did many signs and **wonders and miracles **among you.

2 Corinthians 12:12
Though all signs and miracles are possible, We should not ask for them, we should not expect them. To use them as a proof of faith is not possible.

If you accept signs and wonders from one source as proof, then signs and wonders HAVE to be accepted from another.

The real mission is to change the heart of man into the way of God. this is the greatest sign of a True Prophet, that they achieve transformation of animal man to spiritual giants, with their Lives, Sacrifices and Word.

Regards Tony
 
The real mission is to change the heart of man into the way of God. this is the greatest sign of a True Prophet, that they achieve transformation of animal man to spiritual giants, with their Lives, Sacrifices and Word.

Regards Tony
I will look to the path of Jesus, and his Catholic Saints it’s a proven winner.
 
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