What saves, blood or water?

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The church is not what saves a person God is and the only means of salvation is Jesus
In Acts 9:36-40, who raised Tabitha from the dead? Was it God or Peter? Was it not both, the power of God working through Peter? In the same way, both God and the Church save. The saving graces of God merited by the blood of Jesus Christ for all mankind are ordinarily applied to the individual believer by means of the sacrament of baptism administered by the Church. God can save a person through Jesus in an extraordinary manner apart from the sacrament of baptism administered by the Church but, ordinarily, God saves, through Jesus, by means of the sacrament of baptism administered by the Church.
 
Afraid not; there is one, holy, catholic, and apostolic church. No other. You will note that I did not say “Roman Catholic”, but “Catholic”, and “Citizen of the Kingdom established by God”; There is no other Kingdom, there is no other Church, but only One.

Note: When we baptize a baby, we do not say, “Well, you are only a ‘generic Christian’ until you are confirmed Catholic”. No, you are baptized; you are Catholic, whether you realize it or not, like it or not, follow Catholic doctrine or not. And we want you in full fellowship because you are one of us.
The Catholic Church considers all such baptised people as Christians and not Catholics.

You also seem to be confused. The Catholic Church comprises all 24 churches which are obedient to Rome,of which the “Roman” Catholic Church to use your term is only one.
 
Asking Jesus into your heart is a great thing. Accepting him as your saviour is a great thing. All amen to that.

But you weren’t saved because you did that. That’s unbiblical; nowhere in the Bible is “accepting Jesus into your heart” regenerates you. It is explicit, however, that Baptism does. Everywhere the New Testament mentions conversion it is always followed by baptism. And no, the old objection that “baptism is merely a sign/statement that you’ve been saved” doesn’t hold water. Scripture is explicit: baptism itself saves you. It is in Baptism that the Blood of Jesus makes us a new creation. We do not exclude the Blood at all; if not for Calvary, baptism is for naught.

But baptism is absolutely necessary for Salvation. This is the Biblical teaching. It is therefore the Catholic teaching.
If we are talking about things being biblical several ppl here have told me that testing our beliefs to be true with scripture is false I think they called it sola scripture and that it’s man made. So which is it do we test our beliefs with the bible or not?
 
In Acts 9:36-40, who raised Tabitha from the dead? Was it God or Peter? Was it not both, the power of God working through Peter? In the same way, both God and the Church save. The saving graces of God merited by the blood of Jesus Christ for all mankind are ordinarily applied to the individual believer by means of the sacrament of baptism administered by the Church. God can save a person through Jesus in an extraordinary manner apart from the sacrament of baptism administered by the Church but, ordinarily, God saves, through Jesus, by means of the sacrament of baptism administered by the Church.
Then what of the thief on the cross? Luke 23: 42-43 …42And he was saying, “Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!” 43And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.

This thief on the cross wasn’t baptized
 
The thief on the cross is an example proving baptism of desire because had he met Our Lord before his Crucifixion the thief would have desired to be baptized with water and the Holy Spirit.

The early church fathers such as St. Augustine taught this and Catholic Church has beileved this for 2015 years.
 
We’re saved by grace, which means we’re saved by God. Jesus made this possible by reconciling us with God, by His sacrificial death-by shedding His blood IOW. The basic message is that God, alone, can save man. This salvation, then, is initated by God who gave His Son to die for us, accepted by us via faith, which is then formally and publicly professed by the sacrament of baptism.
 
Then what of the thief on the cross? Luke 23: 42-43 …42And he was saying, “Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!” 43And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.

This thief on the cross wasn’t baptized
There will be many in Paradise who are not Baptized, as many as helped Jesus with the kindnesses of feeding him (his body) when he was hungry with no food, giving him a drink when thirsty, visiting him with friendship when he was (his followers were) being persecuted for being from God in prison, etc. (“come, enter…, for when you did it to these, the least of my followers, my baptized citizenry of my Kingdom, you did it to me”.
Everyone who was a friend to him will be surprised and admitted, their sins forgiven by the King, because of their charity to the King whom they never recognized on Earth.

The thief on the cross tried in his own limited capacity to defend Jesus from the other thief while Jesus was being mortally persecuted. And Jesus demonstrated what he will do with all who deal in kindness toward him and toward his One Body the Church.
 
If we are talking about things being biblical several ppl here have told me that testing our beliefs to be true with scripture is false I think they called it sola scripture and that it’s man made. So which is it do we test our beliefs with the bible or not?
We do not believe in Scripture alone, but we do believe Scripture. All of it. That’s why we have no issue appealing to Scripture to support our teachings.

Whoever told you (if you haven’t misunderstood them) that we shouldn’t “test our beliefs” with the Bible are wrong. Wrong wrong wrong.
 
You have to understand, that we consider everyone Catholic who is baptized in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.
You are one of us, Catholic.
But being one of us in this new birth into Citizenship in the Kingdom established by God with Jesus as our King does not mean you are finished. Jesus told his apostles they must also confirm these newly born Citizens in the faith by teaching them all he commanded them. When that is done there is full fellowship of active discipleship in the mission of the Church and moving on to the depth of the faith, the depth of the love of God, rather than dwelling on basic elements of the faith as if that is all there was.

You are one of us, Catholic. You have no idea the riches that are there in full fellowship. (I say that as formerly being Lutheran, a very well educated Lutheran, who never dreamed there could be so much more than I thought was so good back then)
This is a correct statement. There is only one mystical church body. Baptists, Lutheran etc. are baptized into that one church because of Christian baptism. But in reality they are part of the one church. So this is a correct statement even though they do not know they are. There is only one Church to be baptized into; the one Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. However ignorance to that knowledge is another reason why we have a plethora of other Christian denominations. Now one can argue over the LANGUAGE that they are not part of the Catholic church and that is also a true statement because physically they are not part of it since they are not practicing Catholics in the physical Church. So simply I guess you could put it that here in the physical realm they are not part of the physical Catholic church but in reality in the spiritual realm they are part of the Catholic Church because there is only one mystical body of Jesus Christ and that is the Catholic Church.
 
Then what of the thief on the cross? Luke 23: 42-43 …42And he was saying, “Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!” 43And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.

This thief on the cross wasn’t baptized
Given the circumstances of his last-minute conversion, I feel confident in saying that the thief on the cross received the saving graces of God merited by Jesus’ death on the Cross in an extraordinary manner apart from the sacrament of baptism, a possibility I mention in my previous post.

God does not require us to do what we are ignorant of nor what is impossible for us to do. Did the thief know anything about sacrament of Christian baptism, commanded after Jesus rose from the dead (Matthew 28:19)? No. Even if he had known about the sacrament, was it possible for the thief to receive it? No. Certainly baptism by immersion was an impossibility for him.
 
This is a correct statement. There is only one mystical church body. Baptists, Lutheran etc. are baptized into that one church because of Christian baptism. But in reality they are part of the one church. So this is a correct statement even though they do not know they are. There is only one Church to be baptized into; the one Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. However ignorance to that knowledge is another reason why we have a plethora of other Christian denominations. Now one can argue over the LANGUAGE that they are not part of the Catholic church and that is also a true statement because physically they are not part of it since they are not practicing Catholics in the physical Church. So simply I guess you could put it that here in the physical realm they are not part of the physical Catholic church but in reality in the spiritual realm they are part of the Catholic Church because there is only one mystical body of Jesus Christ and that is the Catholic Church.
If only the RCC is the body of Christ, then where was it in the book of Acts? Christians were known as the “people of the way”. Was there no body? This does not make sense.
 
If only the RCC is the body of Christ, then where was it in the book of Acts? Christians were known as the “people of the way”. Was there no body? This does not make sense.
I never said the Roman Catholic Church. I said the Catholic Church. The RCC is the Latin Rite of the one Catholic Church. Even in the first years of the Church they identified as Catholic because people did back then what they do today. They split from the church. They are still Christian because of the basic common beliefs. Referring to the church as Christ’s mystical body is common language in the Catholic faith. When we are baptized we are taken up into his mystical body. We cannot enter heaven except through Him, with Him and IN Him. We are once entered into Him through baptism. We alone merit nothing however when we stay “in Christ” that also entails us to live in a “state of grace”. Living righteously as he did and rejecting sin. When we do these things we raise up His mystical body because we are in Him. When we sin we raise evil up and allow evil to enter the Church. Also the book of Acts and the Bible in general is not the only place to look for facts because it does not say that in the Bible. Perhaps 1 Corinthians can help.

One Body, Many Parts.

12*As a body is one though it has many parts, and all the parts of the body, though many, are one body, so also Christ.

13*For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, slaves or free persons, and we were all given to drink of one Spirit.

14*Now the body is not a single part, but many.

15*If a foot should say, “Because I am not a hand I do not belong to the body,” it does not for this reason belong any less to the body.

16*Or if an ear should say, “Because I am not an eye I do not belong to the body,” it does not for this reason belong any less to the body.

17*If the whole body were an eye, where would the hearing be? If the whole body were hearing, where would the sense of smell be?

18*But as it is, God placed the parts, each one of them, in the body as he intended.

19*If they were all one part, where would the body be?

20*But as it is, there are many parts, yet one body.

21*The eye cannot say to the hand, “I do not need you,” nor again the head to the feet, “I do not need you.”

22*Indeed, the parts of the body that seem to be weaker are all the more necessary,

23*and those parts of the body that we consider less honorable we surround with greater honor, and our less presentable parts are treated with greater propriety,

24*whereas our more presentable parts do not need this. But God has so constructed the body as to give greater honor to a part that is without it,

25*so that there may be no division in the body, but that the parts may have the same concern for one another.

26*If [one] part suffers, all the parts suffer with it; if one part is honored, all the parts share its joy.

Application to Christ.

27*Now you are Christ’s body, and individually parts of it.
 
i believe that when we were save not only by our Baptized,but also by our Lord suffering,for when he was speared ,Blood and Water flowed from his Heart.,so threw the Divine Mercy we can be saved when we say it.
 
If only the RCC is the body of Christ, then where was it in the book of Acts? Christians were known as the “people of the way”. Was there no body? This does not make sense.
The Book of Acts is written by, for, and about Catholics.

The Catholic Church is not “Roman”.
 
i believe that when we were save not only by our Baptized,but also by our Lord suffering,for when he was speared ,Blood and Water flowed from his Heart.,so threw the Divine Mercy we can be saved when we say it.
This is true, of course, but they are not separated from each other. Baptism is the manner in which His saving Blood is applied to our souls.
 
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