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AndrewAxland
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Of course, he isn’t. He’s just trolling.
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Francis
Guest
Very insightful, Food for the soul ,nice to ponder.
@MockSock
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s1c1a8.htm
1857 For a sin to be mortal, three conditions must together be met: "Mortal sin is sin whose object is grave matter and which is also committed with full knowledge and deliberate consent."131
1858 Grave matter is specified by the Ten Commandments, corresponding to the answer of Jesus to the rich young man: "Do not kill, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor your father and your mother."132 The gravity of sins is more or less great: murder is graver than theft. One must also take into account who is wronged: violence against parents is in itself graver than violence against a stranger.
1859 Mortal sin requires full knowledge and complete consent. It presupposes knowledge of the sinful character of the act, of its opposition to God’s law. It also implies a consent sufficiently deliberate to be a personal choice. Feigned ignorance and hardness of heart133 do not diminish, but rather increase, the voluntary character of a sin.
1860 Unintentional ignorance can diminish or even remove the imputability of a grave offense. But no one is deemed to be ignorant of the principles of the moral law, which are written in the conscience of every man. The promptings of feelings and passions can also diminish the voluntary and free character of the offense, as can external pressures or pathological disorders. Sin committed through malice, by deliberate choice of evil, is the gravest.
1861 Mortal sin is a radical possibility of human freedom, as is love itself. It results in the loss of charity and the privation of sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by repentance and God’s forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ’s kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices for ever, with no turning back. However, although we can judge that an act is in itself a grave offense, we must entrust judgment of persons to the justice and mercy of God.
@MockSock
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s1c1a8.htm
1857 For a sin to be mortal, three conditions must together be met: "Mortal sin is sin whose object is grave matter and which is also committed with full knowledge and deliberate consent."131
1858 Grave matter is specified by the Ten Commandments, corresponding to the answer of Jesus to the rich young man: "Do not kill, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor your father and your mother."132 The gravity of sins is more or less great: murder is graver than theft. One must also take into account who is wronged: violence against parents is in itself graver than violence against a stranger.
1859 Mortal sin requires full knowledge and complete consent. It presupposes knowledge of the sinful character of the act, of its opposition to God’s law. It also implies a consent sufficiently deliberate to be a personal choice. Feigned ignorance and hardness of heart133 do not diminish, but rather increase, the voluntary character of a sin.
1860 Unintentional ignorance can diminish or even remove the imputability of a grave offense. But no one is deemed to be ignorant of the principles of the moral law, which are written in the conscience of every man. The promptings of feelings and passions can also diminish the voluntary and free character of the offense, as can external pressures or pathological disorders. Sin committed through malice, by deliberate choice of evil, is the gravest.
1861 Mortal sin is a radical possibility of human freedom, as is love itself. It results in the loss of charity and the privation of sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by repentance and God’s forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ’s kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices for ever, with no turning back. However, although we can judge that an act is in itself a grave offense, we must entrust judgment of persons to the justice and mercy of God.
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Maximilian75
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I mean, very little else of his post is troll-esque, and he’s answering objections/follow up questions in a non-troll manner…
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AndrewAxland
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The mention of “Wicca/ Paganism/ even Satanism” in the original post was a dead giveaway.
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Maximilian75
Guest
Seems like pretty run-of-the-mill New Age-ism to me.
But, even if the OP is a troll, I learned a few new things in this thread, so… it’s an overall win haha
But, even if the OP is a troll, I learned a few new things in this thread, so… it’s an overall win haha
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MockSock
Guest
I don’t know whether they actually did it or not in the end but they seemed pretty serious when they invited me to join them. Maybe they just wanted my money, or said it for shock value as you suggest, I don’t know.
By the way, we are in the UK, I don’t know what the law is regarding sacrificial bulls here.
@Maximilian75
@AndrewAxland
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AndrewAxland
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It seems more like what a troll would think that clueless Christians would think that run-of-the-mill New Age-ism is. And the animal sacrifice thing was over the top.
If your Spidey sense is sharper now, then it is an overall win.
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Maximilian75
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shrug
take it up with the OP, dude.
take it up with the OP, dude.
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FollowChrist34
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I would have done exactly the same thing. I think it’s just human nature. One way to overcome this tendency is to picture how you want others to see your faith; how you represent it. If you have a favorite saint or Father, what would he or she have done? What kind of reputation do you want to give Christianity. I always feel quite depressed when I realize I have slipped up like this; when I have behaved inappropriately in the name of being a Christian.
However, your point about religious freedom, especially in America, a country founded by religious settlers escaping persecution, is spot on. If you just said it to make that point I wouldn’t worry. Christ had bad days too; he was not always ‘nice.’ I would be very wary of any Christian/Catholic who tries to tell you that.
This goes back to whether to turn the other cheek or witness the faith. Unfortunately there is no set rule I am aware of.
However, your point about religious freedom, especially in America, a country founded by religious settlers escaping persecution, is spot on. If you just said it to make that point I wouldn’t worry. Christ had bad days too; he was not always ‘nice.’ I would be very wary of any Christian/Catholic who tries to tell you that.
This goes back to whether to turn the other cheek or witness the faith. Unfortunately there is no set rule I am aware of.
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AndrewAxland
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Rule number one of internet forums: Do not feed the trolls.
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redbetta
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I’d imagine they were lying to you, thinking that a “dumb Christian” would believe it.
I’m pretty sure all western nations have laws against ritual sacrifice outside producing halal and kosher foods.
I’m pretty sure all western nations have laws against ritual sacrifice outside producing halal and kosher foods.
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mrsdizzyd
Guest
Ritual sacrifice happens quite a bit. That in and of itself isn’t necessarily troll-esque.
Now, sacrificing a bull is a bit challenging, but if you live in an agricultural area even that could be easily accomplished.
I grew up in a major city, yet I personally knew practioners of Santeria who frequently sacrificed goats and chickens.
Now, sacrificing a bull is a bit challenging, but if you live in an agricultural area even that could be easily accomplished.
I grew up in a major city, yet I personally knew practioners of Santeria who frequently sacrificed goats and chickens.
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AndrewAxland
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Wicca and Santeria are worlds apart. Wiccans don’t sacrifice animals. Or dabble in “Satanism”.
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mrsdizzyd
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Quite right. Wiccans do not sacrifice animals.mrsdizzyd:
Wicca and Santeria are worlds apart. Wiccans don’t sacrifice animals. Or dabble in “Satanism”.
However, the OP has said one roommate seems to have shifted gears toward Satanism, and Satanists do sacrifice animals.
This is why I said that the mention of sacrifice isn’t troll-esque in and of itself.
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Francis
Guest
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a1.htm
Divination and magic
2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility.
2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future.48 Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.
1 Corinthians 10:20-22- 20 No, I imply that what pagans sacrifice, they sacrifice to demons and not to God. I do not want you to be partners with demons. 21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons. You cannot partake of the table of the Lord and the table of demons. 22 Or are we provoking the Lord to jealousy? Are we stronger than he?
Deuteronomy 12:23-25 23 Only be sure that you do not eat the blood; for the blood is the life, and you shall not eat the life with the meat. 24 Do not eat it; you shall pour it out on the ground like water. 25 Do not eat it, so that all may go well with you and your children after you, because you do what is right in the sight of the Lord
Deuteronomy 18:9-14 9 When you come into the land that the Lord your God is giving you, you must not learn to imitate the abhorrent practices of those nations. 10 No one shall be found among you who makes a son or daughter pass through fire, or who practices divination, or is a soothsayer, or an augur, or a sorcerer, 11 or one who casts spells, or who consults ghosts or spirits, or who seeks oracles from the dead. 12 For whoever does these things is abhorrent to the Lord; it is because of such abhorrent practices that the Lord your God is driving them out before you. 13 You must remain completely loyal to the Lord your God. 14 Although these nations that you are about to dispossess do give heed to soothsayers and diviners, as for you, the Lord your God does not permit you to do so.
Divination and magic
2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility.
2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future.48 Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.
1 Corinthians 10:20-22- 20 No, I imply that what pagans sacrifice, they sacrifice to demons and not to God. I do not want you to be partners with demons. 21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons. You cannot partake of the table of the Lord and the table of demons. 22 Or are we provoking the Lord to jealousy? Are we stronger than he?
Deuteronomy 12:23-25 23 Only be sure that you do not eat the blood; for the blood is the life, and you shall not eat the life with the meat. 24 Do not eat it; you shall pour it out on the ground like water. 25 Do not eat it, so that all may go well with you and your children after you, because you do what is right in the sight of the Lord
Deuteronomy 18:9-14 9 When you come into the land that the Lord your God is giving you, you must not learn to imitate the abhorrent practices of those nations. 10 No one shall be found among you who makes a son or daughter pass through fire, or who practices divination, or is a soothsayer, or an augur, or a sorcerer, 11 or one who casts spells, or who consults ghosts or spirits, or who seeks oracles from the dead. 12 For whoever does these things is abhorrent to the Lord; it is because of such abhorrent practices that the Lord your God is driving them out before you. 13 You must remain completely loyal to the Lord your God. 14 Although these nations that you are about to dispossess do give heed to soothsayers and diviners, as for you, the Lord your God does not permit you to do so.
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AndrewAxland
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Basically, any mention of “Satanism” on a Christian forum is trolling. The sacrifice thing was just icing on the cake.
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Maximilian75
Guest
How, other than mentioning satanism, is this OP trolling?
His original question concerned a remark he made when his roommate gave him a hard time about going to Mass… if the roommates were Buddhists or Hindus, would you think the OP was trolling?
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mrsdizzyd
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If you want to stick you head in the sand that is on you. However, Satan is real, and satanists exist (there is currently an uptick in organized satanist congregations establishing “churches”) . Therefore, people will have questions from time to time.mrsdizzyd:
Basically, any mention of “Satanism” on a Christian forum is trolling. The sacrifice thing was just icing on the cake.
Those who want to help should do so as long as the person seems to be asking in earnest.
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CradleRC58
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So you come to the thread accusing someone of trolling with a cute little rhyme which is ignored. Then you come back with the accusation again.
Isn’t that what trolls do ? Seek attention. :;
Isn’t that what trolls do ? Seek attention. :;
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AndrewAxland
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You’ll eventually get experience with how to recognize trolls as you encounter more of them. This is a classic trolling technique that depends on getting a rise out of clueless Christians whose knowledge of other religions comes from their fertile imaginations and has no basis in reality.
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