What should I tell my priest?

[CompSciGuy]

When I have crises of faith I keep going to Mass and praying the Divine Office. Drag yourself kicking and screaming if you have to. If your priest does ask, say you’re having a crisis of faith, and have difficulty believing at the moment. I am pretty sure he will understand. If his is a mature faith he too will have had is own “dark night of the soul” at some point in his journey.

But just keep going to Mass, at least for several months and see what happens.

This is the best advice anyone has given. When you have doubts don’t give up on faith. Keep going. The best part is that Catholics have the sacraments which keep us in line.

Those with crises of faith should pray to St. Thomas every day. He is my patron and the help of all who suffer from doubt. I know from experience.

 

[CompSciGuy]

As far as the “sinner in the pew” thing, once I invited a Protestant friend to attend Mass with me. I made sure to warn her that when she entered the church building, she was going to be surrounded by sinners. And in fact, she would be sitting next to one … Namely, me. There’s room for improvement for all of us!

This reminds me, a friend of mine was talking with his dad, trying to convince him to go to church. His dad commented that he thought a lot of people in church were hypocrites. My friend replied, “Well, there’s always room for one more!”

 

[Bohm_Bawerk]

He’s afraid of what his priest will think, and he only wants to attend Mass 'for the sake of me “being there” '. He wants to call himself an atheist but he doesn’t want to actually walk the walk.

Now, if he were saying he’s not sure any more about being an atheist, and wants to attend Mass to sort out whether he should come back, then of course he should keep attending. But he shouldn’t attend just to hide his atheism from others.

You’re right. I don’t want to attend Mass. I know conclusively that God doesn’t exist. But I feel I have to still go to Mass to make others happy…

My priest doesn’t know I’m an atheist, but because I have missed Mass for quite a while, it seems as if he’s rather worried.

 

[Trishie]

As others have said, be honest with the priest. It’s unhealthy to pretend, and wrong to lie.
You may find the priest is able to help you if you honestly discuss your issues and present state of mind to him. What you think he expects from you is irrelevant. It’s never easy for believers if someone we care about loses the blessing of faith, but most of us have that experience of people who lose certainty about faith. Many people have a crisis of faith.
In asking to see you, the priest may already have some idea something is amiss, and is concerned enough for your welfare to want to see you and see how things are and if he can help.
Whatever reason he wants to see you, you can at least give him a chance to assist you if you tell him the truth about what you think and feel.
I hope the meeting will be of benefit to you.

 

[Bohm_Bawerk]

Bohm, I remember you really looking forward to Madrid and WYD. What’s gone wrong?

How’s it over at Liverpool?

The World Youth Day was absolutely thrilling. Words fail to describe what I experienced. I’m convinced to such an extent that I believe every young person who professes to be Catholic should make a pilgrimage to this event at least once in their lifetime; in the same light Muslims have to make the Hajj at least once in their lifetime. I wish every day was a World Youth Day, but sadly, that’s beyond the scope of reality.

My loss of faith had absolutely nothing to do with the World Youth Day. It was what I saw with my own eyes after I came back that I knew that God is without a doubt, non-existent.

But to any Catholic thinking of going to the World Youth Day: Go! Especially with your parish/diocese. I can not recommend this event enough!

 

[Bohm_Bawerk]

I’ll probably resume going back to Mass in about 2 weeks. I really hate disappointing people, and if it means I have to sacrifice only one hour out of an entire week until I move out of this city, then so be it.

On my World Youth Day pilgrimage, some were even speculating as to whether I was planning on becoming an evangelist or priest, so to find out I lost my faith completely would be rather spooky.

 

[AdesteFideles]

My loss of faith had absolutely nothing to do with the World Youth Day. It was what I saw with my own eyes after I came back that I knew that God is without a doubt, non-existent.

If this issue has been somehow dealt with in your own life to such an extent that you can have absolute certitude, then I would suggest to you that you have a moral obligation to those who lack such a developed knowledge of reality, to in fact provide them with the evidence they so clearly require.

Would your priest not benefit greatly from your enlightenment? After all, to live in such a state of ignorance as to assert things which are clearly contrary to the obvious truth is to live in a state which limits his potential for happiness in this (his only) period of existence.

On the other hand, perhaps the case is not so clear-cut; and perhaps there is yet much to be learned.

 

[Bohm_Bawerk]

If this issue has been somehow dealt with in your own life to such an extent that you can have absolute certitude, then I would suggest to you that you have a moral obligation to those who lack such a developed knowledge of reality, to in fact provide them with the evidence they so clearly require.

Would your priest not benefit greatly from your enlightenment? After all, to live in such a state of ignorance as to assert things which are clearly contrary to the obvious truth is to live in a state which limits his potential for happiness in this (his only) period of existence.

Not necessarily, because some people find believing in God makes them lead more moral lives. Even Richard Dawkins himself said to Bill O’Reilly in an interview on Fox News that if believing in God made him live a more fulfilling life, then he can’t blame him for that. The eminent philosopher Bertrand Russell, in a short article of his remarked that simply because certain people may live a more moral life with belief in God does not necessarily prove the objective existence of God. I can say personally, that I follow a lot of Catholic teachings (e.g. anti-abortion, subsidiarity, etc), because I recognize without such rules in place, society can quickly turn into moral anarchy. And in fact, it has. If there is anything the World Youth Day has taught me, is that I would rather live in Catholic Spain than Secular here. But in and of itself, that isn’t a proof of God’s existence.

There is actually one book I have on me that disproves God’s existence by asserting God is only a psychological phenomenon. I’ll try and read it when I have time, but at prima facie at least, it does outline my own personal beliefs as to why God doesn’t exist but is necessary as a sort of evolutionary consequence for the development of society.

 

[fred_conty]

In addition, I was thinking of returning to Mass in about 2 weeks time for the sake of me “being there” (not participating in the Eucharist as I don’t believe in the Real Presence). The problem is, I don’t want to keep sitting in the pew and making myself look like a great sinner to the congregation.

In our parish church we have people who remain in their pews at communion. It could be
for any number of reasons: marriage problems, non-catholics, had breakfast before Mass,
family problem that week, those taking catecetical class, upset and out of sorts with someone and don’t feel right to go, and a few more. I don’t think a thing of it. I’ve also noticed that this is also the case with other parishes as well. If anyone should happen to ask about it, just say it is a special situation that is being looked into. You should go to Mass, and you have the right to keep it up, and also any other catholic practices as well. The church is for everyone and I’m glad you want to go.

 

[Lisa44]

Well, you cannot recieve communion but you probably already knew that.
I would think your next stop would be confession?
Why don’t you want to confess this?

 

[PatriceA]

I’ll probably resume going back to Mass in about 2 weeks. I really hate disappointing people, and if it means I have to sacrifice only one hour out of an entire week until I move out of this city, then so be it.

On my World Youth Day pilgrimage, some were even speculating as to whether I was planning on becoming an evangelist or priest, so to find out I lost my faith completely would be rather spooky.

It breaks my heart to hear what you are saying.

Please, please, please talk to your priest or someone else you trust in your life. To go to WYD and describe it as you have and then to call yourself an athiest not more than a month later, something very traumatic must have taken place and you need at least some spiritual counseling if not some professional counseling of some sort. You sound troubled, you sound depressed and you need help. Get some help ASAP. Don’t wait for two weeks to go by and then go to Mass. You need to address this situation NOW.

 

[tonyrey]

I’ll try and read it when I have time, but at prima facie at least, it does outline my own personal beliefs as to why God doesn’t exist but is necessary as a sort of evolutionary consequence for the development of society.

Your statement can be interpreted to mean the belief that God doesn’t exist is necessary as an evolutionary consequence for the development of society! Perhaps that is your intention…

 

[tonyrey]

It was what I saw with my own eyes after I came back that I knew that God is without a doubt, non-existent.

How can you possibly see that God doesn’t exist? It’s a logical impossibility! Nothing you can see demonstrates the non-existence of spiritual reality…

 

[Bohm_Bawerk]

How can you possibly see that God doesn’t exist? It’s a logical impossibility! Nothing you can see demonstrates the non-existence of spiritual reality…

No it isn’t. For example, people recognize as they grow up that Santa Claus doesn’t exist.

 

[CompSciGuy]

How’s it over at Liverpool?
My loss of faith had absolutely nothing to do with the World Youth Day. It was what I saw with my own eyes after I came back that** I knew that God is without a doubt, non-existent. **

Without a doubt??? And how in the world did you come to that conclusion?

 

[CompSciGuy]

No it isn’t. For example, people recognize as they grow up that Santa Claus doesn’t exist.

People realize that Santa Claus doesn’t exist because they realize that their parents were putting the toys under the tree all along. It isn’t the same case with God. We can know that God exists through the Cosmological argument, etc. The “official” atheist response is not “I know without a doubt that God does not exist,” it is rather “I don’t know so I won’t assume.”

 

[Bohm_Bawerk]

People realize that Santa Claus doesn’t exist because they realize that their parents were putting the toys under the tree all along. It isn’t the same case with God. We can know that God exists through the Cosmological argument, etc. The “official” atheist response is not “I know without a doubt that God does not exist,” it is rather “I don’t know so I won’t assume.”

A better example perhaps would be Bertrand Russell’s “cosmic teapot” ( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_teapot ), a tongue-in-cheek analogy that Russell used to show the non-existence of God. Ultimately, no one can disprove the “cosmic teapot” because it is unfalsifiable. And by virtue of it being unfalsifiable, many philosophers such as Karl Popper would regard believing in it as spurious.

To claim that the Cosmological Argument is proof of God’s existence overlooks the fact that there are a multitude of atheistic arguments refuting it. We can produce the maxim that for every theistic argument, there is an equal and opposite atheistic argument to refute it. Inevitably, the theist always has to retreat back to faith, for Scripture says itself: “Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see.” (Hebrews 11:1).

 

[Tantum_ergo]

A better example perhaps would be Bertrand Russell’s “cosmic teapot” ( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_teapot ), a tongue-in-cheek analogy that Russell used to show the non-existence of God. Ultimately, no one can disprove the “cosmic teapot” because it is unfalsifiable. And by virtue of it being unfalsifiable, many philosophers such as Karl Popper would regard believing in it as spurious.

To claim that the Cosmological Argument is proof of God’s existence overlooks the fact that there are a multitude of atheistic arguments refuting it. We can produce the maxim that for every theistic argument, there is an equal and opposite atheistic argument to refute it. Inevitably, the theist always has to retreat back to faith, for Scripture says itself: “Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see.” (Hebrews 11:1).

A man is setting out from New York City on a cruise ship to Greece. He has never been to Greece, never met a person who come from Greece. He has read of Greece, seen pictures on TV, read books. . .but he has never traveled outside of NYC.

After a day or so, the ship is in the middle of the Atlantic. There is nothing to be seen of the continent behind, but of course the man KNOWS it exists because he came from there.

But what of Greece? The man does not KNOW it exists by personal knowledge (never was there). . .and from the ship, he can’t see any land ahead at all.

He is SURE that what he hopes for is out there even though he cannot see it, and he is certain he will find the Greece he’s been told of.

You’ll say, but Greece really exists (even if you’ve never been there yourself). You’ll say, “I’ve seen pictures, I’ve heard stories from people who have been there, I trust that all I have seen and read is true even though I have not experienced it.”

Well, Christ has BEEN to earth and we know of it. Certainly saints have been given relevations as well. So we have the same kind of situation as this man setting off for Greece.

He has HEARD of Greece. We have heard of God. He has read about people who went to Greece. We have read about people who walked and talked with God. Even though he is now far away from his home and Greece is nowhere in sight, he believes the ship will come and dock there. Even though we are far from heaven and it is nowhere in sight, WE believe we will come there as well.

 

[Bohm_Bawerk]

A man is setting out from New York City on a cruise ship to Greece. He has never been to Greece, never met a person who come from Greece. He has read of Greece, seen pictures on TV, read books. . .but he has never traveled outside of NYC.

After a day or so, the ship is in the middle of the Atlantic. There is nothing to be seen of the continent behind, but of course the man KNOWS it exists because he came from there.

But what of Greece? The man does not KNOW it exists by personal knowledge (never was there). . .and from the ship, he can’t see any land ahead at all.

He is SURE that what he hopes for is out there even though he cannot see it, and he is certain he will find the Greece he’s been told of.

You’ll say, but Greece really exists (even if you’ve never been there yourself). You’ll say, “I’ve seen pictures, I’ve heard stories from people who have been there, I trust that all I have seen and read is true even though I have not experienced it.”

Well, Christ has BEEN to earth and we know of it. Certainly saints have been given relevations as well. So we have the same kind of situation as this man setting off for Greece.

He has HEARD of Greece. We have heard of God. He has read about people who went to Greece. We have read about people who walked and talked with God. Even though he is now far away from his home and Greece is nowhere in sight, he believes the ship will come and dock there. Even though we are far from heaven and it is nowhere in sight, WE believe we will come there as well.

Hello Tantum Ergo,

Thank you for your thoughtful post. That said, Greece isn’t/wasn’t “unknowable” in the same fashion as God. We have geography for a reason. And even in the days when geography wasn’t a fully developed field, Greece wasn’t deemed “unknowable” as it was “we do not know yet”. And by what we call a posteriori knowledge (knowledge gained through discovery/the scientific method), discoverers determined that Greece existed. Often, the discoverers went there for trade, and it became more than clear that Greece and Greek people do exist.

Making the assertion that saints have had revelations, and ergo the existence of God, produces many errors. Firstly, the Church itself deems private revelation as not binding on the faithful because it’s outside the closure of public revelation at 100 AD. Secondly, different saints have claimed different things, some of them even quite contrary to Church teaching. St. Catherine of Siena, for example, once denied the Immaculate Conception (a dogma of the Church). It eventually boils down to: Who’s right? Who’s wrong? And what makes one private revelation more credible than the other - was St. Catherine of Siena correct, and the Church wrong?

 

[grannymh]

In addition, I was thinking of returning to Mass in about 2 weeks time for the sake of me “being there” (not participating in the Eucharist as I don’t believe in the Real Presence). The problem is, I don’t want to keep sitting in the pew and making myself look like a great sinner to the congregation.

Small note. There are a number of Christians, who are not Catholics, who go with a family member or friends to the Mass and remain in the pew during Communion. Also, there are some individuals who go because they are curious and they remain in the pew. Unless you are in a tiny Church community, most of the time no one notices or even cares who is sitting in the pew. One other observation. Sit in the back because a lot of these people leave after Communion or during Communion. They might think you got to the pew early because there are people who do not drink the wine.

One other suggestion. Go to a different Mass and sit in a different place. Most likely, you will be among strangers and they will probably think you might be in R.C.I.A. or are a curious Protestant. Or do as my kids used to do. Go to the Church (we had three Catholic ones) which had the latest Mass or the most convenient one if they were going to do something special.

You can always wear sun glasses.