What should you think about before marriage?

[Just_wondering]

I’ve been thinking about marriage a lot recently (being around the right age and all), and I’ve been wondering what are some issues you should resolve before marriage? Also, what kind of questions should you ask yourself and your future spouse before agreeing to tie the knot?

What’s leading me to wonder this is that my best friend has been married about six months. She and her husband have been fighting a lot about his smoking. He didn’t smoke before they got married (that she knew of) and told her that he started recently because he’s so stressed at work. She would never have considered marrying a smoker. Now that she knows he smokes, she’s been throwing the “d-word” around, and threatening to take up equally life-threatening habits, like riding a motorbike without a helmet. They seem to spend a lot of time threatening things like, “if you don’t stop doing this, I’ll start doing that!” and “if you do that, I’ll file for divorce!”

I am also in a relationship, and I’m worried that if we haven’t worked out the important issues before marriage, we’ll end up in nasty fights like hers. I am not willing to threaten divorce - to me, that’s hitting below the belt, especially since my boyfriend had a wife before who abandoned him and the children.

So, to all the married folks out there, are there issues you wish you’d worked out before the wedding bells rang?

Also, I’ve never had a serious fight with my boyfriend. I’ve been told that if you haven’t fought, you shouldn’t consider marriage. However, both my boyfriend and I dislike arguing. We’ve had our disagreements, but the script goes like this:

Him: Honey, I don’t want you going out at night alone. If it’s dark, leave your errands for another day.
Me: But baby, it gets dark so early here. After I finish work, I have only an hour of daylight. How about I promise not to go out after 9pm?
Him: Not good enough. I’ll worry about you if you’re out alone at night.
Me: But I’m taking night classes. I can’t be home until 10pm sometimes.
Him: Well, night classes are an exception. On days when you don’t have class, don’t go out alone after dark.
Me: I can do that, but sometimes I’ll want to meet my friends downtown after dark.
Him: Then one of them has to walk you home. I don’t want you out alone after dark.

Now, to me, that seems like a reasonable kind of disagreement, but my friend who has the screaming arguments says that I’m letting him control my life. She says that if I give an inch now, he’ll turn into a controlling husband later. She also said that I should make an equal number of demands on him, just to test that he’s willing to compromise.

So what do you think? Is he showing concern for my safety or trying to control me? Should couples get married before they’ve had a fight? Are there other issues we should discuss before we think about getting engaged?

 

[LSK]

What issues?

1. Religion
2. money
3. children
4. money
5. politics
6. money

Ok, I’m being funny…the reality of life is that you should have a reasonable understanding of how your future spouse will approach religion, money, children and politics and whether or not his views are compatible to your views. Is he a Catholic? If he is not a Catholic, is he willing to have his children raised in the Faith and fully participate in that part of their lives (praying as a family, going to Mass, etc). How does he spend his money? Does he believe in a savings account? Would he expect you to work or would he be willing to be the only one to work outside the home so that you could be a stay-at-home mom? Do you want to be a stay-at-home mom? What are his political views? Is he someone who is very conservative or very liberal and will this affect you? Will he expect you to adopt his political views? Will you expect him to adopt your views?
There are a few good resources for Catholic discerning marriage - the Road to Cana series through EWTN is a good study guide for people trying to determine if they are suited to each other.
My experience has been that if the couple is more committed to Christ than to each other, they have a very good chance of having a successful marriage.

 

[ChristineML]

LSK listed some great questions for you and a potential spouse to think and talk about.

On the money issue, I’d add: Are you both reasonably self-disciplined about money? Organized enough that you pay your bills on time, don’t get over your heads into debt, able to put something aside for house down payment, retirement, kids’ college (eventually), unexpected expenses? Dealing with a spouse undisciplined about money matters gets old real fast. You should both be able to set financial goals together and work towards them together.

On the children issue, first of all, do you both want children? Approximately how many and when, i.e. start right away or wait a few years before starting a family? Very important: What method of family planning do you plan to use? Are you willing to learn and use NFP? The key thing here is not so much the exact answers, because, hey, life can give you unexpected surprises, as what underlying values and thinking processes are going into those answers.

Dealing with in-laws is another possible source of conflict within marriage that should be discussed beforehand. Do you both like and respect your potential future in-laws? Do your potential in-laws respect reasonable boundaries, not butting into private parts of your relationship unless asked? If not, how does your potential spouse feel about that? How much contact do you both expect to have with your parents / in-laws? See each other a few times a year or every weekend? Talk on the phone every day? Hmm. Are you willing to spend some time with them anyway, for your spouse’s sake? Are you willing to spend maybe a little less time with your own parents, or visit them without your spouse? Are you willing to make sacrifices to live within driving / visiting distance, for your spouse’s and future children’s sake, or do you plan to move cross-country if a job opportunity presented itself?

On the topic of divorce vs. lifelong commitment: Under what circumstances (if any) do you believe that separation or divorce is justified? What attempts should be made first to work things out? Do you believe remarriage is justifiable? Maybe if someone believes he can never marry again without being guilty of adultery, he would work harder on making the first marriage work? What kind of communication and commitment issues were present in your potential spouse’s family growing up? He’ll have learned habits and a description of “what’s normal and acceptable behavior” from his observations in his early life.

LSK’s questions, plus the above, are the big ones I can remember off the top of my head from marriage preparation that you’ll go through after you’re engaged.

to be continued…

 

[ChristineML]

Your friend’s husband started smoking after the wedding; ouch, that’s a hard one, because I’d find that a major turn-off, too. Is he at least smoking outdoors and using a breath mint or something to minimize how it affects your friend? I’d still worry about his health, though. But threatening divorce is a bad, bad sign. It shows that your friends may not really be committed to the marriage, to stick around and work through difficulties. Plus, it’s hurtful and manipulative to threaten divorce when someone doesn’t get his/her way, especially given her husband’s background. Your friend should use “I” messages: “When you do _______, I feel ______. Could we please work out some kind of compromise so that we can both feel good about _____?” Talk a walk if you have to in order to cool off, so you won’t say hurtful things you’ll regret later. If either of you gets upset, continue the discussion later when you’re both calm. And playing tit for tat, “if you do this, then I’ll do that” is SO IMMATURE. Grow up already.

Everyone gets mad sometimes, but truly nasty fights – spewing venom at each other – only happen if you give yourselves permission to take your anger and frustration out on the other person. It’s very immature and a big danger sign in a relationship. When you’re in the courtship stage, you may tiptoe around each other, avoiding conflict and only showing your best side, so some good advice a priest gave me is, you only really know someone after you’ve known them about two years. Then you see what they’re really like and how they deal with the inevitable conflict.

Is your boyfriend controlling you? See if he tries to limit your friendships or actions in any other areas before you conclude he’s trying to “control” you. It sounds like he’s expressing a genuine concern about your safety and trying to work out a way you can still do what you want (classes, socializing, etc.), while still being safe. Do you have a car so you won’t be walking alone at night? Does the campus have a security guard escort service? Would he be willing to pick you up in a pinch? Your friend told you to “make an equal number of demands on him, just to test that he’s willing to compromise,” again that’s immature, manipulative games-playing. I wouldn’t take ANY marital advice from HER, that’s for sure.

In general, as in many things in life, go slowly in your relationship with your boyfriend. Maybe don’t get engaged until you’ve known him for that suggested two-year minimum. By then you’ll have seen what he’s like when he’s being himself, not on his best behavior only, and how he deals with conflict. Screaming insults or giving the silent treatment are both danger signs to avoid.

Umm, do you perhaps want to distance yourself a bit from this friend of yours? I don’t know all the details, of course, and I don’t know your friend’s good points that balance out the negatives, but I see a LOT of unhappiness in her and her husband’s future. I don’t know if you want to witness the drama as it unfolds. Or maybe you feel you can be a good influence on her, I don’t know, but step carefully. At least develop other friendships, too, so you’ll have other, happier, more positive relationships in your life.

Best wishes.

 

[1ke]

I’ve been thinking about marriage a lot recently (being around the right age and all), and I’ve been wondering what are some issues you should resolve before marriage? Also, what kind of questions should you ask yourself and your future spouse before agreeing to tie the knot?

I highly recommend the book Date or Soul Mate by Dr. Neil Clark Warren. It takes you through the process of developing your list of “must haves” and “deal breakers”. It gives you many areas to think about.

Religion is #1 in my book-- and not just being the same religion but having a shared vision of how you live out your baptismal call. The degree to which you practice your faith and how you want your faith to shape your life.

Finances, child rearing, family relationships, life goals and values, and personal habits (like smoking/drinking) come next.

What’s leading me to wonder this is that my best friend has been married about six months. She and her husband have been fighting a lot about his smoking. He didn’t smoke before they got married (that she knew of) and told her that he started recently because he’s so stressed at work. She would never have considered marrying a smoker.

Well, he wasn’t a smoker when she married him, if he’s to be believed. We cannot predict the future, and unfortunately, people may take up bad habits, gain weight, lose weight, go bald, etc, after we marry them.

We have to work together as a team once we’re married, and hopefully he’ll decide to work towards quitting smoking. At a minimum he can smoke outside, etc.

I am also in a relationship, and I’m worried that if we haven’t worked out the important issues before marriage, we’ll end up in nasty fights like hers. I am not willing to threaten divorce - to me, that’s hitting below the belt, especially since my boyfriend had a wife before who abandoned him and the children.

That is quite wise.

Also, I’ve never had a serious fight with my boyfriend. I’ve been told that if you haven’t fought, you shouldn’t consider marriage.

Well, that’s just silly. Fighting, arguing, screaming, etc, demonstrates immaturity and an inability to communicate in meaningful ways.

I recommend Greg Pocak’s book For Better… Forever which discusses communication between spouses. He’s a Catholic author.

but my friend who has the screaming arguments says that I’m letting him control my life. She says that if I give an inch now, he’ll turn into a controlling husband later. She also said that I should make an equal number of demands on him, just to test that he’s willing to compromise.

Your friend has some serious issues that she fails to recognize. Don’t listen to her at all-- she’s completely wrong on all of the things you list here. She clearly has some sort of feminist programming that is clouding her thinking.

No wonder her husband has been driven to bad habits-- she’s a shrew!

So what do you think? Is he showing concern for my safety or trying to control me? Should couples get married before they’ve had a fight? Are there other issues we should discuss before we think about getting engaged?

I think your friend is immature and idiotic.

Yes, he’s showing concern for you, not control.

Couples who fight should not get married.

See the book I suggested for areas to discuss. This step is very important to building a solid marriage.

 

[lifeisbeautiful]

Hi!
I think it is great that you are seeking to do everything you can to make your marriage a strong lasting one

First, you might have this clear already, but juct in case, since you did mention that he had an ex wife, you need to make sure he has an annulment from that marriage (not one in process, not planning on getting one, but an actual annulment, letting you know he is not married). Without an annulment you can’t ever marry him to begin with and it would be like dating a married man to date him.

Now, I always tell Catholic couples getting married (are you both Catholic?) to make sure you read up all the Church’s documents on marriage and family. It is so helpful to understand the sacrament of marriage clearly before entering it.

I am not sure about your religious views, but in my case I was looking for a guy that shared my views just in case a situation we had not discussed would come up, we both knew we would agree on doing what the Church teaches on that subject. It saved us any worries about many unknowns in the future, especially those that are more important, since they affect us spiritually (its better to have an ill body than an ill soul).
Anyways, my advice is to talk talk talk. Discuss anything that worries you, anything that you think may be source of conflict. I think this is especially important since you mentioned he has other children. There are a lot of things to discuss with regard to them. A lot of the previous posters have given you topics that are important to talk about before marriage. I would also suggest listening to what your parents have to say on the subject if they mention anything.

 

[SMHW]

In addition to the excellent advice you’ve gotten from others…

Make sure you and your boyfriend can agree about his children from the previous marriage. Do they live with him full time? Are they Catholic? Even if they like you that doesn’t mean his children will see you as an authority figure. Do you and your boyfriend have a shared philosophy on parenting all the children, both his and any you have together?

And pray, pray, pray!

 

[AlanFromWichita]

My wife and I have been married 20 years and we are now in some of the “poorer” and “worse” times relative to the past. Through our struggles and stresses we are sticking together. The “d-word” did come up one time in one of our very few heated discussions but it was quickly extinguished.

The best advice we got before marriage was from an 8-year happily married coworker who told me that the key to a lasting marriage is a decision that it will be. When we went into marriage, we did it with the agreement that no matter what, divorce simply is not an option. We meant it and we have stuck with it.

That sounds simplistic, but it really is that simple. Once you let your mind wander into divorce, it prevents you from finding solutions within the marriage. Right now I am suffering from a mental illness and I have occasional death wishes. (Not suicidal; I claim there is a difference.) All they do is give me an out to not think about how to deal with my problems. It’s like playing a game while always thinking there’s a “time out” or “terminate” button. It’s distracting and it is destructive to the thought process.

Alan

 

[lifeisbeautiful]

Oh, one more thing, about fights… I think that is a silly standard to go by (the you shouldn’t get married till you have fought train of thought). My dh and I never really had a considerable fight before marriage, and to tell you the truth the worse fight we have had so far turned out to be a silly miscommunication right after our reception. We have had a wonderful 3 years of marriage and I don’t think we have suffered for lack of fighting. Now, I would be concerned if the reason you don’t fight is because you aren’t communicating, and just bottling things up that will come out later on. I can’t remember where I had heard this, but there was a show or a book or something that mentioned that bottling stuff up was like building walls between people. My dh and I usually try to talk things over to avoid building walls, because once the walls are built they are harder to break down.

 

[lizaanne]

I have not read all of the previous posts all the way through - but I think the FIRST thing you need to consider if you are Catholic is if your boyfriend is even free to marry in the Church.

If that’s not an option then keep looking. If it is, return to the top and read all the good advice.

~Liza

 

[chevalier]

What should you think about before marriage?

Everything.

 

[BlestOne]

The list I made before considering marriage went something like this:

1. 
   *]Do we share the same moral values?
   *]Do we have the same goals? (career, child rearing, etc)
   *]Is he Catholic (Can I share this big part of who I am with him)?
   *]Does he pay his child support and visit his child?
   *]What are his political views (are they somewhat in line with mine)?
   *]Can I picture myself praying with this man?
   *]Does he have a prayer life?
   My biggies (deal breakers) were Is he Catholic and Can we pray together because I truly believe that a marriage can only survive if you invite God to be a part of it…

 

[OldAgeGuru]

Here’s my own personal views on fighting.

My fiance and I don’t agree on everything. We aren’t pod people. We have different life experiences, we had different upbringings, and on some things, we even have different values. When we have a disagreement it goes one of two ways. We have a calm rational discussion over it, where we b oth make our points, and then either one of us sees the light, or we agree to disagree. Rarely, but they do happen, we have screaming matches. We’ve been together for going on 5 years now, and I think I can only recall perhaps two times it’s escalated to that point. When it reaches there. We retreat to neutral corners(not storming away and door slamming) and calm down for 10-15 minutes and then come out and apologize to each other and try to be rational. It doesn’t always work.

Do I think the examples of what your boyfriend tells you to do are controlling? Well the langauge you used for what he said kinda rubs me the wrong way. Mostly cause I’m 27 years old, I’m a grown up, have lived on my own since I was 18, and don’t need another dad to inform me that I can’t do something, because there is a fear that I might not be safe. I can make good decisions all on my own. However, if it was couched differently, and would be applicable to him as well I might not have quite as much of a problem with it. Hey Honey, can you do me a favor and call me while you’re walking to your car while visiting a high crime area so I know your getting to your car safely?, would work. Saying I don’t know how great an idea it is for you to wear 10,000 dollars worth of jewelry into a bad neighborhood after dark, could you maybe wear the fake stuff instead? would be ok. But saying " I don’t think you should go out at night in a highly lit, heavily trafficked area simply because you have ovaries" might not fly so much with me.

But everyone has their own barometer.

 

[grandfather]

I’ve been thinking about marriage a lot recently (being around the right age and all), and I’ve been wondering what are some issues you should resolve before marriage? Also, what kind of questions should you ask yourself and your future spouse before agreeing to tie the knot?

I am also in a relationship, and I’m worried that if we haven’t worked out the important issues before marriage, we’ll end up in nasty fights like hers.

You will never work out all the issues that life will bring.<<<<<<<<

 

[SeekerJen]

On the children issue, first of all, do you both want children? Approximately how many and when, i.e. start right away or wait a few years before starting a family? Very important: What method of family planning do you plan to use? Are you willing to learn and use NFP? The key thing here is not so much the exact answers, because, hey, life can give you unexpected surprises, as what underlying values and thinking processes are going into those answers.

To add to this: what happens if the marriage is infertile? How far would you go and how much would you spend on exploring Church-approved treatments? Are you on the same page with regards to avoiding immoral things such as in-vitro fertilization, artificial insemination, and surrogacy? How important is it for you to raise children in your marriage? Would you both be open to adoption? What type of adoption (open, closed, domestic, international, foster)? How would either of you or your families of origin react to a child of a different racial/ethnic background or to a child with disabilities? More importantly, if the infertility turns out to be due to only one spouse, can the other live with it and not blame or resent the infertile spouse?

No one thinks that they will have to deal with this, but it is an unpleasant surprise for many of us. It seems as though nearly half of the couples we know have struggled with at least temporary infertility. I wish Pre-Cana would address this issue.

 

[Just_wondering]

Thanks, everyone, for your insights. Here are some answers to a couple of questions you’ve asked.
Yes, his marriage was annulled, and (obviously, if it was annulled) his divorce is final. His mother is looking after his daughters, and we need to discuss that. I would like to take care of his children as well as ours, but I don’t want to separate them from their grandmother completely - they’ve had enough upheaval already.

He is Catholic, I am investigating religion. I know that is likely to be our biggest issue. That’s the main reason I started looking in this forum.

I don’t feel as if he’s controlling, but sometimes I resent the implication that I can’t take care of myself. I’m 27 and have been living independently since I was 18. However, some of his concerns are valid. I don’t have a car, so I take public transportation and ride my bicycle. My apartment complex isn’t well-lit at night, and he lives 90 minutes away from me, so he can’t take care of me like he’d like to. Also, he grew up in a dangerous neighborhood, so I know why he’d be concerned. I’m willing to compromise some of my freedom away for a relationship - after all, isn’t it part of marriage to consider each other’s feelings, especially where important issues like safety are concerned?

I have always felt that fighting is immature. My boyfriend doesn’t like fighting either, and I’m pleased that we haven’t fought yet. However, silent treatment is something I think he leans toward. When I say I don’t agree with his opinion, he gets really silent. However, I’ve noticed that how I phrase it makes a big difference. If I say he’s wrong, he gets silent and defensive. On the other hand, if I explain why I hold a different opinion, he’s willing to discuss it and we reach a compromise.

 

[Gardening_Mommy]

I agree with most of what was written above (especially SeekerJen- infertillity is VERY difficult, but about 10% of couples nowadays will face temporary or permanent infertility, so it’s worth discussing).

I do not agree with the person who said the “no walking around alone after dark” rules should apply to your boyfriend, too. He’s a guy, he loves you, he’s trying to protect you. As a woman, you are much more likely to get mugged (you look like an easier target) or sexually assaulted. He isn’t insisting that he has to be with you whenever you’re out after dark, so I wouldn’t categorize this as “controlling”, just maybe a little overprotective.

As another thread was discussing, don’t forget to discuss your expectations for gender roles in the marriage!

Do you expect to share housekeeping chores equally (good luck! ) or do you (or he) expect that you (as the wife) will do most of them?

Will you work outside the home? Will you work outside the home after you have children (i.e. will it be different when they’re small)? How important is your career to you? How important is it to your self-worth to earn a paycheck? Do you hope for or expect him to earn enough at some point to let you stay home?

Does he expect you to “contribute” a paycheck to the household? Conversely, does he feel somehow inadequate as a provider if you earn a paycheck? Are you both flexible on these questions if your family’s situation changes?

What do you think about public vs. private vs. homeschooling? What do you think about daycare? You don’t have to settle this now, but at least open the discussion and talk about it openly.

Has he dealt with any emotional issues from being abandonned by his ex-wife? (I’m not saying “healed”… just dealt with them to a reasonable extent.)

And, no, arguments do not prove that you are ready to be married. Lack of arguments don’t prove your readiness, either. If you discuss all this stuff and quietly agree on everything, great. If you don’t agree, and the argument gets a little heated, that’s ok, too. My college roommate insisted that her constant shouting matches with her fiance proved that they were discussing stuff… no, it proved that they were both out for the power in the relationship. He got power by being a controlling jerk, she got it by playing passive-agressive lust games and batting her eyes and pouting prettily a lot… It wasn’t a marriage, it was just a power game they were both playing. I doubt it lasted.

Anyways, on that cheery note , good luck, OP!
God bless!

 

[grandfather]

I would like to take care of his children as well as ours, but I don’t want to separate them from their grandmother completely - they’ve had enough upheaval already.

Very wise! The younger they are the easier it is for all. Are you ready to embrace his children in the same way you will your own?<<<<<<

 

[LSK]

You have been living independently since you were 18. This is great, and I applaud you! And you are correct in your belief that living as a married woman would be different than living as a single woman.

The importance of religion in a marriage cannot be over estimated. If you are looking, interested, etc. why not enroll in a local RCIA program so you can begin the discernment process regarding Catholicism?

 

[Liberanosamalo]

You have gotten great advice here.

I would be a little more charitable toward your poor friend than some of the other posters. I think she is in her own weak way trying to warn you about the disillusionment she is facing. It has come to the point in her marriage where she is seeing life without him as better than life with him. Because apparently she didn’t know him very well when she married him. He seems to deal with her in a very passive-aggressive way. So she is advising you to test and prod and fight and not give in.

Many of us would not consider dating a smoker. Sorry to you smokers. I’m asthmatic. No can do. It is found that smoker’s spouses often have higher incidence of cancer than the smokers themselves. It’s a dealbreaker. This woman married a nonsmoker. He moved the goalposts on her. Because he is “stressed.” Umm… try jogging?! He is doing something that he knows makes her crazy. Control tactics. Shouting matches. Screaming.

People scream when they are not heard when they speak in a low voice. People threaten divorce when they are trying to show how bad the situation is. In that situation, the woman now sees marriage as a situation where a spouse is inflexible, not open to compromise and is controlling. She is trying to give you some very good advice in a not very good way.

You need to find out from a future spouse:

How do they handle stress and conflict. I think you DO need to have disagreements before you marry. Right now everyone is on their best behavior. You dont’ want to find out AFTER the vows are said that a spouse handles anger by breaking your favorite objects or slamming you into the wall. You don’t want to find out that silent treatments become screamfests and devolve into physical abuse. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.

You need to see how he lets off stress. How he deals with other people when he is annoyed. That will be how he deals with you when the pixie dust wears off. (I ignored the tales xh told about screaming at the women at his office for their “screwups.” Later that was ME he was screaming at.)

You need to learn if he always has to have his way. His concern for your safety is touching. But is there a respect for your judgement there? Or is he basically very condescending and treating you like a child. You’ve lived quite a few years without him telling you what to do and you are still breathing. Can he recognize that.

I suggest you get to know his mother very well. How does he treat her? (That will be you someday.) What does SHE have to say about his first wife and the problems in that marriage? It may not have been all one-sided. My own xMIL is very silent to all xh’s girlfriends about his abusive past. Her attitude is to let them figure it out for themselves. And he tells them all I was crazy and he fled for his life. No wonder they look at me funny when they meet me.

What kind of woman did he initially marry? Did he learn any lessons from that? Are you just like her? Her polar opposite?

How much self control does he have? Self control goes across the board… money, food, drinking, meds, exercise, computer use, porn, sex, anger…

If he lacks it in one area, you may find he lacks it in other areas.

What kind of friends does he have? Do you like them? Show me who your friends are, I’ll show you who you are.

How sociable is he? Does he like your family? How independent does he want you to be? I don’t see this as a feminist issue. I see it as a respect issue.

Does he have one set of rules for men, one for women?

Does he obey the law? Does he respect those who enforce the law? Or does he make derogatory comments about law enforcement officials.

Does he make bigoted statements? Big warning sign there… an indication someone sees the world through a very narrow spectrum and doesn’t respect others and categorizes the world in uncharitable ways. That will eventually extend to you, if so.

How honest is he? Have you ever caught him in a lie? (I don’t care how small… that’s the tip of the iceberge. People are either honest or they aren’t.)

Does he have a sense of humor? Can he laugh at himself? (Ridiculing others does not constitute humor.)

In short… you need to get to know the whole person. Unlike your poor friend who apparently is now meeting the real husband now that the fun of preparing for a wedding is over and it’s time to stop pretending everything is perfect. And he is meeting the real wife… but we dont’ have the whole picture there.