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Mannyfit75
Guest
I have seen many images of Mary, but which one of them is the most accurate one?
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Genesis315
Guest
Our Lady of Guadalupe, since the artist was God Himself 
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patrick457
Guest
I’ll also second that.Our Lady of Guadalupe, since the artist was God Himself
You know, it’s a common misconception that Our Lady appeared as an Indian. Not the case actually. The clothes Our Lady wears in the image are actually what Jewish women wear during winter 2000 years ago.
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Mannyfit75
Guest
There is also a resembles of Our Lady of Guadalupe to the One mention in Book of Revelation 12:1 had a moon under her feet.I’ll also second that.
You know, it’s a common misconception that Our Lady appeared as an Indian. Not the case actually. The clothes Our Lady wears in the image are actually what Jewish women wear during winter 2000 years ago.
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HailMary
Guest
An image need not be a picture, but perhaps a description:
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Wisdom 7:22-29**
Using the Four Senses of Scripture, allegorically this is the Blessed Virgin Mary.
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Cor_Jesu
Guest
I almost forgot about that one. I was going to say, there is an icon that tradition says was painted by St. Luke himself. I’m not sure if it is Our Lady of Perpetual Succor or another one. Well anyway I guess Our Lady of Guadalupe would be the most accurate and the icon painted by St. Luke would be the second most accurate!Our Lady of Guadalupe, since the artist was God Himself
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LilyM
Guest
It’s actually Our Lady of Czestochowa that is said to have been painted by St Luke.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/84/Our_Lady_of_Czestochowa.jpg
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Cor_Jesu
Guest
Yup, and her veil looks similiar to the Guad’s, too! So they are the most accurate images of Her. :yup:
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Oliviad
Guest
St. Luke the Evangelist didn’t paint that or any other image. But there was, in an apocryphal Acts of St. John the Apostle, a disciple of John named Lykomedes, who had a portrait of John, who took Mary into his home, painted. Here follows a quotation from that passage:
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Oliviad
Guest
Because of the way his name begins, (“Lyk-”, as compared with “Loukas”, that is, “Luke”), perhaps a confusion of art tradition occurred early on. But then again, whether it is a case of yet a third man or not, there is the matter of an writer alleged writer of various apocryphal Acts of individual Apostles - one Leukios. He was charged with having written spurious acts, which the Manichaeans later adopted. In connection with manuscripts of Manichaean literature there come into play what connection Leukios could have had with illumination found in works perhaps adapted from such apocryphal literature, in which there are presumed to be pictures of Mani himself (although that might be only a speculation on the part of some). Anyways, there could be any number of reasons and ways for Luke’s name to have been mistakenly attributed to an Icon of Mary or of someone else.
As for a description I saw above, from Wisdom chapter 7, of WISDOM, those passages describe JESUS, not Mary.
As for a description I saw above, from Wisdom chapter 7, of WISDOM, those passages describe JESUS, not Mary.
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HailMary
Guest
Thats the beauty of being Catholic, I’m not isolated by one interpretation, provided I do not go against the Church
Literal sense: What the author intended
Allegorical sense: Pertaining to Chirst & Mary
Anagogical sense: End Times
Moral sense: What is God telling me today
Do you think these versus have anything to do with Mary?
Wisdom 7:
Widsom 8
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Holly3278
Guest
I’m not sure but I’d either go with Our Lady of Guadalupe as others have suggested or go with the oldest rendition of her.
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patrick457
Guest
Actually, it is not the specific Icon we Catholics know as ‘Our Lady of Perpetual Help’ that is painted by St. Luke, but an icon that inspired these and other images similar to it (which belongs in a genre of Icons called the ‘Virgin of the Passion’).
The story goes that St. Luke here depicted the event in Our Lord’s childhood that once, He was playing when He saw the two Archangels, Michael and Gabriel carrying the Instruments of the Passion, symbolizing His future death. Terrified, the Child Jesus ran to His mother Mary, who then brought Him into her arms to comfort Him. He was terrified that one of His sandals loosened and dangled off.
The Icon of Our Lady of Perpetual Help was actually an icon stolen from an Orthodox Church in Crete at the end of the 15th Century by an Italian merchant. Along the way to Italy by sea, a great storm came and the merchant felt remorse (Since he thought the storm was like a kind of Divine punishment) and repented of his deed. They implored Our Lady to help them and they landed on dry land unharmed.
The merchant reached Rome a year later, where he got sick and on his deathbed, asked a friend of his, as his dying wish, that the Icon be returned in a Church. The merchant died, but his friend also died later not fulfilling his promise since his wife took a fancy for the Icon and had it on her bedroom.
It took an apparition of Our Lady to the merchant’s friend’s daughter to have her mother give it up. Our Lady commanded that the Icon be placed in a small church, the Church of St. Matthew, which is in the road that connects St. John Lateran and St. Mary Major (The present-day Via Merulana). The wife then went to the Augustinians who ran that church and gave the Icon to them. On March 27, 1499, the icon was transferred to the church and the icon was venerated there for 300 years.
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patrick457
Guest
During the Napoleonic wars in 1798, Napoleon’s general ordered several churches in Rome closed and destroyed. St. Matthew’s was one of these churches. The Perpetual Help icon was secretly taken by the Augustinian fathers to a nearby church, St. Eusebius. Later on they moved it to Santa Maria Posterula to a side altar. This was a period when the Icon was again moved to a chapel because the main Church already had another image of Our Lady. During that time, Our Lady’s icon was forgotten, so to speak. No devotees come and venerate her Icon, which is by now uncared for, ignored and covered with dust in the Chapel.
Pope Pius IX had invited a group of priests called the Redemptorists to set up a Marian house of veneration in Rome. They stationed in Via Merulana, not knowing that it was once the church of San Mateo and shrine of the once-famous icon. Later when they inspected their new property, they found a house, barns, stables, gardens – and the ruins of an old church. Inquiring into the history of the church, the Redemptorists learned that its name was St. Matthew’s, and that it once had housed a miraculous painting, a painting that had been lost.
One day, a Redemptorist father, Fr. Michael Marchi, who had heard stories of the icon and of the church in which it was once enshrined in his youth told to him by an old blind Augustinian sacristan, Augustine Orsetti, revealed that not only did the Icon still exist, but also that he knows where it is.
When Fr. Marchi was still an Altar boy, Br. Augustine would point to the icon and say, “See that picture, Michael? It is old – very old. It used to hang in St. Matthew’s Church, where many people came to pray to the Mother of God.” The painting, he said, had been rescued at the last minute, hidden from the marauding general in a humble cart, and transported secretly to this chapel. “Remember that,” the sacristan told him. Michael Marchi remembered.
Fr. Marchi built a small church next to the building called St. Alphonsus of Ligouri. The Father General of the Redemptorists, Most Rev. Nicholas Mauron, decided to bring the whole matter to the attention of Pope Pius IX. The Pope decided that the icon should be exposed to public veneration and the logical site was their church of St. Alphonsus of Ligouri, standing as it did between St. Mary Major and St. John Lateran.
Pope Pius IX wrote a short memorandum ordering the Augustinian Fathers of St. Mary in Posterula to surrender the picture to the Redemptorists, on condition that the Redemptorist supply the Augustinians with another picture of Our Lady of Perpetual Help or a good copy of the icon of Perpetual Help in exchange. Upon the return of the icon, Pope Pius IX gave the icon the title Our Mother of Perpetual Help. Today, the icon is under the care of the Redemptorist fathers of St Alphonsus where the icon is now enshrined.
It is said when the Icon was entrusted to the Redemptorists by the Pope, He told them, “Make Her known throughout the world.” The Redemptorists embraced this command wholeheartedly by distributing reproductions of her picture and talking about her in missions and homilies around the world.
Pope Pius IX had invited a group of priests called the Redemptorists to set up a Marian house of veneration in Rome. They stationed in Via Merulana, not knowing that it was once the church of San Mateo and shrine of the once-famous icon. Later when they inspected their new property, they found a house, barns, stables, gardens – and the ruins of an old church. Inquiring into the history of the church, the Redemptorists learned that its name was St. Matthew’s, and that it once had housed a miraculous painting, a painting that had been lost.
One day, a Redemptorist father, Fr. Michael Marchi, who had heard stories of the icon and of the church in which it was once enshrined in his youth told to him by an old blind Augustinian sacristan, Augustine Orsetti, revealed that not only did the Icon still exist, but also that he knows where it is.
When Fr. Marchi was still an Altar boy, Br. Augustine would point to the icon and say, “See that picture, Michael? It is old – very old. It used to hang in St. Matthew’s Church, where many people came to pray to the Mother of God.” The painting, he said, had been rescued at the last minute, hidden from the marauding general in a humble cart, and transported secretly to this chapel. “Remember that,” the sacristan told him. Michael Marchi remembered.
Fr. Marchi built a small church next to the building called St. Alphonsus of Ligouri. The Father General of the Redemptorists, Most Rev. Nicholas Mauron, decided to bring the whole matter to the attention of Pope Pius IX. The Pope decided that the icon should be exposed to public veneration and the logical site was their church of St. Alphonsus of Ligouri, standing as it did between St. Mary Major and St. John Lateran.
Pope Pius IX wrote a short memorandum ordering the Augustinian Fathers of St. Mary in Posterula to surrender the picture to the Redemptorists, on condition that the Redemptorist supply the Augustinians with another picture of Our Lady of Perpetual Help or a good copy of the icon of Perpetual Help in exchange. Upon the return of the icon, Pope Pius IX gave the icon the title Our Mother of Perpetual Help. Today, the icon is under the care of the Redemptorist fathers of St Alphonsus where the icon is now enshrined.
It is said when the Icon was entrusted to the Redemptorists by the Pope, He told them, “Make Her known throughout the world.” The Redemptorists embraced this command wholeheartedly by distributing reproductions of her picture and talking about her in missions and homilies around the world.
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Zooey
Guest
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