What to do when priests disagree in the confessional?

[Sir_Knight]

You are making this way more complicated than it has to be. My DH and I NEVER eat meat on any Friday. He works many 12 hour days, we are a one car household, and there are times when all I can do is run through a drive through as well. There is always a fish sandwich with your name on it - trust me, I know where they all live. If you didn’t plan well, the time to make that decision is when you are deciding where to eat at the last minute - not AFTER you have ordered the burger. If you don’t like fish, or can’t eat it, ask for a cheese burger with out the burger. If they act like you are weird, use it as a teaching moment and tell them that you are Catholic and you don’t eat meat on Fridays.

Still waited till it’s after midnight and you just totally missed the ENTIRE day? Well then, at that point, I would have to say that all the opportunities you had in a 24 hour period are just lost to excuses. There is always an opportunity to do penance - be more creative than just saying a rosary. There are always opportunities to not eat meat - be more creative than just a burger or hot dog.

I think that your problem is not overcoming this sin or nit-picking the mortal/not mortal issue - it is overcoming making excuses. Find the opportunities - they are there if you just look for them.

~Liza

Well, I say the rosary as I drive. I usually get 15+ decades completed within a day but I don’t see that as counting because (1) I do it daily so it really isn’t a FRIDAY Penance and (2) I’m not saying it while on my knees.

 

[catharina]

Wendy’s, KFC, etc.; do not serve grilled Cheese.

That goes back to my lack of planning for various situations.

Friday is a late night for the kids and bedtime is usually after midnight since they can sleep in on Saturday – it’s the onlyt day that they can do that.

Yeah, I need to work on my scheduling better to handle a wider range of circumstances.

Thank you.

PS: But I would STILL like to know for CERTAIN if it’s venial or mortal? And how to determine that?

Litanies are extraordinarily beautiful prayers; my favorite is the Litany of Our Lady.

It’s almost recommended that you pray it at a normal pace or any title could carry you away for loooooong meditations.

 

[Woodstock]

Suppose that one confessor is advising you incorrectly? When I was in early twenties, I was told in confession that masturbation was not a sin and I should not let it keep me from the Eucharist nor do I need to confess it in the future. I followed his advise for several years until he was transferred and then I learned that I had been living in serious sin and it took several more years of struggling to break the sinful habit that I developed.

For that reason, I tend to question things and want to be as sure as I can be.

The Jewish boss’ advice to ask one priest and stick with his answer is wise. Assuming you are not scrupulous, if you discern to the best of your abilities who would be a wise spiritual director, there is no sin on your part to follow his advice. If he knowingly advises you incorrectly and you follow that advise, the sin is his.

If your ongoing discernment leads you to believe that a priest you had once believed to be a wise spiritual director is no longer, then you discern again who would give you advise to allow you to grow in holiness according to the teachings of the Church and with his consent you place yourself under his direction. Any inaccurate advise he gives you that you follow in faith and good conscience would not be your sin.

Choose a spiritual director and follow his advise. You can still confess to others who disagree with him. “My spiritual director and I discussed this and I am following his advise to…”

If you suffer from scrupulosity, then ignore the above and read this: Ten Commandments for the Scrupulous

 

[BarbaraTherese]

I have a particular sin that I commit semi-regularily but I’m not really sure if the sin is venial or mortal. The Catechism of the Catholic Church is not very clear on this and I have asked this question directly on the open board and received mixed answers with a few telling me not to formulate a conclusion from OPINIONS on a discussion board.

So, I decided to ask this question during confession and was told that it was not a mortal sin and that it should not keep me from the Eucharist. Even though it was a venial sin, I still confessed it the next time around and the priest asked me if I had received communion with this MORTAL sin on my soul. Because, if so, I needed to confess that as well.

I explained that I was under the impression that it was a venial sin. He said that since I didn’t know, it lessen the guilt but for the future, I should not approach our Lord in the sacrament with this sin upon my soul.

So, I’ve been asking this question during confession of several priests and the response is pretty much evenly divided. I’ve even mentioned to the priests that other priests have told me the opposite and their reply has been that the other priests were wrong.

While in my particular case, this deals with a SPECIFIC sin. My question is – how does one deal with this in GENERAL when priests disagree and other sources are unclear?

I had a priest say something in confession and although it was not a moral matter, I was sure he was theologically incorrect. I checked it out in the Catholic Catechism and then to double check I was correct, I checked it out with a Jesuit priest and Father had indeed been theologically incorrect…I discussed it with Father outside of the confessional privately.

Barb

 

[adrift]

I am errorinng on the side of caution and assuming that it is a mortal sin as you suggest but I would like to know for sure. Picture this … I get called to bring our Lord to the homebound on Thursday. Thursday morning I go to confession and visit the homebound with communion. Then, on Friday, due to the circumstances described in my previous post, I fail to perform the Friday Penance. If it is a mortal sin, then I need to go to confession again on Saturday in order to be able to receive our Lord during Sunday mass.

I go to confession and confess that sin and the priest tells me that it is not a mortal sin. Fastforward a couple of weeks and the same thing happens. This time I go to communion because the priest from my previous confession told me that it was not a mortal sin and therefore should not keep me from the Eucharist. Fast forward another week and I go to confession again and confession the VENIAL sin of missing the Friday Penance and am told that it was a mortal sin.

See the circular problem? Going back to my original question of what to do when priests disagree on this matter?

I went to the document Pastoral Statement on Penance and Abstinence. This is the statement that changed Friday’s penance
read it here
To me it is clear that the Bishops were trying to get away from performing penance because you “had” to. Nowhere could I find it a sin if you didn’t perform a penance. I think you should note particularly 27. It would seem to me that by you taking communion to shut ins you have fulfilled the Friday penance

 

[LilyM]

If you have problems abstaining from meat (as I often do when on holidays) then it is an excellent idea to substitute a Rosary as you suggest.

I did similar just this past Friday - I was on holidays and substituted some scripture reading instead.

If you know you have problems doing it at night time then I’d make it a point to say that Rosary or do whatever first thing on Friday morning - if I have to do most anything I find it easier to cope with first thing

Problem solved, no need to worry about sin of any kind! As for when priests disagree (and yes, I’ve come across this too) I always err on the side of caution and conservatism.

 

[Sir_Knight]

It would seem to me that by you taking communion to shut ins you have fulfilled the Friday penance

Even if it isn’t done on Friday?

I went to the document Pastoral Statement on Penance and Abstinence. This is the statement that changed Friday’s penance
read it here
To me it is clear that the Bishops were trying to get away from performing penance because you “had” to. Nowhere could I find it a sin if you didn’t perform a penance. I think you should note particularly 27.

Thanks for the link.

 

[Woodstock]

I answered your other thread with some more links.

 

[adrift]

Even if it isn’t done on Friday?

Thanks for the link.

I realized later that you said Thursday. You are right it would be on a Friday. I hope you read that document. Nowhere did they attach serious sin for not doing penance on Friday. Mortal sin as you know must be serious matter. I cannot see that it is serious matter when the Bishops did not make it so.

 

[larry85704]

If you read up on what a mortal sin is, in the Catechism, you will find that it ends your relationship to God. If you feel that a sin you commit, no matter what it is, ends your relationship to God then you have committed a mortal sin. Grave sin may lead to the end of your relationship to God.

Is it reasonable to say that because I ate meat on Friday, because I forgot, it is a mortal sin and I am going to hell if I die Friday night, or Saturday morning? Mind you, I still love God all day Friday and Saturday. If you have read the Catechism enough to know about this Friday Penance I suggest you think about what the Church teaches and then tell me what you found.

In the Catechism many things are defined to be grave sins, but how many are defined to be mortal sins? Please be specific. Do you accept the Catechism as a valid authority on the Churches teachings?

 

[lak611]

I start each Friday with the intention of abstaining from meat and giving up one meal with one meal being not a full meal but a partial meal. Some of the time, circumstances cause me to consume meat (I’m on the run and I can only eat while driving – causing me to grab a burger or a hot dog … I could eat a candy bar but from a health perspective, I need to minimize my sugar intake). I do so with the intention of substituting a rosary at the end of the day.

What about a fish sandwich from McDonald’s or Burger King?

 

[baltobetsy]

Wendy’s has a great baked potato with sour cream and chives. KFC has mac-n-cheese and various hot vegetables. How about Subway - nice tuna or veggie sub with cheese? Millions of places have slices of cheese pizza, including the convenience stores where you might purchase that candy bar you don’t want to eat. They have protein bars, too. And hard-boiled eggs in cute little 2-packs. And veggies and dip. And sticks of cheese and whole fruits like apples and bananas. My 7-11 has a great tuna sandwich on cracked wheat bread. I eat one almost every week. Why don’t you find a protein bar that you like and buy a box for the car, so you will always be prepared for Friday?

You may not be aware of it, but you do have a kind of pattern of declaring yourself to be in an impossible situation and then rejecting every suggestion offered to you. Perhaps you should pray over that.

Betsy

 

[grandfather]

You may not be aware of it, but you do have a kind of pattern of declaring yourself to be in an impossible situation and then rejecting every suggestion offered to you. Perhaps you should pray over that.

Betsy

Perhaps there is some scrupulosity that needs to be addressed in confession. It is a very difficult sin to overcome.

 

[Al_Masetti]

Scrupulosity is not a sin.

Visit Scrupulosity Anonymous. They have excellent publications.

mission.liguori.org/newsletters/scrupanon.htm

In addition, the issue of scrupulosity has been discussed many times here at CAF. Do a search on this site for “scrupulosity”.

McDonalds sells fish sandwiches which are quite tasty. But if you are in “travel status” and racing around on errands (not sitting around at home or spending the day in the house where you have access to your regular food supply), then you are essentially exempted from the rule. Consider saying a string of Hail Marys as one of the possible alternate penances. It will also help you in your driving … calm you down and help you drive safer.

A very conservative orthodox priest once told me (in response to this very issue), “Stop trying to be holier than the Church.”

 

[Sir_Knight]

If you read up on what a mortal sin is, in the Catechism, you will find that it ends your relationship to God. If you feel that a sin you commit, no matter what it is, ends your relationship to God then you have committed a mortal sin. Grave sin may lead to the end of your relationship to God.

Is it reasonable to say that because I ate meat on Friday, because I forgot, it is a mortal sin and I am going to hell if I die Friday night, or Saturday morning? Mind you, I still love God all day Friday and Saturday. If you have read the Catechism enough to know about this Friday Penance I suggest you think about what the Church teaches and then tell me what you found.

In the Catechism many things are defined to be grave sins, but how many are defined to be mortal sins? Please be specific. Do you accept the Catechism as a valid authority on the Churches teachings?

Just check out these on-going threads and you’ll see that this point of whether or not it is a sin is in wide disagreement with BOTH sides providing church references to support their position …

• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=200299
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=136693
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=199197
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=195618
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=136046
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=176421
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=175641
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=170204
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=163492
• forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=156545
• etc. (I’m sure a search will turn up even more)

… thus, the reason for my confusion.

 

[Sir_Knight]

What about a fish sandwich from McDonald’s or Burger King?

If I’m near a McDonald’s or Burger King, that’s what I do Thanks.

 

[lak611]

If I’m near a McDonald’s or Burger King, that’s what I do Thanks.

Taco Bell also has bean and cheese burritos. Wendys has salads (you could get a salad without meat). Dunkin Donuts serves breakfast sandwiches all day (their egg and cheese sandwich without any meat is good). Panera Bread has good sandwiches, including meatless ones.

 

[Sir_Knight]

Wendy’s has a great baked potato with sour cream and chives. KFC has mac-n-cheese and various hot vegetables. How about Subway - nice tuna or veggie sub with cheese? Millions of places have slices of cheese pizza, including the convenience stores where you might purchase that candy bar you don’t want to eat. They have protein bars, too. And hard-boiled eggs in cute little 2-packs. And veggies and dip. And sticks of cheese and whole fruits like apples and bananas. My 7-11 has a great tuna sandwich on cracked wheat bread. I eat one almost every week.

Most of the things that you mentioned can not be safely eaten while driving a car.

Why don’t you find a protein bar that you like and buy a box for the car, so you will always be prepared for Friday?

You may not be aware of it, but you do have a kind of pattern of declaring yourself to be in an impossible situation and then rejecting every suggestion offered to you. Perhaps you should pray over that.

No, I do not see myself in an “impossible” situation. If I felt that, then there would be no sin on my part. My problem is lack of scheduling and if I’m in the wrong place at the wrong time and no opportunity to grab a fish sandwich, etc.; I want to know if grabbing that burger is a mortal sin or not. If I know for certain, then I will make a stronger effort to avoid it but if it isn’t a mortal sin or not a sin at all as some folks seem to believe AND have supporting references to support their belief, then I could grab that burger.

So … sin or no? mortal or no?

 

[Sr_Sally]

The poster who told you to say your rosary in the morning has the right idea. Outside of Lent, you no longer have to abstain from meat on Firdays. Pick something that you can stick with each week (the same thing), make a time for it in your schedule, and you are set. And just like during Lent, your penance can be something you take up rather than something you give up. So a Friday morning rosary would be the perfect thing.

I also fully agree with those who say to pick one confessor and stick with him. Especially since you seem to tend toward scrupulosity, it is probably best for your to be under obedience. this would also include the frequency of your confessions. Call you pastor or another priest and ask them to set up a scheduled time with you for confession and direction.

 

[larry85704]

Hello Sir Knight

Boy, it is confusing. And sad. Think about it, in the overall scheme of things there really are more important things than meat or not on Friday. If the Church leadership was really on the ball, this would not be a confusing issue, and it sure is. In fact, eating meat on Friday, or not, is a mortal sin maybe in one or two people since there was God, or people. It for darn sure isn’t a moral law. And why are we mourning as a Church anyway, Jesus did rise you know. We should be a Church of the party. Don’t people throw a party when they are rejoicing?

Mourn if you want to, I choose to rejoice.