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seansmom
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DaveBj…I don’t know how long ago you lived in Misawa but you may be interested in knowing that Father Andre is still here!
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Ridgerunner
Guest
I am not an expert in Japanese culture or religion, but I have studied it for years. It’s virtually impossible for a non-Japanese to fully understand, and I do not claim exceptionalism in that regard.
That being said, I think the above poster who said the Japanese religion is “being Japanese” says it well. Formal religion in Japan is a sort of eclectic mixture of Shinto and a particular brand of Buddhism that is peculiar to the Japanese. The mixture could be described as an aesthetic sense, natural to Japanese, to which their peculiar brand of Buddhism lends itself, and a sense of “place” in the universe, which is the essence of Shinto. It is not a complex theology, and the concept of an afterlife is not well developed, and is almost irrelevant to it. The big question is whether I have fulfilled my station in life, with the possibility, of course, of (rarely) improving my place in society.
While a person can overdo the comparison, there is some similarity between the Japanese cultural system and that of Islamic countries. In the latter, it is not Islam, entirely, that creates suicide bombers and the like. Nor, in Japanese society, are the frequent suicides exactly the result of Shinto, let alone Buddhism. In both, there is a complex “shame/honor” system in which every act, evey attribute, every success or failure either redounds to one’s “shame” or to one’s “honor”. In Islam, it is more an Arabic tribal thing than it is Islam, exactly, though certain brands of Islam have “adopted” it, and it’s spread by Wahabi Sunni proselytizing and influence, as well as an Iranian-backed “tribal” imperialism in Shia. In Japanese society, it is also “tribal” in that the Japanese consider themselves one big tribe. If one “lets the tribe down” or gets oneself on the “shame” side of things, one way to redeem oneself in the eyes of the tribe is to destroy oneself in some manner that conceivably benefits the tribe. In that way, one shifts over to the “honor” side and, being dead, one cannot go back to the “shame” side. To westerners, that whole thing is as foreign as foreign gets.
It is interesing that in the age immediately following the fall of Rome, Europe was as tribal as Islam is now. The Church, wisely, adopted marriage laws of consanguinity (blood relationship) and affinity (relationship by marriage) that were so stringent, much more so than today, that made it virtually impossible to marry anyone within one’s own tribe. To find a wife, a member of, say, a Gothic sub-tribe, was forced to go to another tribe to find one. Maybe the next tribe was Gothic too, but a different brand, or maybe Avar or Slav. Ultimately, the tribal system broke down, largely because of it. Western tribalism has had its revivals, though. Nationalism is essentially tribalism writ large. Nazi racism was tribalism of the worst sort. Medieval “Christendom” was an era in which Poles, say, might move to Italy and Italians to Sweden, with nearly perfect freedom of movement. The Church provided a familiar cultural background everywhere, so that people were never totally “foreign” wherever they went. Protestantism reinforced the resurgence of “tribalism” in Europe.
Nowadays, we in the West have remnants of “pan-Christendom” and those of tribalism in our cultural consciousness, and the U.S. is perhaps the most homogenous mixture of those two, often competing concepts. With exceptions, we “wecome immigrants”, so long as they embrace our culture. Since the culture is pretty eclectic, it’s not an absolute. Irish can remain “sort of” Irish. Filipinos can remain “sort of” Filipino. It’s kind of schizoid, but there are much more destructive cultural approaches----as in “all the rest of them.”
That being said, I think the above poster who said the Japanese religion is “being Japanese” says it well. Formal religion in Japan is a sort of eclectic mixture of Shinto and a particular brand of Buddhism that is peculiar to the Japanese. The mixture could be described as an aesthetic sense, natural to Japanese, to which their peculiar brand of Buddhism lends itself, and a sense of “place” in the universe, which is the essence of Shinto. It is not a complex theology, and the concept of an afterlife is not well developed, and is almost irrelevant to it. The big question is whether I have fulfilled my station in life, with the possibility, of course, of (rarely) improving my place in society.
While a person can overdo the comparison, there is some similarity between the Japanese cultural system and that of Islamic countries. In the latter, it is not Islam, entirely, that creates suicide bombers and the like. Nor, in Japanese society, are the frequent suicides exactly the result of Shinto, let alone Buddhism. In both, there is a complex “shame/honor” system in which every act, evey attribute, every success or failure either redounds to one’s “shame” or to one’s “honor”. In Islam, it is more an Arabic tribal thing than it is Islam, exactly, though certain brands of Islam have “adopted” it, and it’s spread by Wahabi Sunni proselytizing and influence, as well as an Iranian-backed “tribal” imperialism in Shia. In Japanese society, it is also “tribal” in that the Japanese consider themselves one big tribe. If one “lets the tribe down” or gets oneself on the “shame” side of things, one way to redeem oneself in the eyes of the tribe is to destroy oneself in some manner that conceivably benefits the tribe. In that way, one shifts over to the “honor” side and, being dead, one cannot go back to the “shame” side. To westerners, that whole thing is as foreign as foreign gets.
It is interesing that in the age immediately following the fall of Rome, Europe was as tribal as Islam is now. The Church, wisely, adopted marriage laws of consanguinity (blood relationship) and affinity (relationship by marriage) that were so stringent, much more so than today, that made it virtually impossible to marry anyone within one’s own tribe. To find a wife, a member of, say, a Gothic sub-tribe, was forced to go to another tribe to find one. Maybe the next tribe was Gothic too, but a different brand, or maybe Avar or Slav. Ultimately, the tribal system broke down, largely because of it. Western tribalism has had its revivals, though. Nationalism is essentially tribalism writ large. Nazi racism was tribalism of the worst sort. Medieval “Christendom” was an era in which Poles, say, might move to Italy and Italians to Sweden, with nearly perfect freedom of movement. The Church provided a familiar cultural background everywhere, so that people were never totally “foreign” wherever they went. Protestantism reinforced the resurgence of “tribalism” in Europe.
Nowadays, we in the West have remnants of “pan-Christendom” and those of tribalism in our cultural consciousness, and the U.S. is perhaps the most homogenous mixture of those two, often competing concepts. With exceptions, we “wecome immigrants”, so long as they embrace our culture. Since the culture is pretty eclectic, it’s not an absolute. Irish can remain “sort of” Irish. Filipinos can remain “sort of” Filipino. It’s kind of schizoid, but there are much more destructive cultural approaches----as in “all the rest of them.”
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GKC
Guest
I last saw Mr. DeShazer in 2002, and he looked quite healthy.
More info can be found in the standard references on the Doolittle Raid, by Lawson, Glines or Nelson, for example. There’s also a small book on DeShazer, written by C. H. Watson 5 years after the war.
GKC
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MugenOne
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I used to live in Japan for 4 years. What you have said is correct. Japanese Catholic churches are very small and it is depressing. However, I really miss going to church there.
Japanese people are very nationalistic. They will not adopt to anything foreign.
Japanese people are very nationalistic. They will not adopt to anything foreign.
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patrick457
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I can quite agree with that…But then again, If your country was like virtually unknown to other countries (except for those countries that are near you) for a thousand years, then foreingers suddenly come and leave a rather bad impression to your country to the point that the country was closed off to them for 400 years until it was forced to open again, It might be easier to relate.
After all, Japan has only been open to the world for 200 years or so so they still rather distance themselves from Foreigners. Give it some more time.
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happygal
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**Well not only Taiwan or the Filippino hates them, in fact pple in SEA hate them (meaning all those countries which have gone through Japan occupation during WWII).
I’m brought up hearing all those older generation talks about their suffering and how the war have brought them mental torture…blar…blar…My dad was just a young kid during the Japan occupation in Singapore, thus went through lots of hardship, nobody really like to bring up those unhappy moments about the past, coz it usually bring tears to their eyes. **
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patrick457
Guest
It is because, in Japanese mentality, the Father is a strict person, someone who is supposed to be feared. The Japanese has a saying, ‘Earthquakes*, Fires, Thunders, Fathers’*. Basically it is the Mother who is generally viewed as the supportive and merciful one. So thus, the idea of a ‘Merciful, Caring and Loving Father’ presented by Christians is a rather foreign and strange concept among Japanese people.
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patrick457
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As I am half-Filipino half-Japanese, this thing makes me really divided. My great-grandfather was also a WWII veteran. My great-grandma told me stories of how they try to avoid Japanese Soldiers and bombings by digging trenches, etc.
Inside me, this contradiction makes me feel like I’m going to rip into two. I feel like I’m a living oxymoron. It’s really sad.
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patrick457
Guest
I’ve never heard of that stereotype (though it is pretty scary). Though sometimes I wonder if Christianity here is viewed very much how Buddhism or any other Eastern Religions are viewed in the West…
Because Christianity came from the West, thus it is viewed as a ‘Western Religion’ though the Founder and the Apostles Themselves is from the Middle East. (But I think the Japanese would still consider it as a ‘foreign religion’ no matter where it came from).
Sadly, I noticed the Da Vinci Code was rather quite popular here. Perhaps it might have something to do with the above misconception…
I remember going in Asakusa once, and I saw Protestants carrying placards announcing the standard ‘Jesus Christ is the only Lord’ ‘Jesus is the only way to Salvation’ etc.
And I usually meet Jehovah’s Witnesses on train stations (my school is quite a bit far from my house) handing out copies of Awake! and Watchtower.
And there were this black car driving down the road with an announcer preaching loudly on a loudspeaker those ‘Fire and Brimstone’ Announcements once.
I also wish that Catholics would have the same fervor they have to spread the Gospel…
It’s really nice to see other posters from here in Japan as well.
May the Lord of the Harvest send more laborers here since here the harvest is plentiful but the Laborers are few.
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happygal
Guest
**Hi PatrickAs I am half-Filipino half-Japanese, this thing makes me really divided. My great-grandfather was also a WWII veteran. My great-grandma told me stories of how they try to avoid Japanese Soldiers and bombings by digging trenches, etc.
Inside me, this contradiction makes me feel like I’m going to rip into two. I feel like I’m a living oxymoron. It’s really sad.
I understand your contradiction, due to your ancestary line. However what has happened in the past cannot be unwind, althought those are pple who really unable to forget those hurts they have gone through (is not easy for them) but don’t make yourself feel upset about it. There’s nothing wrong of you born into a mix inter-ancestary, for God have a great destiny for you. Sometime there are thing which sound too profound to understand why that is God’s arrangement, but we just live our life according to God’s will.**
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patrick457
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Thanks for the advice.
I agree. There’s nothing we can do now since the Atrocities has already happened. The only thing we can do now is to try to heal the wounds it has caused, however long (and it might be really, really long) it may take. With God’s help of course.
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Ridgerunner
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Patrick: I don’t know if this will have any meaning for you or not. I hope it does.As I am half-Filipino half-Japanese, this thing makes me really divided. My great-grandfather was also a WWII veteran. My great-grandma told me stories of how they try to avoid Japanese Soldiers and bombings by digging trenches, etc.
Inside me, this contradiction makes me feel like I’m going to rip into two. I feel like I’m a living oxymoron. It’s really sad.
Years ago I was on a long plane flight. Next to me were an elderly Japanese man and his wife. He could speak English, though not well. His wife could not. They were traveling from Japan to the East Coast to see their son, an engineer, who is a U.S. citizen.
I don’t know how it came up, but it became clear he was in the Japanese army during WWII. I asked where. He told me China. I asked him whether it was really true that the Kwantung Army went “out of control” of the Japanese government; something the history books say is the case. He was very surprised that I knew much about the Kwantung Army, which supposedly “started the war”. “Oh no”, he said. He was a draftee into the regular army and was sent to be in the Kwantung Army. Most of the soldiers hated being there. China, he said, was a terrible place; dirty, cold, hot, ridden with insects and disease. The men were treated cruelly by their own officers, and the smallest breach of discipline would bring severe punishment, including death. A plane would come from Tokyo bearing royal insignia and the soldiers knew they would have to advance. Sure enough, within days they would receive orders to march even deeper into China. There were innumerable deaths, he said, many Chinese and many Japanese. They would achieve an objective. Then, again a plane would come from Tokyo with orders to advance some more. He lost most of his friends to the war. He said there was no doubt in his mind at all that the emperor and the princely class were war criminals. He was nearly captured by the Russians at the end of the war, but luckily was captured by Americans and sent back to Japan. Few of the Russian prisoners ever returned. He never forgave the Japanese government for the war, which is why he sent his son to the U.S. Many Japanese were, indeed, sadistic and cruel. But not all were. Some were in the war because they had no choice; not because they wanted to be, and certainly not because they wanted to inflict cruelty on others. I believed that Japanese gentleman then, and I do now.
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PaulDupre
Guest
Yes, happygal, I believe what you say. I only have experience living In Taiwan and Philippines, but I understand that the Japanese left deep scars on many people all over SEA.
God bless you,
Paul
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Montalban
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Scars…?
I don’t know what happens in other nations but when I grew up we used to commemorate V-J Day (Victory over Japan Day)
Then in the 90s our Prime Minister, in the spirit of political correctness/revisionism changed it to V-P Day (Victory in the Pacific) as if we fought some un-known enemy.*
Thus the scars here have healed so much that in a generation people won’t know what caused the injury.
*I am fully aware that there’s V-E Day (Victory in Europe) but this makes more sense than a V-G Day (Victory over Germany) because in Europe we had more than one enemy.
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patrick457
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Can quite agree with that.
I’ve read that during WWII, The Japanese took over Antipolo (my town in the Philippines) and turned town into a garrison and the Church, which contains an image of Our Lady venerated there since the 17th century into an arsenal.
It was the Japanese Army Chaplain who warned the caretaker of the Church to remove the image from the Altar since the fight is growing. The caretaker then hid the image, put it in a gasoline drum and took it into the Convent’s Kitchen to hide it. Eventually the soldiers shot the Priest and the Nuns that the people took the image away from the convent and brought it along with them as the town is being destroyed by the war.
Here’s the Image of Our Lady of Peace and Good Voyage:
http://www.josiahcatering.com/images/image_church_antipolo.gif
Now back to the topic…
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manualman
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Some have aluded to it, but few actually know that prior to WWII there was at least one Japanese city with a significant catholic subculture. Unfortunately for the church, the name of that city was Nagasaki…
One rather bad day in 1945 put a major damper on the centuries of catholic heritage in Japan via the second of only two nuclear bombs ever used in wartime… by US.
One rather bad day in 1945 put a major damper on the centuries of catholic heritage in Japan via the second of only two nuclear bombs ever used in wartime… by US.
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Lion_of_Narnia
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The Catholic Cathedral specificaly was targeted as the strike point for the dropping of “Thin Man” by the B-29 “Boxcars”–because it was the most reconizable point in the city–and a large part of the diocese’s population was inside during the attack.
When Christian missionaries made contact with underground Japanese belivers (following the Perry 1853 expedition) the Japanese Christians showed their faith by making the sign of the Cross and reciting in latin, the Our Father and the Hail Mary
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RNRobert
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I read John Hersey’s Hiroshima, and that book mentioned there were some Jesuits in that city. I read elsewhere that supposedly none of the Jesuits suffered from the effects of radiation, and thhat they attributed this to the intervention of Our Lady. Don’t know how true that is though.
As for Nagasaki, that city was not the primary target, as it had already been bombed (with conventional munitions) several times previously. The primary target was Kokura (I think), but that city had too much cloud cover to be able to get a visual aiming point, so the B-29 crew opted for Nagasaki instead. Nagasaki also had alot of cloud cover, and the crew was going to use radar to aim the bomb until they found a break at the last minute (the B-29 was getting low on fuel, and a mechanical problem prevented them from accessing one of the fuel tanks) and dropped visually.
As for Nagasaki, that city was not the primary target, as it had already been bombed (with conventional munitions) several times previously. The primary target was Kokura (I think), but that city had too much cloud cover to be able to get a visual aiming point, so the B-29 crew opted for Nagasaki instead. Nagasaki also had alot of cloud cover, and the crew was going to use radar to aim the bomb until they found a break at the last minute (the B-29 was getting low on fuel, and a mechanical problem prevented them from accessing one of the fuel tanks) and dropped visually.
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GKC
Guest
(Sigh)
The plutonium-based bomb dropped on Nagasaki was “Fatman”. The B-29 that dropped it was “Bock’s Car”. And, yes, Kokura had been the primary target but was unavaliable due to cloud cover. Nagasaki had a number of miltary targets that placed it on the list, and was relatively unscathed, up to that time. Whether the cathedral was an aiming point, I have never read.
GKC
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Fa_Chan
Guest
I understand your position. I would offer to you that all humans and cultures are capable of such things, especially in wartime. Pol Pot also committed atrocities.
I offer this because it is all too easy to label groups as one thing or another that may not be true for that whole group. All Japanese are not brutal and neither are all Germans.
Peace…
Fa Chan
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