What/Who is the rock in Matthew 16:18?

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Is it Peter himself only (the person), his confession of faith only, both (his confession and the person), or Christ himself?

Matthew 16:18
“And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”
 
Hi Jacob,

Peter is also called Kephas, which is the Aramaic version. Using Kephas instead of Peter, we translate :** Rock you are rock and upon this rock I will build my church.** There is not the least doubt that this refers exclusively to Peter. Anyone who says otherwise is twisting scripture, “to their own destruction.”

Verbum
 
Is it Peter himself only (the person), his confession of faith only, both (his confession and the person), or Christ himself?

Matthew 16:18
“And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”
Peter is told, "You are the rock (Cepha) and upon this (epi te taute) rock I will build My Church. The Greek ‘epi te taute’ can mean only that rock previously mentioned, i.e. Peter.
 
Is it Peter himself only (the person), his confession of faith only, both (his confession and the person), or Christ himself?

Matthew 16:18
“And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”
This issue will continue until the Second Coming of Christ. This issue has been discussed a billion times over and it still continues. As a Catholic, I’ll stick to the Catholic position and that is all that matters. I have no intentions of accepting any other position.
 
The literal rock is the foundation stone of the temple, the large rock upon which the temple sat.

The Jews believed that the temple was half way between heaven and hell and that the foundation stone of the temple capped off a long shaft which led down to “Sheol”, the netherworld, or “the pit.” As its capstone, the rock and temple prevented chaos, darkness, and evil from entering creation from the netherworld.

Remember that the Temple was the “Seat of Shekinah.” The temple was where God literally dwelt with men in the shekinah glory cloud inside of the Holy of Holies. The temple was the only place on earth where worship could be offered to God. That’s why Jews no longer offer sacrifice - they have to do it at the temple and the physical temple on the rock foundation in Jerusalem no longer exists.

Jesus’ reference to Peter as “The rock upon which I will build my Church” would have been clear to the jews who heard him say it, as a reference to the stone upon which the temple was built, and that Peter would be the new stone. This would have been abundantly clear after the temple was actually destroyed in 70 AD.

-Tim-
 
The reason why I started the poll is, Ive seen a couple of quotes from the church fathers (such as Augustine or Ambrose of Milan) which state that the church is not founded on flesh or on the person of Peter, rather than on his confession. So I just wanted to see what people’s opinion is.
 
The reason why I started the poll is, Ive seen a couple of quotes from the church fathers (such as Augustine or Ambrose of Milan) which state that the church is not founded on flesh or on the person of Peter, rather than on his confession. So I just wanted to see what people’s opinion is.
You know that polls can’t influence and don’t determine truth, right?

Opinion polls are one thing. But people’s opinion on matters of objective facts, at best, will only gague how well people know the facts.

What is your favorite flavor of ice cream? This is a valid poll question.

What is the best selling flavor of ice cream? This is not a valid poll question. Everyone could say that octopus flavored ice cream is the best selling flavor of ice cream and it wouldn’t make it so.

I’m not trying to beat you up over it but just illustrate why I don’t participate in most polls. In this case, I’m going with Augustine and Ambrose, especially since the good Doctor of the Church St. Augustine is my confirmation saint. 👍

-Tim-

-Tim-
 
Regarding the fourth choice in the poll: “Christ was referring to Himself when He said ‘this rock’…”

I’ve yet to see the grammatical rule that would even make that possible for that sentence (Mt 16:18).
 
You know that polls can’t influence and don’t determine truth, right?

Opinion polls are one thing. But people’s opinion on matters of objective facts, at best, will only gague how well people know the facts.

What is your favorite flavor of ice cream? This is a valid poll question.

What is the best selling flavor of ice cream? This is not a valid poll question. Everyone could say that octopus flavored ice cream is the best selling flavor of ice cream and it wouldn’t make it so.

I’m not trying to beat you up over it but just illustrate why I don’t participate in most polls. In this case, I’m going with Augustine and Ambrose, especially since the good Doctor of the Church St. Augustine is my confirmation saint. 👍

-Tim-

-Tim-
Yea I know
 
I find this verse terribly confusing. Why does Jesus say: “I tell you that you are Peter”?

He’s known him for a long time now why does he tell him ‘you are Peter’?

“And on this rock…”

If he was referring to Peter wouldn’t he use a personal pronoun? “this” seems to be referring to a thing not a person.
 
I find this verse terribly confusing. Why does Jesus say: “I tell you that you are Peter”?

He’s known him for a long time now why does he tell him ‘you are Peter’?

“And on this rock…”

If he was referring to Peter wouldn’t he use a personal pronoun? “this” seems to be referring to a thing not a person.
His name wasn’t Peter, it was Simon. Jesus changed it to Peter, meaning rock. So he says:
“You are Rock and on this rock I will build my Church.” Makes sense, right? 🙂
 
His name wasn’t Peter, it was Simon. Jesus changed it to Peter, meaning rock. So he says:
“You are Rock and on this rock I will build my Church.” Makes sense, right? 🙂
It’s confusing because the bible calls him Peter before this moment in time.
 
At least not in chronological order. 🙂
Well, the gospels are written in chronological order (each gospel).
But I guess they are written with an omniscent narrator and so the narrator is calling him Peter when in fact at those times he would have been called Simon. Right?
And that is the moment his name changes is when Jesus says “you are Peter”.
And that is a bit confusing because that is not how we talk today.
We would say ‘you shall be called Peter’ or you will be called Peter to indicate a change.
Saying "you are Peter’ is a statement of fact, not of change.

Maybe he was saying that you are a rock, like, we say that a strong person is our rock.
Because isn’t it true that Peter was not a name in those days?

But if he is saying you are a rock, then why did they call him Rock? That doesn’t make sense.
So maybe Jesus was re-naming him and it is just sortof a weird name.

I think something got lost in translation. “And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church,…”

That sentence doesn’t really make sense in English.
 
ok even though I do believe that Peter is the Rock, all this is a bit confusing when u check the following quotes of the Church Fathers:

**Augustine **

Remember, in this man Peter, the rock. He’s the one, you see, who on being questioned by the Lord about who the disciples said he was, replied, ‘You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.’ On hearing this, Jesus said to him, ‘Blessed are you, Simon Bar Jona, because flesh and blood did not reveal it to you, but my Father who is in heaven. And I tell you’…‘You are Peter, Rocky, and on this rock I shall build my Church, and the gates of the underworld will not conquer her. To you shall I give the keys of the kingdom. Whatever you bind on earth shall also be bound in heaven; whatever you loose on earth shall also be loosed in heaven’ (Mt 16:15-19). In Peter, Rocky, we see our attention drawn to the rock. Now the apostle Paul says about the former people, ‘They drank from the spiritual rock that was following them; but the rock was Christ’ (1 Cor 10:4). So this disciple is called Rocky from the rock, like Christian from Christ. Why have I wanted to make this little introduction? In order to suggest to you that in Peter the Church is to be recognized.** Christ, you see, built his Church not on a man but on Peter’s confession. What is Peter’s confession? ‘You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.’** There’s the rock for you, there’s the foundation, there’s where the Church has been built, which the gates of the underworld cannot conquer. John Rotelle, O.S.A., Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1993), Sermons, Volume III/6, Sermon 229P.1, p. 327
**
Ambrose
**
He, then, who before was silent, to teach us that we ought not to repeat the words of the impious, this one, I say, when he heard: ‘But who do you say I am,’ immediately, not unmindful of his station, exercised his primacy, that is, the primacy of confession, not of honor; the primacy of belief, not of rank…This, then, is Peter who has replied for the rest of the Apostles; rather, before the rest of men. And so he is called the foundation, because he knows how to preserve not only his own but the common foundation. Christ agreed with him; the Father revealed it to him. For he who speaks of the true generation of the Father, received it from the Father, did not receive it from the flesh. Faith, then, is the foundation of the Church, for it was not said of Peter’s flesh, but of his faith, that 'the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.’ But his confession of faith conquered hell. And this confession did not shut out one heresy, for, since the Church like a good ship is often buffeted by many waves, the foundation of the Church should prevail against all heresies. The day will fail me sooner than the names of heretics and the different sects, yet against all is this general faith-that Christ is the Son of God, and eternal from the Father, and born of the Virgin Mary. The Fathers of the Church (Washington D.C.: Catholic University, 1963), Saint Ambrose, The Sacrament of the Incarnation of Our Lord 4.32-5.35, pp. 230

Can someone please explain to me how these quotes are not implying that the church was founded upon Peter’s Faith and not on him (the person)?
 
Not only those and other quotes but the Catechism of the CC seems to also approve the fact that the Church was built upon Peter and upon his faith at the same time:

424 Moved by the grace of the Holy Spirit and drawn by the Father, we believe in Jesus and confess: 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God. On the rock of this faith confessed by St. Peter, Christ built his Church.

552 Simon Peter holds the first place in the college of the Twelve; Jesus entrusted a unique mission to him. Through a revelation from the Father, Peter had confessed: “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” Our Lord then declared to him: “You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it.” Christ, the “living Stone”, thus assures his Church, built on Peter, of victory over the powers of death. Because of the faith he confessed Peter will remain the unshakable rock of the Church. His mission will be to keep this faith from every lapse and to strengthen his brothers in it.

881 The Lord made Simon alone, whom he named Peter, the “rock” of his Church. He gave him the keys of his Church and instituted him shepherd of the whole flock. “The office of binding and loosing which was given to Peter was also assigned to the college of apostles united to its head.” This pastoral office of Peter and the other apostles belongs to the Church’s very foundation and is continued by the bishops under the primacy of the Pope.
 
Its confusing because most people have voted that it was founded upon Peter only, while there’s another option which is that the church was founed on Peter and his faith. Anyone care to explain? Sorry but i’m quite new to this.
 
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