What would this world be like if there was never any Feminist?

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This place gets more interesting every day. So is the theory now that anything but rights for Conservative Catholic Straight White Men Only is part of grand Satanic conspiracy?

You can’t make this stuff up.
I hear what you’re saying, but my take on it was that the context was a particular segment, which labels themselves as (activist) “feminist” in a narrow sense of that word. Hopefully, no one thinks that women who are striving for self-improvement, recognition by society, and ordinary civil rights, are a liability for society. That would be against Church teaching, actually. JP2 certainly reaffirmed this, but within a context of “authentic feminism,” not what often parades as “feminism” among many secular activist.
 
No, I’m all for liberation. No conspiracy, I guess, but a lot of directing. I don’t feel that any of the liberation movements were without lots of direction. Call that a conspiracy theory if you wish, but I call it ‘social engineering’ as usual. (I’m not using ‘social engineering’ in the dictionary sense, but contrived). To think of it in any other sense is absurd!
I don’t really care if equal rights for black people or women were won with direction or without.

I don’t see what any of that has to do with homosexual marriage.

It is not a sin to be a black person or a woman, nor to advocate for equal rights for these people. It would be a sin to do otherwise.

Homosexual acts, on the other hand, are sinful.

What is the comparison here?
 
This place gets more interesting every day. So is the theory now that anything but rights for Conservative Catholic Straight White Men Only is part of grand Satanic conspiracy?

You can’t make this stuff up.
Please stop twisting things. I never said it was a Satanic conspiracy. The Roman Catholic Church will stand, and be protected if necessary by Western nations.
 
Please stop twisting things. I never said it was a Satanic conspiracy. The Roman Catholic Church will stand, and be protected if necessary by Western nations.
Next up: Gay rights. It’s all planned, as was the feminist movement. .
Sorry, but that’s what I got from this response to the statement about what the world would be like if there had been no civil rights movement for blacks.
 
Yeah, I mean no offense but that’s what I got from it, too. Please explain Robert?
 
Please stop twisting things. I never said it was a Satanic conspiracy. The Roman Catholic Church will stand, and be protected if necessary by Western nations.
Could you explain what you meant by the bolded part. What does this have to do with the topic of this thread?
 
Could you explain what you meant by the bolded part. What does this have to do with the topic of this thread?
The Roman Catholic Church is protected by NATO, UN and Italy (among other nations).

I was just addressing the response to another post that was off topic.
 
Just to be clear. Feminism is not what lead to women’s right to vote or other issues of female equality. Feminism is actually more recent than women’s suffrage or women’s equality. The issue with equating feminism to women’s equality is that they do not have the same goals. Despite what some say feminism is not about equality, but rather to elevate females as somewhat superior to males. It is subtle but look at how much feminism has raised female qualities to be superior (e.g. single motherhood is heroic, but widowed fathers are sad). Feminism is less about equality as it is about transformation.

Yes many suffragans joined up w/ feminist, but that does not mean w/o feminism that women could not vote, hold jobs, etc. There are plenty of places that had women’s equality without a feminist movement. It is quite possible we could have had all the benefits without a movement that still paints women as oppressed victims of the white male establishment. That victimhood is exactly what feminist use to rally the troops around abortion support (those oppressive men can’t tell us what to do with our bodies). The difference between civil rights and feminism is that African Americans were not looking to make society in their image.
 
That feminism was a part of social planning that raised the social level of women.
All feminist types? Like what “type”?’

Is there a problem with the raising the social level of women? I’m confused on this, please explain.

What is the result of “raising the social level of women”? Do you mean education, career, …?

Who or what is “responsible” for “social planning”?

When did this begin?
 
A lot of feminists are against discrimination that also harms men.
No they don’t.

Unless you’re talking racism or prejudice against homosexual men. This has a lot more to do with political alliances within the Democratic Party or among some of today’s socialists in the U.S., Canada, and Europe if they’re not white nationalists.

But feminism today is largely about socially and politically positioning women superior to men, and mainly through increasingly lessening female responsibility through legislation and judicial actions.

You are correct that feminists can be male or female. However, female feminist almost wholly, support alpha males. This would probably fall under the Red Queen theory or hypothesis (I have a professor that referred to it as a hypothesis but a popular book I’m reading on some of it refers to it as a hypothesis–but then that author [Matt Ridley] also incorrectly referred to AIDS as a virus, when it’s HIV that is, and AIDS is the resulting syndrome from HIV).

Feminism will eventually–and already has begun too I would argue–place men (alphas, betas, and omegas) back to square one of ancient Babylonia, Egypt, and Rome. To continue “progress” one can not stop rebelling when a new fight is one, be that female sexual revolution of the '70s or gay marriage. One would have to be child-like naive to believe otherwise. Very soon feminist will promote polygamy as the new righteous war to wage against sexual oppression, and then multiple spouses. This way they can share rich or powerful men as legitimate wives. They already do as mistresses.

I just face reality. I’m pretty politically agnostic. So, I try to see things as they are.

Life is predicated on competition and selection and prejudice and discrimination are central to that. It’s only regard as social and “patriarchal” when men are the ones prejudiced (against “fat” women) and the ones discriminating (favor slimmer more curvacious women). When women and feminist women do it it’s called “natural.”

Hey… women may not even be held responsible for the prenuptial contracts they sign now. And use common law is based in part on precedents.

abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2013/03/long-island-woman-wins-groundbreaking-prenup-battle/

Judicial activism does not even attempt to free the tens of thousands of men in the U.S. that singed papers in the hospital stating the new born child id theirs. They often sign under the “meeting of the minds” (to use a contract law phrase and crucial principle) that they are the biological fathers. Once DNA evidence proves otherwise and their girl friend knowingly deceived them, they are still stuck under court order to be financially responsibly for that child till that child turns age 18.

If that woman goes out, gets impregnated by another man, and the father cannot be tracked down, or she says she does not know who the father is, the guy paying child support for the child that already not his will have his child support payments raised to adjust to the new financial needs of this woman that has given birth to another child (another child not his).

More young men need to become aware of the logical errors one can make: false-positive errors and false-negative errors. Women are indoctrinated to regard all approaching men (unless they are clearly rich, powerful, of high status, or extraordinarily handsome) with the logic of false-positive error choice. That is to say the man is considered a rapists, a killer, a deceiver until proven otherwise. Like approaching a used needle. You treat it as though it has infectious pathogens on it. The price paid being wrong is a lot smaller than the price you will pay for a false-negative error of choice, in which you’re sure the used needle has no infectious pathogens on it, but it turns out you’re wrong. Now you have hepatitis or HIV.

Women carry disease, bank raiding, child support for kids not yours, deception. If she dates you she will ditch you when the rich guy or drug dealer comes along. Now the courts have given her precedent to get out of prenuptial contracts. Feminism is about tilting the benefits for woman at 99% to 100% and the risks they face to 1% to 0% in relationship to men. They may not have achieved the 99% or 100% goal yet but they are increasingly inching closer to it. They may only be at 60% or 70% now.

But it’s a difficult thing. Because in many parts of the world men have about 99% benefits and 1% risk in relation to women. Those might be called “masculinist” societies. And they oppressive women and some of the men treat some of the girls and women as less than bugs to be squashed. Feminism is needed in these places.
 
I can’t believe we’re even discussing this.

What’s the next conversation, what would the U.S. be like if there wasn’t a civil rights movement for blacks? Would that be a better world, too?

Yeah, I think it’s a good thing that women aren’t treated like cattle.
Well this is a rather simplistic, and unfair analogy, now isn’t it?

Really. Does anyone here wish women to be treated like cattle? Do you really believe that all of Female rights were earned by Feminists? Seriously?
 
I agree that feminism is needed in those places. That doesn’t mean that western societies are perfect.

For an example of feminists that oppose costs that issues that harm men, take, for an example, an article from this staunchly feminist site: jezebel.com/5992479/if-i-admit-that-hating-men-is-a-thing-will-you-stop-turning-it-into-a-self+fulfilling-prophecy

Here is a summary of the things feminists are against that harm men:
  1. Men not getting fair treatment with custody of children
  2. Commercials and tv shows where men are bumbling fools who can’t handle simple tasks
  3. Alimony payments
  4. Rape of men, in prison, in the army, and anywhere else.
  5. False rape accusations
  6. Unsafe working conditions in typically male and dangerous occupations
  7. Mental health issues that aren’t taken seriously when men have them
  8. Men being suspected of being a pervert for being alone with their children
  9. Men being discouraged from pursuing careers and interests that they are genuinely suited for because they are too “feminine”
Why do you think that feminists want polygamy? Or to be able to share rich spouses? Feminists generally want to be able to support themselves and find meaning in having an occupation.

That woman who had her pre-nup torn up was 1 woman. Not women as a group. And the case seems to be related to the verbal promise the man made to have it torn up once they had children, and then he rescinded that promise. Hence the judge’s remark that he “fraudulently induced her to sign the contract”. I fail to see what this has to do with anything…

"Women carry disease, bank raiding, child support for kids not yours, deception. If she dates you she will ditch you when the rich guy or drug dealer comes along. "

I don’t even… Exactly all of these are problems that can happen with men OR women. One should endeavor to not deal with people who will deceive you for a rich drug dealer, pretty young thing, whatever the case may be.
 
Feminism has wrought a far greater evil on this world than one can imagine.

The Abortion Holocaust supported by Femininsts like NOW is killing women at an unparralled rate. (Pssssssst. Male babies are killed too!) These are not radical Feminists. These are mainstream Feminists(which by Catholic Lights are Radical none the less.)

Many ‘NAFALT,’ (see urban dictionary) that is to say there are ‘good Feminists.’ Show me the proof is my response.
Feminists for life (the only Feminist group I know of that is pro life) certainly does not advocate Catholic doctrine on issues other than much of the abortion issue as far as I can tell.

Radical Feminists today predominate and are the controlling interest of Feminism. Today’s Feminism is fundamentally anti - male, and are fighting not for so called equal rights but for privelege. I have seen no significant number of feminists argue for rectifying Paternity Fraud that ever approaches their zeal for abortion. Neiither have I seen any large numbers of Feminists take up the cudgels for men and rail against the fact that 90% of men are homeless. Or that 90% of serious work injuries happen to men. Or that 86% of women get custody of children children. I do see feminists argue against female genital mutilation in foreign countries, yet only do perhaps token lip service, about circumcison perpetrated on their very own male children here in westernized countries. Then there are the Feminist ‘Male Shaming’ tactics of the college ‘Gender Studies’ on our Campuses…

Yes, one may find a blog or perhaps, two, advocating for men as well… But really… let’s get real here. Such as these are for all intents and purposes insignificant in terms of their audience.

I reiterate. **Feminism **is by it’s very title sexism.
 
First of all, one does not have to fight every single injustice in the world to fight an area of injustice.

Secondly, not all feminists are for abortions, although a lot are.

Thirdly, you are wrong. Most feminists are against sexism in all its forms. I am one. Those things you mentioned that disproportionately harm men? A lot of them are part of the patriarchy.

Other than abortion, which parts of feminism are against Catholic doctrine?
 
If feminism supports female ordination then it isn’t only against Catholic teaching but is pro-Satan!
 
Lol. Quite a stretch from supporting female ordination to pro-satan! I’ll agree that female ordination is currently against doctrine, but I’m not sure it is something a lot of feminists spend a lot of time on.

I would like to not discuss the merits of female ordination in this thread as it is off topic.

If you support equal rights for men and women you are a feminist, even if you choose to not identify with that label. I have read recent discussions amongst feminists regarding the title and whether to reclaim it from the radical man haters we all dislike or whether a new word should be made. As time goes on I think perhaps a new word would better convey the current goals of modern feminism.

Any other parts of feminism that are against doctrine? I would like to know.
 
For those of you going on about voting rights men didn’t get them until 70 years before women. You had to own property before that if you wanted to vote. Also, men had a civic obligation to go fight in war if the government said so. Women never had to do that and still don’t. Women got the privilege to vote without having any legal responsibility placed upon them.
 
First of all, one does not have to fight every single injustice in the world to fight an area of injustice.

Secondly, not all feminists are for abortions, although a lot are.

Thirdly, you are wrong. Most feminists are against sexism in all its forms. I am one. Those things you mentioned that disproportionately harm men? A lot of them are part of the patriarchy.

Other than abortion, which parts of feminism are against Catholic doctrine?
Look at how Obamacare discriminates against men. The feminist lobby got a huge pay off and didn’t put anything for men in there. (dailycaller.com/2010/12/10/does-obamacare-discriminate-against-men/)

The bottom line is feminists TALK about things that hurt men but they don’t DO anything about it and often stop men who do (warrenfarrellblog.com/warren-farrell/151/). I could go on and on with examples of feminist hypocrisy. Women always blame others for the wrong they do. They never were conditioned to take responsibility like men were.

Also read Christina Hoff Sommers book “The War Against Boys.” Again, more feminist malevolence. The AAUW fabricated a girl crisis when in fact there was a boy crisis. They even hid research that showed the truth. Feminism is hypocrisy and whole host of nasty things in a nice looking package to get you to buy it. Nothing more.
 
Having men drafted and women not is again something that I, and many, many other feminists are against as well. Some are against the draft entirely, some think both should be subject to it. I didn’t think selective service registration required for men to be able to vote? Am I wrong? That is also a problem not experienced in all other western countries. Several draft men and women, others have no draft.

And, boy has democracy in the US sure come a long way in the last 150 years. Many groups of people have won the right to vote, thank goodness! We are better off as a society when all have equal rights.
 
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