What's the point of being Catholic?

[PetraG]

I suppose that part of the question is coming from personal experience. My roommate (who says she likes buddha but she doesn’t practice anything) was having a a discussion with me a bit ago. She lives a promiscuous lifestyle to say the least. She’s also very pro-choice and she asked me if I thought she was going to hell. From her perspective, her actions are fine because our definition of morality is different. I know I can’t judge her heart, but how can I answer that?

The Lord would say, “Father forgive, her, she knows not what she does.”
When he said that about those who had him put to death, it was not that he was saying that maybe they had no inkling they were doing anything wrong. He wasn’t saying they were innocent or excusable. He was saying they could be forgiven.

It is necessary to be one with the life of God in order to have eternal life. The Church is where the life of Christ resides, that is His Holy Will and so in the end all the living will be one with the New Jerusalem. The Church is necessary for salvation, then.

The Church, however, preaches mercy. She looks for the lost as a shepherd searches for sheep that have wandered, not as a prosecutor looking to put scofflaws into jail. She seeks to turn souls from death and despair to life and peace and hope. The answer for those who cannot see that is that some day they will see and that some day we will not so obscure the light of truth that they cannot see it in us. If we were to become saints, after all, if we were to give ourselves fully and not with reservation as we now so often do, who knows what might happen?

 

[TheLittleLady]

“we don’t know, it’s up to God.”

That is basically it.

I look at it like this, I was given the job to make a label that will go on the outside of a Mars lander probe. I may be concerned about how that probe will get to Mars, how the fuel cells function, how the math works, but, as long as I do my job - I make that label according to the directions I was given - the rest is in other hands. I don’t have to pilot the lander nor get it to the launching pad.

So, I do what I am told. 1 Cor 13 teaches me charity, the Beatitudes teach me, the “I was a stranger” and “consider the lilies of the field” words, the lives of the Saints, the teachings of the Church all help me better do my job. I am salt and light and love. That is my job.

 

[Tarsier]

I suppose that part of the question is coming from personal experience. My roommate (who says she likes buddha but she doesn’t practice anything) was having a discussion with me a bit ago. She lives a promiscuous lifestyle to say the least. She’s also very pro-choice and she asked me if I thought she was going to hell. From her perspective, her actions are fine because our definition of morality is different. I know I can’t judge her heart, but how can I answer that?

Tell her exactly that. “I can’t judge your heart. I don’t know how much you want to learn about God, how much you have researched, or even if you researched good material. There’s a lot of bad material out there. I don’t know if you have any psychological roadblocks to seeking out personal confirmation of a higher power.”

Then is when I’d move onto Socratic questioning. An approach that Trent Horn uses on Catholic Answers Live is a good one.

“So … what is the best argument for God you’ve ever encountered that you don’t find convincing?”

Don’t settle for cop-out answers like, “I didn’t find any of them convincing.”

What is the best argument you studied or ever heard? And why did you find it unconvincing?

Then, just listen and don’t argue. If the “best” argument she has isn’t a very good one (the case most of the time), invite her to think about it deeper with something like, “I understand why it’s hard for you to believe in God. There are some really good reasons to believe in him that it sounds like nobody ever shared with you. Reasons based on science and history and strong logic. If you are interested in learning about them, I know some great books/websites you can study. You’ll learn a lot, even if you don’t find these convincing either. But I’ll leave it up to you. It needs to be your decision on whether you want to look deeper.”

 

[steve-b]

I love being Catholic and I’m never converting. It is the full truth. My problem comes when talking about salvation. If “there is no salvation outside the Catholic church”, why have I heard so many sources say “it depends”? I do side on the first position even though it seems heartless. The idea of “if you have never heard the gospel…” seems to hold no water considering the internet is a thing. So then I hear an updated version saying “depending on the state of the persons conscience when they hear it…”.
*Bishop Barron talking to Ben Shapiro on salvation:
What Is The Catholic View Of Salvation? - YouTube
So you can be atheist and get into heaven? Sorry, I don’t buy that. How can you reject Gods love on earth and still go to heaven? …and now we come back to my original question: What’s the point in being Catholic?

Ben Shapiro a Jew, who claims to obey the 613 Mosaic laws, asks Bp Barron in that video, what the Catholic view is , Re: the salvation of Jews.

I immediately thought of what Jesus told His apostles

Mt 10: 5 These twelve Jesus sent out, charging them, “Go nowhere among the Gentiles, and enter no town of the Samaritans,[b] 6 but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And preach as you go, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is at hand.’ …"

If the Jews are OK, Why would Jesus say the sheep of the house of Israel, are LOST so go to THEM?

Do those same Jews THEN still reject NOW what they rejected THEN? YES . They didn’t believe in Jesus then OR NOW. If they were lost then, according to Jesus, what’s changed for them NOW?

Did Bp Barron just give Ben Shapiro permission to remain where he is? I came away thinking…yes.

 

[EXdrinker]

Did Bp Barron just give Ben Shapiro permission to remain where he is? I came away thinking…yes.

I came away with the same impression. Bishop Barron did a huge disservice in my opionion. Just give the truth straight up, don’t mix in theological nuance saying that Jesus is the “privileged route” to salvation. Ben Shapiro can take the truth. Instead he may now believe that the Catholic Church is working towards something that is unnecessary. There is no way to come away with an orthodox understanding of salvation or the church from what Bishop Barron said. Very sad.

 

[GospelOfMatthew]

Being able to receive Jesus in body, blood, soul, and divinity

 

[PennyinCanada]

I suppose that part of the question is coming from personal experience. My roommate (who says she likes buddha but she doesn’t practice anything) was having a a discussion with me a bit ago. She lives a promiscuous lifestyle to say the least. She’s also very pro-choice and she asked me if I thought she was going to hell. From her perspective, her actions are fine because our definition of morality is different. I know I can’t judge her heart, but how can I answer that?

That’s a great question! It deserves it’s own thread.

 

[safa92]

I like that answer. I suppose that is where purgatory comes in. Or am I way off base on that?

 

[Dorothy]

What’s the point in being Catholic?

It is a privilege and a joy to be a Catholic, to know about the Lord, and to pick up our cross and follow Him!

There are challenges and trials to overcome, but He is with us and has given us the Sacraments and told us to pray.

Think of yourself as chosen to receive the love of the Lord and share it with others!

 

[TheLittleLady]

Purgatory is a process that happens to those who die in friendship with God, in other words, people who are not in a state of mortal sin when they die.

 

[safa92]

I think that this has been part of my what’s been making me confused. I’m a huge fan of Bishop Barron but I feel he did a disservice here.

 

[safa92]

Ha… I have so many questions that deserve their own thread.

 

[Tarsier]

I like that answer. I suppose that is where purgatory comes in. Or am I way off base on that?

That’s a tough yes or no answer, depending on what you are asking. But Purgatory has nothing to do with whether or not your roommate would end up in Heaven or Hell.

This answer is too simplistic, but the question your roommate should ask herself is whether or not she truly invested (with intent, as well as time and energy) to learn about God and how she responded to the “truth” she came across.

It’s easy to look at her lifestyle (as you described it) and make assumptions, but you know what they say about people who assume (i.e. They make an *ss of u and me.) She could have all sorts of things in her background that make it difficult to explore the idea of God. I met a Buddhist once on a plane. His family was fundamentalist Christian when he was a kid. His dad, according to him, was abusive. He seemed like a seeker, so at least for me, it seemed to explain why he now rejects Christianity and the idea of an authoritative “father figure” (I’m not qualified to psychoanalyze people, so what do I know …)

So maybe something like that is going on with your friend. Or she stumbled upon some knuckle-headed websites that convinced her Christianity was for tools, and she doesn’t have the critical thinking skills to evaluate the content. I’m like that with the moon landing. I’m convinced enough that we landed there that I don’t invest time in researching the other side of the argument. Maybe I’m wrong, but I’ve decided pretty firmly. Something like that might be her situation.

Or maybe not. Maybe she’s going to Hell.

 

[therese1998]

I’m not a theologian to be able to tell you how far you are off base, but I think the answer would be that Purgatory doesn’t really enter into my analogy, and I tend to think of them separately (not saying that’s the right way, just what I experience). Those in Purgatory are already saved, they are simply being cleansed of any remaining attachment to sin. Given that no one is perfect, my guess is most, even recognized saints, have some time to spend in Purgatory. To use my analogy (loosely), those in Purgatory would be those whose hands need to be washed before they dig in to that lunch, not those who jeopardized being able to get to the reward in the first place because they wanted to do it “their way”, take the easiest path and let themselves be distracted.

 

[therese1998]

I’m a huge fan, too, and will remain so even if he’s lost me a bit on this one. Nobody is perfect. It’s really neither fair nor realistic to expect that everything that comes out of the mouth of any man, even a bishop or pope, will be 100% perfect. The only time even the Pope is infallible is when he is speaking ex cathedra and that has happened only twice at most in 2,000 years. So, it is possible that Father Barron, who should be respected and listened to carefully for his experience, education and knowledge of church teachings, was off the mark on this one.