Whats wrong with female altar girls?

[scylla]

I have two girls and I would never insult my girls by putting them on the Altar. They have their own dignity as little women, they don’t need to try and be like boys to be special.

This is the lie the feminazi’s tell women and they eat it up. Somehow most women have eaten this up, followed blindly along thinking that women are more special only if they do everything men do. Fortunately there are some women who have the sense to think for themselves and understand that you can be a woman and be proud of it.
Having equal dignity is important and that is what true feminism is about, not about gaining dignity by trying to be like the other. (that is an insult)

This is like a man wearing a veil to Church, just because women can. Usually women don’t but even in this example you see how insulting it is to both sexes.

My girls will be helping out teaching, joining the Altar Rosary Guild and hopefully leading the choir, etc, what best suits them. If we ever have boys they will be up on the Altar serving and maybe other functions if they have that ability.

In Christ
Scylla

 

[Veritas41]

This is something I was told by a rector of a seminary on why he is against female altar servers and I agree with it. This also goes for women doing readings.

The altar server was originally an ordained male. He was ordained to the office acolyte. Now only men may be ordained to this office. So they stoped ordaining acolytes and started to just appoint people to be altar servers.

Same goes for those who read the Epistle and the Old Testament (for you Latin Catholics) readings. This used to be done by ordained lectors. Yes I know some places still call them lectors but the office of lector is an ordained office. Those people reading who are called lectors are not really lectors.

So what we are doing now is having people serve in positions that used to be ordained positions.

IMHO, just another bluring of the lines between clergy and laity.

An Eastern Orthodox Christian told me that in the Orthodox Churches the lector is an ordained position, and it is only for males. Also, only males are allowed near the altar, so they obviously don’t have female altar servers. Female altar servers blur the line between gender roles (my belief), and even though I have two daughters and my parish has female altar servers, I will not allow my daughters to serve in this capacity.

 

[mikew262]

Nothing is wrong with it. Period.

 

[unworthy]

Nothing is wrong with it. How can you talk about its “wrongness” when the Church has agreed with it? I’m a female altar server in love with serving. If the Church does not want me to serve any longer, then I will lovingly stop. For now, the Church is fine with it, and I will lovingly continue.
-unworthy

 

[scylla]

There have been Bishops who allowed clown masses and liturgical dance. That doesn’t make it right.

Rome has allowed Bishops to have temporary permission to allow EHMC’s to purify vessels after Mass. Which is wrong but was allowed as that was the custom and desire of the Bishops of the United States.
That it was wrong and allowed doesn’t make it right.

They have asked for permission to allow Altar Girls and they recieved it, contrary to what the Pope taught against it in the past. So they have been given leeway for a practice which is wrong but allowed.

To state that it is not wrong now just because it is allowed is to ignore truth and allow custom to overide what expresses truth.

Just because I am allowed not to genuflect doesn’t make it right not to do it. If I cannot or for some reason do not have a chance to do it, it is ok. To willingly ignore Jesus is wrong.

One is an expression of truth another is an exception because of circumstances that impede that expression of truth. One is right the other is wrong if willfully continued.

That is why altar girls are wrong to be continued, it is not wrong to allow if circumstances require but wrong to do as it is not an expression of seeking the will of God, but rather the will of person above obedience.

In Christ
Scylla

 

[rider]

I’ve always chuckle when I hear women try to explain how boys and men think. Good luck. You just won’t be able to do it.----If we are ever to regain our pre-Vatican II numbers to the priesthood, we need to return the sanctuary to the priest and to male acolytes only! (I would also add, end the reign of the EMHCs.)

Totally agree!

 

[Melissa]

Prance, mince, it’s all the same to me. Bottom line for me, we should get rid of all the EMHC and go back to having the priest distribute Communion. So what if it takes a little longer? People can practice the virtue of patience while they are in line.

And you know what? If you use the altar rail, there’s really little discernable difference in the time involved.

My parish has three priests & three permanent deacons. Ordinarily, we have four of these six at the altar rail. One Sunday, all but one of the priests and one of the deacons were at some retreat (I forget what it was, but the point is, they weren’t in the city at all) … the deacon said something apologetically about it being just the two of them. But … even though the Mass attendance was roughly even w/ any other Sunday (I don’t take attendance, I just have a rough idea of how crowded it is), I’ll be switched if it took more than five minutes more than it did w/ the four at the rail.

Although I think the other thing that needs to happen re: more priests is for Catholic families to have more sons (and children in general … it seems weird to be told I have a big family).

 

[awindrose]

That is why altar girls are wrong to be continued, it is not wrong to allow if circumstances require but wrong to do as it is not an expression of seeking the will of God, but rather the will of person above obedience.

In Christ
Scylla

God’s will is that only men publicly serve him?

 

[scylla]

God’s will is that only men publicly serve him?

God’s will is that we look to see what He wants not what we want.

Altar Girls are an innovation that has come up from human desire, not from obedience.

There are plenty of women who serve God so that is not at all what I said. Mother Angelica is an excellent example of seeking God’s will. Have you ever seen her up on an altar serving?

Is the Mass the only public way to serve God? Or is it just because men serve in it, that some women want to push of an inclusion of women?

Mother Theresa did she ever serve at Mass? I am pretty sure she served God though.

Wanting to be up front is not seeking God’s will, wanting to serve at Mass to be equal is not seeking God’s will but putting human priorities above reflecting God’s truth.
As a reflection of God’s truth we have men serving at Mass as the Priest is an image of Jesus and the future priests are also. Which are what altar boys reflect, future priests.

To misrepresent that is to take human agenda and place it above what best reflects God’s design and will for worship. As the Mass is a divinely instituted mode of worship we should have utmost respect of it and look to see how it best expresses God’s truth, not our own desires.

In Christ
Scylla

 

[mikew262]

God’s will is that we look to see what He wants not what we want.

Altar Girls are an innovation that has come up from human desire, not from obedience.

There are plenty of women who serve God so that is not at all what I said. Mother Angelica is an excellent example of seeking God’s will. Have you ever seen her up on an altar serving?

In Christ
Scylla

How do you know Mother Theresa never helped a priest with mass?

Altar Girls are an innovation that has come up from human desire, not from obedience. So? Maybe girls desired to serve God by helping the priest at Mass. Maybe some girls have entered the convent after their experience as an altar girl.

My church has an equal amount of boys and girls serving at Mass with no problems.

This is so much-a-doo about nothing.

IMO, God is not concerned in the least that female children want to serve his Church as altar servers. In fact, he probably welcomes it.

 

[scylla]

How do you know Mother Theresa never helped a priest with mass?

Altar Girls are an innovation that has come up from human desire, not from obedience. So? Maybe girls desired to serve God by helping the priest at Mass. Maybe some girls have entered the convent after their experience as an altar girl.

My church has an equal amount of boys and girls serving at Mass with no problems.

This is so much-a-doo about nothing.

IMO, God is not concerned in the least that female children want to serve his Church as altar servers. In fact, he probably welcomes it.

So if my wife desires to go “consecrate” the bread one day, she should be allowed to? Just because it feels good doesn’t make it right. Just because you are happy doing something doesn’t justify it.

Maybe this would inspire my wife to want to be a nun if I died, does that make it right?

My Church probably has an equal number of boys and girls up on the altar also, does that make it right?
If my parish coordinator decides to make her own homily, (which she has by the way) does that make it right?

Our desires do not always reflect truth and putting them above obedience does not reflect what is true about Catholicism. Catholicism hugely depends on a submittal to God’s Will, our salvation depends on our submittal. If I want to do things of my terms then there is no place for me in heaven.
Jesus preached that we don’t look back at own desires but follow Him. Was Jesus being mean when He said let the dead bury the dead. Is it a bad thing to bury the dead, no , but following God demands we put Him first.

In Christ
Scylla

 

[netmilsmom]

How do you know Mother Theresa never helped a priest with mass? .

Well, all it takes if proof that she did to make the point.
Do you have a picture or report that says she did help a priest with Mass?

 

[mikew262]

So if my wife desires to go “consecrate” the bread one day, she should be allowed to? Just because it feels good doesn’t make it right. Just because you are happy doing something doesn’t justify it.

Maybe this would inspire my wife to want to be a nun if I died, does that make it right?

My Church probably has an equal number of boys and girls up on the altar also, does that make it right?
If my parish coordinator decides to make her own homily, (which she has by the way) does that make it right?

Our desires do not always reflect truth and putting them above obedience does not reflect what is true about Catholicism. Catholicism hugely depends on a submittal to God’s Will, our salvation depends on our submittal. If I want to do things of my terms then there is no place for me in heaven.
Jesus preached that we don’t look back at own desires but follow Him. Was Jesus being mean when He said let the dead bury the dead. Is it a bad thing to bury the dead, no , but following God demands we put Him first.

In Christ
Scylla

Err, having a woman consecrate the host and a 8 yr old girl being an altar server are on the opposite ends of the spectrum.

If the Church thought this was a improper practice, then it would ban it. It hasn’t. Trust your Church.

If you don’t want your girls being altar servers, of course, that is your call, but the reasons you give don’t make alot of sense to me.

You are worrying way too much over this.

 

[Prayerful]

I think that perhaps under the pontificate of Pope Benedict XVI we will see more of a focus on instituted acolytes and lectors and less on EMsHC, readers and altar servers.

I would personally like to see a rigorous training and formation program put together at the national (or international) level for males who wish to be instituted as acolytes and lectors.

 

[hilde_the_dog]

My sixth grade boys CCD class do not want to have alter girls as they do not want to be near them. I have five boys in my class that are alter boys and they are glad that our paster will not ask the bishop for permission to have alter girls (our diocese recently began to allow alter girls). Then again, at confession on Monday night for the kids in CCD, the boys told me that the reason the girls were taking so long is that girls sin more than boys. So I don’t always trust there theological instincts.

 

[mikew262]

Well, all it takes if proof that she did to make the point.
Do you have a picture or report that says she did help a priest with Mass?

No. Do you have proof that she didn’t help? My point is whether she did or didn’t is not a big deal. Again, much anguish over nothing.

 

[mikew262]

Then again, at confession on Monday night for the kids in CCD, the boys told me that the reason the girls were taking so long is that girls sin more than boys. So I don’t always trust there theological instincts.

Well, they could have a point there.

 

[awindrose]

This is so much-a-doo about nothing.

IMO, God is not concerned in the least that female children want to serve his Church as altar servers. In fact, he probably welcomes it.

I agree, this seems so much like straining the gnat and swallowing a camel.

 

[netmilsmom]

No. Do you have proof that she didn’t help? My point is whether she did or didn’t is not a big deal. Again, much anguish over nothing.

You can’t prove a negative.

 

[scylla]

Even the small things reflect truth, which is what Catholics have died for, for 2000 years.

Truth plus a little bit of error doesn’t equal truth.

The Church allows plenty of error to be practiced as people are constantly rebelling and trying to do their own thing. It takes it’s time to correct as it seeks obedience not a bending and pushing of rules to allow for more.

Unfortunately it has become the norm for people to try and do what they want instead of seek what best obeys God.

Just because I am allowed to sin then confess doesn’t make it ok to sin. The Church knows we sin but looks for us to seek God’s will.

Just because I can shoot the Pope and be forgiven by him doesn’t make it ok to do. I know this is extreme but many look at every practice of the Pope and statement and look for the ultimate freedom instead of seeking what is the best possible way to obey God.

Truth matters even on the smallest things.

In Christ
Scylla