When did 'Fr. Smith' become "Fr. Jimmy'

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But isn’t the problems you have listed came about because of a lack of proper catechesis? Something that can be addressed by a good relationship with our priest. Also, our good relationship with our priest can make them better priests. There are many things I do today much better because I am a father to my children. I would have never changed if I didn’t have children. Perhaps this is why priests are so lax today about their own theology and catechesis, because they don’t feel any kinship with their flock and feel that they are just there as ministers of Sacraments, not really shepherds.
Amen to that brother!

I was just thinking of starting another thread along these lines…perhaps tomorrow.

I agree with your asessment as well. Growing up, we invited our priests over for dinner frequently and we knew almost EVERYONE at that parish. And, they knew us, too. Not a small parish either but man, we were all in it together! I don’t see that now. I see commitees and ‘ministries’.
 
I agree, but “better relationship with our priests” first of all has nothing to do with names, and second of all doesn’t have anything to with Catechesis! The priests should be catechizing anyway.
I believe it does. It is surprising that the littlest things we do everyday does affect our psyche. By addressing priests by their family name, it means it is less personal and thus there is some detachment from them. I can relate this to my own cultural experience. We call the friends of our parents as Uncle X and Auntie Y, never as Mr./Mrs. LastName. It would be disrespectful in a sense that you do not acknowledge the closer personal relationship they have with your parents when you refer to them as if they were complete strangers to the family. Mr./Mrs. LastName is appropriate respect for people you or your family has no close personal relationship with, but not those who are close to you.
 
I always refer to my priest as “Father X”. I feel very uncomfortable addressing those older than me by their first name, no matter who they are! (With the exception of family and close friends, of course!) I always call my professors “Dr. X” as well. Some students use the professors’ first names, whether they ask specifically to do so or not. I can’t imagine doing that…

Maybe it’s a cultural thing, to address everybody by their first names?
 
I always refer to my priest as “Father X”. I feel very uncomfortable addressing those older than me by their first name, no matter who they are! (With the exception of family and close friends, of course!) I always call my professors “Dr. X” as well. Some students use the professors’ first names, whether they ask specifically to do so or not. I can’t imagine doing that…

Maybe it’s a cultural thing, to address everybody by their first names?
But shouldn’t your priest… your Father… be at least in the same category as family?
 
But isn’t the problems you have listed came about because of a lack of proper catechesis? Something that can be addressed by a good relationship with our priest. Also, our good relationship with our priest can make them better priests. There are many things I do today much better because I am a father to my children. I would have never changed if I didn’t have children. Perhaps this is why priests are so lax today about their own theology and catechesis, because they don’t feel any kinship with their flock and feel that they are just there as ministers of Sacraments, not really shepherds.
I think this is very insightful. We call them “Father” for a reason. It isn’t just a title of respect, it is supposed to be a relationship. Sadly, in large parishes, it is rarely the case that parishioners and priests are afforded such a relationship, but it remains the ideal.
 
When and where did this originate? The RC priests I know we’ve addressed by First Name. In the East the Baptismal name is so important (or ordination name if the deacon/priest/bishop takes up one) that you would never address someone by their family name. I’m wondering why there is a disconnect here between East and West. Can you or someone explain to me the origins of this extensive use of last name? I know Cardinals most famously are almost referred to exclusively by their last name.
That is true with Orthodoxy as well. The only reason I know Fr. Micheals last name is that he has written a few books.

But it’s always Fr. Micheal aND not Fr. Mike either.
 
I always refer to my priest as “Father X”. I feel very uncomfortable addressing those older than me by their first name, no matter who they are! (With the exception of family and close friends, of course!) I always call my professors “Dr. X” as well. Some students use the professors’ first names, whether they ask specifically to do so or not. I can’t imagine doing that…

Maybe it’s a cultural thing, to address everybody by their first names?
But that is the point, isn’t the priest supposed to be family? You call him Father!
 
In the Coptic Church, it is always Fr. First Name. A custom of the church is that monastics take the name of their monastery as their last name when they enter the monastic life. For instance, the man who would become HH Pope Shenouda III was previously Fr. Antonios El-Suryani, because he was a monk at the Syrian Monastery in the Egyptian desert for some years. So I think if we called our priests by their last names it would get very confusing, very quickly! 🙂
 
I always refer to my priest as “Father X”. I feel very uncomfortable addressing those older than me by their first name, no matter who they are! (With the exception of family and close friends, of course!) I always call my professors “Dr. X” as well. Some students use the professors’ first names, whether they ask specifically to do so or not. I can’t imagine doing that…

Maybe it’s a cultural thing, to address everybody by their first names?
Even as an older student (a grandmother) I felt uncomfortable calling college instructors by their first name even when they gave permission. Yes, we called the monks who taught at my first college by first name, but that was a different case. Activities such as community sports programs allow for a familiarity that includes using only the given name. At the college level, it becomes Coach X or Dr X. Military personal are addressed by their rank.
I think this is very insightful. We call them “Father” for a reason. It isn’t just a title of respect, it is supposed to be a relationship. Sadly, in large parishes, it is rarely the case that parishioners and priests are afforded such a relationship, but it remains the ideal.
I would never think about calling my parents by their first name. It was always Mom and Dad. My older siblings called them Ma and Pa. Jesus cried for his Daddy, Abba, from the cross. I saved the title “Father” for priests.
My mother-in-law insisted I call her mother. I never shared with her the same intimacy I had with my biological mother.
For the most part, my family was more formal than my husband’s. My siblings and I laughed at stories in which fathers told their children not to call them “sir.” When speaking to my parents, we did respond with “sir” and “ma’am.” It was simply a normal part of our speech. As the 4th commandment says, we were expected to honor them at all times. It was my mother who mentioned how the brother’s children always addressed her and my father as Grandma and Grandpa Last Name. My daughter differentiated her father’s parents from mine by calling them Grandmother and Granddad.
Now that I am a grandparent, my grandchildren call me Grandma Last Name. My husband, now deceased, had them calling him Grandpa First Name. Before calling me Grandma Last Name, my granddaughter called me Grandma with the long hair.

There are over 40,000 families in my overseas parish. Masses are celebrated 15 times in 8 different languages over the weekend. I find relationships with the priests to be as strong here as in any other parish to which I have belonged. Close relationships are developed within the different ministries. The stereotype of Japanese taking pictures of everything has nothing on the Filopinos.
 
All the priest I’ve met go by their last names, except for one. He lets everyone call him Fr. Chris or Fr. P, but it’s understandable with a last name like Phodajsky. (I don’t think I spelled that right, but…)
 
I believe it does. It is surprising that the littlest things we do everyday does affect our psyche. By addressing priests by their family name, it means it is less personal and thus there is some detachment from them. I can relate this to my own cultural experience. We call the friends of our parents as Uncle X and Auntie Y, never as Mr./Mrs. LastName. It would be disrespectful in a sense that you do not acknowledge the closer personal relationship they have with your parents when you refer to them as if they were complete strangers to the family. Mr./Mrs. LastName is appropriate respect for people you or your family has no close personal relationship with, but not those who are close to you.
But shouldn’t your priest… your Father… be at least in the same category as family?
I agree with you both, but as I said before, it’s a cultural thing. It is weird for us to call our priests by certain ways just as it is weird for you to call them by their last names. There’s really no discussion to have on that part of it… 😃
 
All the priest I’ve met go by their last names, except for one. He lets everyone call him Fr. Chris or Fr. P, but it’s understandable with a last name like Phodajsky. (I don’t think I spelled that right, but…)
I don’t even know Father Joy or Father Andrew’s last names.
 
When did ‘Fr. Smith’ become "Fr. Jimmy’
At approximately the same time he came out of the closet.

I know, that’s bad. But you know what I mean. You do.
 
The Priest at the church I used to go to is from India. His last name is extremely difficult to pronounce so everyone calls him Fr FirstName. The other Priest who retired about the time I was received into the church is also from India. He actually worked with Mother Teresa. We also called him Fr FirstName. For the others, it depends on how well I know the Priest and what everyone else calls him. I received a text from my Priest the other day and he signed it Fr FirstName.
In one church, everyone called one priest by his first name, because very few, if any, could prononce his Polish last name. Before my dad died, one of the younger Pries had red hair and my dad called him ‘Red’ and my mom would get mad at my dad for not having enough respist.
 
I think this happened about the same time that physicians started addressing their patients by their first names and high school teachers and college professors started addressing their student by their first names and neighbors started asking children to address them by their first names instead of as Mr. or Mrs. Lastname. Adults who wanted others, including children, to address them familiarly were “cool”. Somewhere along the line, using a last name to address others became a sign that you were not on friendly terms. Then it became some kind of a put-down to address others by their first names while expecting to be addressed by your last name, even for professional reasons. Now you can hardly find anyone who insists on being addressed by their last name outside of judges and bishops!

IOW, the priests changed with the times, whether for good or for ill.
 
We were taught that diocesan priests were to be addressed as Father Surname, and religious order priests as Father First Name. Of course, this instruction came from Sister St. Anthony, who has long since gone to her reward, and we didn’t dare question her. Until reading Br. JR’s posts I did not realize that Franciscans were to be addressed as Brother regardless of whether they were ordained. Monsignors and up were to be addressed as Msgr, Bishop, Archibishop Surname, right up to the Pope, who of course would be Pope FirstName, but always addressed as “Your Holiness,” or “Holy Father.”

I find it interesting in lay life how people address me: Physicians and my physical therapy patients always address me as “Odile,” even though I always address them as Dr. Surname or Mr/Ms Surname, regardless of their age, until told by them to do differently, and I’m pushing sixty. Only my ballet students call me Miss Odile, and nobody ever calls me Ms. Surname. Probably the fate of the nation does not depend on it, but it’s a little sad that the niceties of common courtesy are so forgotten nowadays.
 
odile53;10107838 said:
I find it interesting when patients meet me for the first time and call me by the first name on my sign. I haven’t used that name in over 30 years. I go by a nickname based on that name. I’ll walk in and say hello I’m Dr LastName and they reply nice to meet you wrong FirstName. I never correct them, but I do get wonder if they’d do that if I were a man.

I’m getting closer to pushing 60 as well. I’m amazed at the lack of respect that is shown to others.
 
At least in the East it is either your baptismal name or ordination name (which for Religious would be the name they take with their vows). But it is never the last name. I’m wondering when this change came about in the West. I can understand in today’s Western culture that referring to someone by their last name is seen as more formal and respectful. But as Christians, we should be keeping our own subculture, should we not? I’m fine if a non-Catholic calls a priest Rev. LastName. But the reason we call them “Father” denotes that there is that closeness with them. So why do we address them by their last name as if they are someone else outside our close circle?
Seeing that there is an amount of hard-of-hearing, or should that been hard-of-reading many be the change happened. . .
Well…Just now you noticed the whole culture has gone to the dumpster?
How is it show hard to understand that, especially in this matter, there was never and has never been a set standard. The pope has always been addressed by his chosen religious name. Priests and bishops have always been addressed either way with a majority of the religious and those in the East using their baptismal name or religious name.

How it is right to put forward what your standards of polite behavior over the wishes of the one being addressed not true your polite behavior into rudeness towards that persons beliefs and desires?

In essence how you wish to be addressed but I know better than you do so live with it.

That just strikes me as wrong.
 
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