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anthony022071
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They were ordained without the Spirit? Christ gave them the Spirit only after the Resurrection.However, they were ordained as Priest then.
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allhers
Guest
When He breathed on them and said "Receive the Holy Spirit in John20:22, that is when the Sacrament of Reconciliation/Confession was instituted, is that what you are thinking of?They were ordained without the Spirit? Christ gave them the Spirit only after the Resurrection.
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anthony022071
Guest
Yes. It’s also when the apostles became priests.When He breathed on them and said "Receive the Holy Spirit in John20:22, that is when the Sacrament of Reconciliation/Confession was instituted, is that what you are thinking of?
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timstaples
Guest
I am just excited that they DID become priests and they and their successors confect the Eucharistic meal for us to receive our Lord’s flesh and blood!
What a gift!
What a gift!
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allhers
Guest
I don’t have a lot of time today to discuss this with you but I did look this up for you. I don’t believe you understand our Sacraments and sanctifying grace/sacramental grace, etc…Yes. It’s also when the apostles became priests.
Please read these:
www.newadvent.org/cathen11279a.htm on Holy Orders, etc…please pay particular attention to the EFFECT OF THE SACRAMENT
Then these two, about God pouring His grace into us and overcoming confusion about grace’s infusion.
www.catholic.com/thisrock/1994/9412vrs.asp
www.catholic.com/thisrock/1993/9310vbv.asp
See, the power of order, (power of conferring grace) was committed by our Lord to His Apostles. They were to continue His work to be His earthly representatives. Perhaps you just need to read a little more, even a lot of Catholics that I know don’t know all this or even understand it all, I sure don’t understand it all. As one good Priest I know put it, “you have to be a student for life.” We all have to look up all of this ourselves and read it and understand it, otherwise, why would all these good people spend all of their time puttting it there for us. (thank God for them!!) I am a life long Catholic and learned much of this in 12 years of Catholic Schools but I still learn from sites such as this.
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guanophore
Guest
What do you imagine that they were preaching?It’s just an annoyance to me that people conflate the Sacrament of Holy Orders with the apostles becoming priests,when it is obvious that the apostles were not yet ordained with the Spirit,they were not yet believers in the Resurrection,the Resurrection had not happened yet,and so they did not have the Christian gospel to preach.
As I’ve said before,Catholics ought to get their chronology of events right and to be able to distinguish between one thing and another.
Mark 3:14-15
14 And he appointed twelve, to be with him, and to be sent out to preach 15 and have authority to cast out demons:
Luke 9:1-3
9:1 And he called the twelve together and gave them power and authority over all demons and to cure diseases, 2 and he sent them out to preach the kingdom of God and to heal.
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anthony022071
Guest
The same thing that John the Baptist was preaching – repentance and the coming of the Kingdom of God. They were not preaching the Cross and the Resurrection.What do you imagine that they were preaching?
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JanelleCB
Guest
You’re missing a very important point and lesson that Christ came to teach. Christ most commonly is referred to as teacher and his followers or apostles are his disciples and friends. He did not take on lofty tittles, but warned against the temptation of corruption and greed that comes with tittles and power.
We get a glimps of how the early christians delt with this issue when readding through the letters of Paul. To quote Catholic Theologan, Gary Wills; “Paul never uses the word for priest (hiereus), since no such office existed among the brothers.” (What Paul Meant. Apendix, p182.) Paul refers to himself and other early christian evangelists as emisaries with a mandate to take the Gospel to the nations, not priests.
We get a glimps of how the early christians delt with this issue when readding through the letters of Paul. To quote Catholic Theologan, Gary Wills; “Paul never uses the word for priest (hiereus), since no such office existed among the brothers.” (What Paul Meant. Apendix, p182.) Paul refers to himself and other early christian evangelists as emisaries with a mandate to take the Gospel to the nations, not priests.
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anthony022071
Guest
You’re missing a very important point and lesson that Christ came to teach. Christ most commonly is referred to as teacher and his followers or apostles are his disciples and friends. He did not take on lofty tittles, but warned against the temptation of corruption and greed that comes with tittles and power.
He took on the title Son of Man and he called himself the way,the truth and the life,and he said that he and the Father are one.
We get a glimps of how the early christians delt with this issue when readding through the letters of Paul. To quote Catholic Theologan, Gary Wills; “Paul never uses the word for priest (hiereus), since no such office existed among the brothers.” (What Paul Meant. Apendix, p182.) Paul refers to himself and other early christian evangelists as emisaries with a mandate to take the Gospel to the nations, not priests.
Gay Wills is not a real theologian and he doesn’t know what he’s talking about. The apostles did become priests on the day of resurrection. Christ gave them the Holy Spirit,the authority to forgive sins on his own authority,and told them to preach the gospel to all nations and baptize in the name of the Father,Son and Holy Spirit. And they also celebrated the Eucharist. Those are things that priests do. They were not just evangelists but priests and bishops.
catholic.com/library/Bishop_Priest_and_Deacon.asp
catholicapologetics.org/ap060800.htm
bringyou.to/apologetics/a31.htm
< However, aside from this common priesthood – a priesthood which ministers directly to the world, there is also a priesthood which ministers to the Church itself.
Romans 15:15-16 --“But I have written to you rather boldly in some respects to remind you, because of the grace given me by God to be a minister of Christ Jesus to the Gentiles in performing the PRIESTLY service of the Gospel of God, so that the offering up of the Gentiles may be acceptable, sanctified by the Holy Spirit.”
This is the ministerial priesthood of the Catholic (and Orthodox) Church – a priesthood which does not minister directly to the world, but which ministers to those within the Church itself, which builds up the Church and aids the “little ones” through a ministry of unity, leadership, teaching authority, and the Sacraments. A ministry which succeeds to that of the Apostles themselves.
Acts 14:23 --“They (Paul and Barnabas) appointed presbyters for them in each church and, with prayer and fasting, commended them to the Lord in Whom they put their faith.” >
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