When Do we stand?

[sma]

When EXACTLY does the congregation stand as Father says, “Pray, brethren that our sacrifice…” I have now been to churches where people stand as the priest washes his hands, when he begins to say his part as above, and after he has finished speaking and the reponse begins, “May the Lord accept the sacrifice…” I think folks are being taught different things.

 

[Dr.Colossus]

In my diocese, we are instructed to stand at the same time that we give the response “May the Lord accept the sacrifice…”. I think this is the proper way, according to the new propagation of the GIRM

 

[SteveG]

Dr. C has it right. This excerpt is from the bulletin for the USCCB - Bishop’s Committe for the Liturgy from Sept 2002 (when the rubric was changed)…

From the Preparation of the Gifts to the completion of Pray brethren SIT

From the beginning of the peoples’ response May the Lord… to the beginning of the Holy, Holy STAND

…For the full article see this link…
usccb.org/liturgy/innews/092002.htm
…which discusses the proper postures throughout the liturgy (among other things).

 

[deogratias]

We are also to stand for the reading of the Gospel and receiving communion at NOM.

 

[Trevelyan]

The GIRM say something to the effect of:
The people RISE and (THEN) say “May the Lord…”

 

[Bonnie]

We have been told to stand WHILE the priest is speaking, but the misselette has the word stand between his part & ours. Don’t know why they changed that - it wasn’t broke, why fix it?

 

[whiteyacht]

Bonnie:

We have been told to stand WHILE the priest is speaking

Yes, this is the new norm. It used to be that we waited until he was finished, but now we are to stand when he says, “Pray, brethren…” I think this is because you are supposed to stand whenever he says “oremus,” so it makes sense to stand at that point, instead of waiting until it is your turn to say, “May the Lord accept…” I think it was implemented just a few months ago, but that could vary by diocese.

My usual disclaimer: This is my understanding. I’m always open for corrections!

 

[tee_eff_em]

Trevelyan:

The GIRM say something to the effect of:
The people RISE and (THEN) say “May the Lord…”

Actually, the GIRM says

1. The faithful should stand … from the invitation, Orate, fraters (Pray, brethren), before the prayer over the offerings until the end of Mass, except at the places indicated below.

However the (US) Bishops’ Committee on Liturgy promulgated instructions to stand beginning with the response “May the Lord accept…” (see eg the September 2002 BCL Newsletter )

I have no idea why the difference. The GIRM seems quite clear, and I don’t think it is in the competence of the Bishops’ conferences to alter this (I welcome correction if I am mistaken). It is not, for instance listed among the USCCB Adaptations to the General Instruction of the Roman Missal

In my parish: We were instructed as the BCL, but people tend to jump the gun and wind up actually following the GIRM, so I don’t make it my business to “correct” them . In the next parish over, they haven’t implemented the change at all.

 

[SteveG]

Whether the GIRM is clear or not isn’t necessarily the point. It does seem to say in Paragraph 42 that we should stand while the priest says ‘Pray Brethren…’; however, in the very next paragraph it says…
*But **it is up to the Conference of Bishops to adapt the gestures and posture in the Order of the Mass *to the customs and reasonable traditions of the people according to the norm of law…

And that seems to be what the Bishops are doing in the BCL newsletter. Now that being said, it’s even more confusing when you read the next paragraph of the GIRM. It says…

For the sake of observing a uniformity in gestures and* posture during the same celebration,** the faithful should obey the directions which the deacon or a lay person or the priest** give during the celebration, according to whatever is indicated in the liturgical books. *

…So the confusion really seems to be whether we follow the clarification in the BCL Newsletter, OR for the sake of unity, we do whatever that particular parish is doing? I tend to agree with the previous post asking why they fixed this when it wasn’t broken. It seems to have actually made the situation far worse. For my part, I follow what’s in the BCL newsletter as being what the Bishop’s intended.

 

[tee_eff_em]

SteveG:

Whether the GIRM is clear or not isn’t necessarily the point. It does seem to say in Paragraph 42 that we should stand while the priest says ‘Pray Brethren…’; however, in the very next paragraph it says…
*But **it is up to the Conference of Bishops to adapt the gestures and posture in the Order of the Mass ***to the customs and reasonable traditions of the people according to the norm of law…

Where does it say that? I don’t see it in that section of the GIRM, perhaps you are looking elsewhere? (or maybe I am :whacky: ) And I thought the GIRM was specific about what is (and, by omission, isn’t) in the competence of the bishops’ conferences, but again, I may be mistaken and would welcome correction.

I agree that the most confusing instruction is the one that says “do what the leaders tell you” – Why have rubrics at all then?

I’m not sure it wasn’t broke before. It always seemed odd to me to sit during this dialogue, only standing after the people’s response. The only times it ever felt “right” were at very high Masses when the thurifer would incense the congregation (which necessitated us standing) prior to this dialogue.

 

[Hesychios]

Glory to Jesus Christ!

I don’t mean to make light of your concerns, but just to throw a comment in.

In my parish we stand throughout, 80 minutes straight through, sometimes longer!

Only the elderly and infirm will have seats.

We do a lot of bowing too! :bowdown2:

So whenever you get to sit, take advantage of it.