When is a Non-Catholic Marriage considered as Sacramental by Catholics?

  • Thread starter Thread starter AgnosTheist
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Im very serious. So whats the difference (aside from an additional 7 characters/letters: “and God”) ? What role does grace play? Any ideas?
The same role it plays elsewhere in life. By receiving any of the sacraments an individual receives grace. Grace is an outpouring of God’s love and a sign of God’s life in the person. A sacramental marriage receives that same kind of grace. You know there are going to be times when things get difficult. Wouldn’t you rather face them along with God?
 
thats a lot and it mostly deals with cleansing grace, or the grace that cleans and keeps from sin. i dont want to draw my own conclusions on this, can you just explain how grace plays a part in marriage?
Yes, that is the purpose of Sacraments, to give grace and keep us from sin. From the Catechism:
*
1123 “The purpose of the sacraments is to sanctify men, to build up the Body of Christ and, finally, to give worship to God. Because they are signs they also instruct. They not only presuppose faith, but by words and objects they also nourish, strengthen, and express it. That is why they are called ‘sacraments of faith.’”*

The Church has a lot to say about the Sacrament of Matrimony, but here is the summary in the Catechism.

This is one of the key passages dealing with the purpose of Sacramental Grace in Marriage:

1641 “By reason of their state in life and of their order, [Christian spouses] have their own special gifts in the People of God.”

This means that Marriage is a vocation in the Church-- it has a purpose, and that purpose is to serve God through family. The Catechism continues:
  • This grace proper to the sacrament of Matrimony is intended to perfect the couple’s love and to strengthen their indissoluble unity. By this grace they "help one another to attain holiness in their married life and in welcoming and educating their children.*
i’d like to know how a sacramental marriage is better off than a happily married non-catholic couple. thanks. 🙂
Temporally, there may not be a difference.

But, I suppose that depends upon your definition of “happily married”. It goes beyond just being ‘happy’… in the Church marriage isn’t just something you do because you like each other a lot… it’s something you do because you are called by God to form the basic unit of the Church – the domestic church. The family unit has a purpose– to witness to the Kingdom and to proclaim the Gospel and raise up future generations in holiness.

Spiritually, a couple in a Sacramental marriage is strengthened via the Sacrament toward the end of becmoing holy and working for the Kingdom through their particular vocation-- family.
 
A Non-Roman Catholic Marriage is absolutely never considered Sacramental under any circumstances, nor can it be approved of or condoned. There is one Christian Church, and that is the Roman Catholic Church. I am not sure that the Holy Bible could make this anymore clear. Let alone, there is no salvation outside of this Church. Any Marriage, whether between athiests, agnostics, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddists, or whatever, is by its very nature not Latin Catholic, and therefore is not valid, for it is not between the two mortals, and most importantly God.
 
A Non-Roman Catholic Marriage is absolutely never considered Sacramental under any circumstances, nor can it be approved of or condoned. There is one Christian Church, and that is the Roman Catholic Church. I am not sure that the Holy Bible could make this anymore clear. Let alone, there is no salvation outside of this Church. Any Marriage, whether between athiests, agnostics, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddists, or whatever, is by its very nature not Latin Catholic, and therefore is not valid, for it is not between the two mortals, and most importantly God.
You do not know what you are talking about.
 
A Non-Roman Catholic Marriage is absolutely never considered Sacramental under any circumstances, nor can it be approved of or condoned. There is one Christian Church, and that is the Roman Catholic Church. I am not sure that the Holy Bible could make this anymore clear. Let alone, there is no salvation outside of this Church. Any Marriage, whether between athiests, agnostics, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddists, or whatever, is by its very nature not Latin Catholic, and therefore is not valid, for it is not between the two mortals, and most importantly God.
That’s not correct.
 
I am absolutely open to discussion and to your opinion as everyone should be. Why then do you say I am incorrect in my rationing?
 
I am absolutely open to discussion and to your opinion as everyone should be. Why then do you say I am incorrect in my rationing?
newadvent.org/cathen/09707a.htm

As we have several times emphasized, not even marriage is a true sacrament, but only marriages and validly between Christians. One becomes and remains a Christian in the sense recognized here through valid baptism. Hence only one who has been validly baptized can contract a marriage which is a sacrament; but every one can contract it who has been validly baptized, whether he has remained true to the Christian faith, or become a heretic, or even an infidel. Such has always been the teaching and practice of the Church. Through baptism one “becomes a member of Christ and is incorporated in the body of the Church”, as declared in the Florentine Decree for the Armenians; so far as law is concerned, he remains irrevocably subject to the Church, and is therefore, in legal questions, always to be considered a Christian. Hence it is a general principle that all baptized persons are subject to universal ecclesiastical laws, especially marriage laws unless the Church makes an exception for individual cases or classes. **Hence not only the marriage between Catholics, but also that contracted by members of the different sects which have retained baptism baptize, is undoubtedly a sacrament. It matters not whether the non-Catholic considers marriage a sacrament or not, or whether he intends to effect a sacrament or not. Provided only he intends to contract a true marriage, and expresses the requisite consent, this intention and this expression are sufficient to constitute a sacrament. **But if he is absolutely determined not to effect a sacrament, then, of course, the production of a sacrament would be excluded, but the marriage contract also would be null and void. By Divine ordinance it is essential to Christian marriage that it should be a sacrament; it is not in the power of the contracting parties to eliminate anything from its nature, and a person who has the intention of doing this invalidates the whole ceremony. It is certain, therefore, that marriage contracted between baptized persons is a sacrament, even the so-called mixed marriage between a Catholic and a non-Catholic, provided the non-Catholic has been validly baptized.
 
I am absolutely open to discussion and to your opinion as everyone should be. Why then do you say I am incorrect in my rationing?
Everything in your post is against the teachings of the Church.

First, every natural marriage (that is, between people who are not baptized) is considered valid until proven not to be by a Marriage Tribunal in the Catholic Church.

Second, any marriage that is between two baptized persons who are equally yoked (that is, both not Catholic, or else both Catholic) is considered both valid and sacramental, until proven otherwise by a Marriage Tribunal in the Catholic Church.

A mixed marriage between a Catholic and a baptized non-Catholic has to be approved by the Bishop and must take place with a Catholic priest present as a witness - if this is done, then this marriage is both valid and Sacramental. A marriage between any baptized person and an unbaptized person, if it meets the conditions set out by the Church, will be considered valid, but not Sacramental.

In every case, it is assumed that a presently-existing marriage is valid. An investigation for a Decree of Nullity cannot be conducted unless there has already been a civil divorce.
 
Hello, I am new this forum and noticed this posting.
The marriage rules of the catholic church have always been a source of confusion to me. I have been married to a nonchristian man for almost 28 years now. He has always been supportive of my religion, he more that I am of his. He makes sure the kids go to church and usually goes with me every Sunday. From what I am reading, our marriage is not sacramental. However, we know many couples who have been married in the church, but the husband never goes to church. Many “sacramental” marriages are now in divorce and either the husband and wife are in another “sacramental” marriage. I feel God’s grace in my marriage and God’s blessing. Yet, according to the Catholic church, it is not "sacramental

That seems to be one of the ironic rules of my faith. ". I really can’t think of a question, but the marriage rules are confusing.
 
I feel God’s grace in my marriage and God’s blessing. Yet, according to the Catholic church, it is not “sacramental.”

That seems to be one of the ironic rules of my faith. ". I really can’t think of a question, but the marriage rules are confusing.
Validity and Sacramentality are not things that one “feels” - they either are, or are not.

I assume from the above that you were married outside of the Church, and that you are currently banned from the Sacraments as a result.

If this is the case, it would be easy enough for you to convalidate your marriage in the Church and make it both valid and Sacramental, assuming your husband is some form of Christian - the convalidation ceremony only takes ten minutes, and you only need the priest and two witnesses.

You should look into it, and then you would be allowed to go to Confession and receive Holy Communion again. 🙂
 
. I have been married to a nonchristian man for almost 28 years now.

From what I am reading, our marriage is not sacramental.
I am presuming you were married according to the laws of the Church.

If so, then your marriage is valid.

It is not a sacrament. This is so because as a non-Christian your husband is not baptized. An unbaptized person cannot receive any sacraments. A marriage between two baptized persons is a Sacrament by it’s very nature. It has nothing to do with how holy the people are, how well they live their vows, etc.

Your marriage is valid, but a natural marriage only. If your husband were to be baptized, your marriage would automatically become a Sacrament at that moment.
 
Validity and Sacramentality are not things that one “feels” - they either are, or are not.

I assume from the above that you were married outside of the Church, and that you are currently banned from the Sacraments as a result.
She did not state that.

She stated only that her husband is a non-Christian and their marriage isn’t a Sacrament. She did not indicate it was invalid or outside the Church.

Perhaps she will clarify.
 
I didn’t make that statement, but if her husband isn’t even a Christian, set-aside Baptized, then yes, their Marriage is surely not Sacramental.
 
newadvent.org/cathen/09707a.htm

As we have several times emphasized, not even marriage is a true sacrament, but only marriages and validly between Christians. One becomes and remains a Christian in the sense recognized here through valid baptism. Hence only one who has been validly baptized can contract a marriage which is a sacrament; but every one can contract it who has been validly baptized, whether he has remained true to the Christian faith, or become a heretic, or even an infidel. Such has always been the teaching and practice of the Church. Through baptism one “becomes a member of Christ and is incorporated in the body of the Church”, as declared in the Florentine Decree for the Armenians; so far as law is concerned, he remains irrevocably subject to the Church, and is therefore, in legal questions, always to be considered a Christian. Hence it is a general principle that all baptized persons are subject to universal ecclesiastical laws, especially marriage laws unless the Church makes an exception for individual cases or classes. **Hence not only the marriage between Catholics, but also that contracted by members of the different sects which have retained baptism baptize, is undoubtedly a sacrament. It matters not whether the non-Catholic considers marriage a sacrament or not, or whether he intends to effect a sacrament or not. Provided only he intends to contract a true marriage, and expresses the requisite consent, this intention and this expression are sufficient to constitute a sacrament. **But if he is absolutely determined not to effect a sacrament, then, of course, the production of a sacrament would be excluded, but the marriage contract also would be null and void. By Divine ordinance it is essential to Christian marriage that it should be a sacrament; it is not in the power of the contracting parties to eliminate anything from its nature, and a person who has the intention of doing this invalidates the whole ceremony. It is certain, therefore, that marriage contracted between baptized persons is a sacrament, even the so-called mixed marriage between a Catholic and a non-Catholic, provided the non-Catholic has been validly baptized.
Take this for instance; My Mother was of a Pennsylvania Italian family of the Roman Church that worked for the Italian Government in Rome and in Vatican City Libraries. They were a prominent family in the Community of the Latin Church, and she herself was a leader in the local Pro-Life Movement and member and writer for Legio Mariae. Regardless, she Wed at age 18, in the Universal Church to a man also of the Church Of Rome. However, her motivation for Marriage was not the natural one. She did not Marry for love and commitment and the indisolvable bond between her husband and God, but simply to escape from the home of her Mother who is my Grandmother. She didn’t love him at all. Was their Marriage Sacramental? No! Yes it was Roman Catholic, but was it assumed for the proper reasons? No. Following this, she birthed my half-brother our of a genuinely adulterous union, then left that man for my Father who was an atheist from an Anglican-Protestant family. They went to my Father’s homeland of England to Wed, and did so in an Anglican congregation, a Latin Catholic woman from a former sinful, immoral, unethical, adulterous, procreative union now joining in an additional catastrophical union with an atheist from a background of apostate “PROTEST”-antism. Did she do all of this out of deliberate rebellion contra her religion and God? No of course not! She didn’t see what she was doing as many if not most don’t. So from this sin-entrenched union I was birthed, I, the “fruit-of-sin” as we all are since the fall of humanity, but ancestral vice such as this worsens things. Anyway, what I am getting at is, yes, the Western Church is the True Church and it has set-out rules and regulations for one of It’s Seven Sacraments. Because our Church is the True Church does not mean that say our Pastors and Priests are immune to sin and wayward teaching, for it is not them, but the official Infallible Church that is immune to this. Our Pastors and Priests give us all kinds of erroneous dialogue to which we much caution ourselves. We must look to them for spiritual and moral guidance, but we know when they are committing apostacy of whatever they say goes against something the Church declares or has declared in It’s 2,000 year history. They too condone too much! Once there was “Annulment,” now in Conciliar terms there is “Divorce,” just as if Sacramental Marriage were any other raw legal thing. Ultimately, Marriage extra the Universal Church is not sincere.
 
Ultimately, Marriage extra the Universal Church is not sincere.
Your unfortunate mother’s experiences aside, not everyone is born Catholic, or knows anything about the Catholic Church. Are you going to condemn the marriages of 5.5 billion people on this earth just because they didn’t happen to be born Catholic, and bastardize every last one of their children? 🤷

Again, the teaching of the Church (you know - that thing that Jesus gave us, two thousand years ago, that cannot change according to human opinions?) is that all first marriages are valid until proven otherwise by a Catholic Marriage Tribunal - not only those between Catholics, or that take place in the Catholic Church (and in any case it would be absurd for two Buddhists or two Presbyterians to wed in the Catholic Church - they have no connection to it, and are not bound by its authority).
 
Jmcrae, Where do you get your information from? I am not band from the sacraments. I raised all my children in the church and I am currently a Eucharistic minister. I have been involved with my church for for my whole marriage.

Etruschi, your ideas seem very conservative. If we are considered the only true church, then why is the Catholic church moving toward more ecumental reconciliation between the different Christian churches? Why did the pope call Jewish people are elder cousins in the faith? You sound very harsh and unloving.

I have read the Bible from cover to cover and there is no mention of The Catholic church being the only true Christian church. What verse do you base your claim on?

I in general shy away from any real hardliners in any faith. The real fundamentalist Christians, the fundamentalist Muslims, the fundamentalists Orthodox Jews. They all feel their beliefs are the only way and everyone else is an infidel and going to hell. That is not the Jesus I know and love and serve and is a real presence in my life along with the Holy Spirit. Peace and love
 
The same role it plays elsewhere in life. By receiving any of the sacraments an individual receives grace. Grace is an outpouring of God’s love and a sign of God’s life in the person. A sacramental marriage receives that same kind of grace. You know there are going to be times when things get difficult. Wouldn’t you rather face them along with God?
My marriage is not considered sacramental, but God is very active in our relationship. He is iin our decisions and our prayers. I know many nonCatholic marriages where God is the center of their relationship. I know nonChristian marriages that are very strong and committed relationships, bu t in their religion, marriage is a life long commitment and that concept is honored.

However, I see many, so called “sacramental” marriages end in divorce. I think successful marriages require commitment, communication, and honoring God, no matter who or where you were married.

In my own case, my mother and father were married in the church. It was a terrible marriage that never should have happened. I didn’t see much of God growing up in that union. If they were married in the church, then where was the “Grace”.

It wasn’t there because there was no real love, respect, and communication. They didn’t bring God into the relationship. I think it is the couple’s decision to honor God and bring him into the marriage, not how or who married them.
 
Your unfortunate mother’s experiences aside, not everyone is born Catholic, or knows anything about the Catholic Church. Are you going to condemn the marriages of 5.5 billion people on this earth just because they didn’t happen to be born Catholic, and bastardize every last one of their children? 🤷

Again, the teaching of the Church (you know - that thing that Jesus gave us, two thousand years ago, that cannot change according to human opinions?) is that all first marriages are valid until proven otherwise by a Catholic Marriage Tribunal - not only those between Catholics, or that take place in the Catholic Church (and in any case it would be absurd for two Buddhists or two Presbyterians to wed in the Catholic Church - they have no connection to it, and are not bound by its authority).
I do not indend to profess, as you may be under the impression that I do, that all of these millions of persons born without the knowledge of the Faith or even hearing of it are damned bastards at the cost of their unfortunate birth origins. No. At the same time, I do strictly profess that the Latin Catholic Church is the One, True, Faith. These such persons that you and I speak of are not to be blamed to condemned as such, but God will deal with them totally in perfection by His Divine Will and Providence wither in life or death or both in accordance with your existence situation, for He loves them as His offspring, the children of the Blessed Virgin Mary, and siblings of Jesus Christ, all too fashioned in His Likeness and Image, and created with an immortal soul. He comprehends and understands their situation and will work what He knows is righteous and just. All the same, it is the duty of Western Catholics like myself to bring to them the Gospel and Evangelization, this a task that I myself and many members under the Roman Church quite blatantly fail to live-up to properly.
 
All the same, it is the duty of Western Catholics like myself to bring to them the Gospel and Evangelization, this a task that I myself and many members under the Roman Church quite blatantly fail to live-up to properly.
And when they convert, after we have properly evangelized them, the Church will not ask them to undergo Catholic wedding ceremonies, as though they had never been married before.

Their marriages are already considered valid, by the official teachings of the Church.
 
A non-Roman Catholic Marriage may very well fit the ideals of procreation and the unitive-function, fulfilling 100% and more what is a mandatory in the One, True, Roman Catholic, & Apostolic Church for the Sacrament Of Matrimony, although it is still not superior and cleansed in nature as a Marriage under the Roman Catholic Church would be.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top