When is the death penalty justified?

[vern_humphrey]

What has this got to do with anything? Our community shelter is not a prison, or a workhouse. No one is forced to go there.

I find it ironic that the man who is so hot on rehabilitating confirmed criminals will not open his house to the poor and homeless.

No more than I did with you - I just talk to them. They’re actually more like you than like me -

So how come I’m not camping on your living room couch?

hardheaded, opinionated, and extraordinarily passionate about the oddest little things.

So you consider the poor to be morally inferior to yourself, do you?

 

[jmcrae]

I find it ironic that the man who is so hot on rehabilitating confirmed criminals will not open his house to the poor and homeless.

Did I say I was going to do it all by myself? Or that anyone should attempt it all by themselves?

So how come I’m not camping on your living room couch?

Come any time you want. Help yourself to anything in the fridge.

So you consider the poor to be morally inferior to yourself, do you?

Did I make a value judgement? (No, I did not.)

 

[vern_humphrey]

Did I say I was going to do it all by myself? Or that anyone should attempt it all by themselves?

Of course not – the holier the person, the more they feel someone else should do all the work – and pay for it, too.

Come any time you want. Help yourself to anything in the fridge.

Can’t – door’s locked.

Did I make a value judgement? (No, I did not.)

Reposted without comment:

They’re actually more like you than like me - hardheaded, opinionated, and extraordinarily passionate about the oddest little things

 

[whatevergirl]

I will leave this thread with this thought…remember the Amish girls who were shot recently, and their parents were all forgiving? It is something we should all bear in mind, that as Catholics, especially, our mercy should shine through more than people from other faiths, if we practice what we preach. I was awe struck by that community’s compassion for a man who had killed their children.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[whatevergirl]

oh…one more thing…death is final as we all know. Suppose someone who is innocent is put on death row? It is not infrequent. And if it were infrequent, that one life that was wrongly convicted is snuffed out because of the death penalty. It’s not a black and white issue, in my opinion. Suppose one of our loved ones was wrongly convicted? And received the death penalty?

Just more food to throw at each other.

 

[LJN21]

I will leave this thread with this thought…remember the Amish girls who were shot recently, and their parents were all forgiving? It is something we should all bear in mind, that as Catholics, especially, our mercy should shine through more than people from other faiths, if we practice what we preach. I was awe struck by that community’s compassion for a man who had killed their children.

Just my 2 cents.

We are all called to forgive. Personally I have been appalled at the lack of forgiveness any many cases of death row inmates who pay their final dept. They possibly more than anyone else need our prayers. However the only person that can forgive the injustice due to murder is the one no longer living.

However the only person that can forgive the injustice due to murder is the one no longer living.

Forgiveness, Justice and mercy all have to be in balance or you don’t truly have any of them. God is love. God is mercy. God is justice. All three to perfection. He have civil governments the authority to protect there people. He gave priest the authority to forgive sins.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I will leave this thread with this thought…remember the Amish girls who were shot recently, and their parents were all forgiving? It is something we should all bear in mind, that as Catholics, especially, our mercy should shine through more than people from other faiths, if we practice what we preach. I was awe struck by that community’s compassion for a man who had killed their children.

Just my 2 cents.

Does that compassion extend to releasing him back into society, so he can kill more children whenever he chooses?

 

[vern_humphrey]

oh…one more thing…death is final as we all know. Suppose someone who is innocent is put on death row?

Suppose a murderer is released and kills again. Is not his vicrtim innocent?

It is not infrequent.

Give us the names of all the innocent people executed in this country since, say 1950 and state how you know they are innocent.

 

[LJN21]

oh…one more thing…death is final as we all know. Suppose someone who is innocent is put on death row? It is not infrequent. And if it were infrequent, that one life that was wrongly convicted is snuffed out because of the death penalty. It’s not a black and white issue, in my opinion. Suppose one of our loved ones was wrongly convicted? And received the death penalty?

Just more food to throw at each other.

The appeals court in this country have vindicated many people, its proof the system works. The real question is how many people have been executed and then found to be innocent? I’m not saying it hasn’t ever happened, but the percentage is extremely low. How many of those people were perfectly innocent of all crime and just in the wrong place at the wrong time? That number is astronomical low if not non-existent.

 

[whatevergirl]

Does that compassion extend to releasing him back into society, so he can kill more children whenever he chooses?

Why do you make that leap? He shouldn’t be let out into society…why is death your only answer ?

I think he committed suicide? I can’t recall that part of the case.

 

[whatevergirl]

The appeals court in this country have vindicated many people, its proof the system works. The real question is how many people have been executed and then found to be innocent? I’m not saying it hasn’t ever happened, but the percentage is extremely low. How many of those people were perfectly innocent of all crime and just in the wrong place at the wrong time? That number is astronomical low if not non-existent.

I guess I look at all this a bit differently. As much as I saw your earlier point, I don’t think that the death penalty is needed if people can remain in prison for life. The problem lies more within our judicial system…letting child rapists out after 5 years…then, for them to kill the next time. The sentences are more of the problem, in my eyes.

 

[LJN21]

Why do you make that leap? He shouldn’t be let out into society…why is death your only answer ?

I think he committed suicide? I can’t recall that part of the case.

That’s the other problem there is no such thing as “life in prison” in this country. Even if there was, are the other inmates lives not worth anything either?

This some actual case your talking about? Care to share which one it was?

 

[LJN21]

I guess I look at all this a bit differently. As much as I saw your earlier point, I don’t think that the death penalty is needed if people can remain in prison for life. The problem lies more within our judicial system…letting child rapists out after 5 years…then, for them to kill the next time. The sentences are more of the problem, in my eyes.

I’d agree with you there. The sentences for those sorts of crimes in some places are just ludicrous. I don’t think a violent child rapist should not ever set foot out side a prison.

I’m not sure what this has to do with capital punishment though.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Why do you make that leap? He shouldn’t be let out into society…why is death your only answer ?
.

Why do you make that leap? When did I say death was my only answer?

 

[jmcrae]

Why do you make that leap? When did I say death was my only answer?

You seem to be assuming that the only alternative to the death penalty is the American prison system as it exists right now.

That, because there are flaws in the current system, that therefore, we need to use the death penalty, rather than make any attempt to fix those flaws. (ie: make “life” to mean that he will not come out in anything other than a pine box, or restrict prisoners from being able to make contracts for murder against their guards.)

 

[LJN21]

You seem to be assuming that the only alternative to the death penalty is the American prison system as it exists right now.

That, because there are flaws in the current system, that therefore, we need to use the death penalty, rather than make any attempt to fix those flaws. (ie: make “life” to mean that he will not come out in anything other than a pine box, or restrict prisoners from being able to make contracts for murder against their guards.)

No one said we shouldn’t try and fix the problems.

As it stands right now… they exist, and its justifiable.

When/if they ever don’t exist you might have a point.

 

[vern_humphrey]

You seem to be assuming that the only alternative to the death penalty is the American prison system as it exists right now.

And you seem to be assuming that you have some sort of dispensation to speak for me.

That, because there are flaws in the current system, that therefore, we need to use the death penalty, rather than make any attempt to fix those flaws. (ie: make “life” to mean that he will not come out in anything other than a pine box, or restrict prisoners from being able to make contracts for murder against their guards.)

I once again invite you to apply to the US Bureau of Prisons and show them how to fix the system.

 

[jmcrae]

I once again invite you to apply to the US Bureau of Prisons and show them how to fix the system.

They already know how. Every country in the world has this information. Every school teacher and parent knows how to do this. All they have to do is do it.

There aren’t any big secrets in this - it’s not rocket science.

 

[Charlie_Zeaiter]

My experience with the penal system is on the training side. But that has opened my eyes to what really goes on in prison…

Hey, vern humphrey; We meet again…

I’m not suprised that a pro-gunner like yourself would be supportive of a death penalty. I mean, if you support the killing of a person prior to a trial, then why should the legal system be a hindrence to killing them after a trial?

I guess there is no point in having a death penalty debate with a pro-gunner. But I can’t resist; I like your posts. (I just hope you don’t have any scriptural verses where Jesus supports death penalties.)

 

[vern_humphrey]

They already know how. Every country in the world has this information. Every school teacher and parent knows how to do this. All they have to do is do it.

There aren’t any big secrets in this - it’s not rocket science.

Then it shouldn’t take you long to tell them all you know about it.