When travelling

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Monica4316

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If a person is living in a different diocese for two months: who is their Bishop during that time? For example, my family lives in one diocese, but I’m moving somewhere else to work for two months. Then, I might be coming back, but I’m not sure yet. Is my Bishop going to be the one in the current diocese, or the one where I’ll be living?

Thank you! 🙂
 
I’m moving somewhere else to work for two months. Then, I might be coming back, but I’m not sure yet. Is my Bishop going to be the one in the current diocese, or the one where I’ll be living?
Both, perhaps. If you’re living in another diocese for three months or more, you establish ‘quasi-domicile’. In that case, your ordinary in your domicile is the bishop there, and your ordinary while in your temporary residence (i.e., your quasi-domicile) is the bishop there.
 
Thanks! 🙂 so if I’m there for just two months, my Bishop is still the one in my home diocese?
 
If you leave after two months, not intending to return, then yes – you have not established quasi-domicile. If you leave after two months but intend to return (such that you’d end up being there for three months or more), then you could make the case that you have quasi-domicile there…
 
If a person is living in a different diocese for two months: who is their Bishop during that time? For example, my family lives in one diocese, but I’m moving somewhere else to work for two months. Then, I might be coming back, but I’m not sure yet. Is my Bishop going to be the one in the current diocese, or the one where I’ll be living?

Thank you! 🙂
being a seminarian I live outside of my diocese more then I do inside my diocese. While I’m in another diocese the bishop of the diocese I’m in has alot of influence of my life. Because I represent a certain diocese my bishop of my home diocese will always be my bishop. If someone doesn’t represent the diocese in anyway then what ever place he lives in the local bishop is their bishop. The bishop really doesn’t have a big impact on your life if you don’t work for the diocese. But the bishop of the diocese will make all the big decision. and your home bishop won’t have any influence on your life.

So really I would say that the only time a your bishop doesn’t change is when you officially represent the diocese in anyway. As a employee, seminarian, or priest.

One last thing being in the seminary we have a handful of priests who have been allowed to live outside of their diocese for work in the seminary. What ever diocese he works in the bishop of that diocese will be in control of him, but he would still have obedient to the bishop of his own diocese and if he called him back to the diocese he would have to listen.

(these are just guesses but educated guesses)
 
For reference:

Can. 100 A person is said to be: a resident (incola) in the place where the person has a domicile; a temporary resident (advena) in the place where the person has a quasi-domicile; a traveler (peregrinus) if the person is outside the place of a domicile or quasi-domicile which is still retained; a transient (vagus) if the person does not have a domicile or quasi- domicile anywhere.

Can. 101 §1. The place of origin of a child, even of a neophyte, is that in which the parents had a domicile or, lacking that, a quasi-domicile when the child was born or, if the parents did not have the same domicile or quasi-domicile, that of the mother.

§2. In the case of a child of transients, the place of origin is the actual place of birth; in the case of an abandoned child, it is the place where the child was found.

Can. 102 §1. Domicile is acquired by that residence within the territory of a certain parish or at least of a diocese, which either is joined with the intention of remaining there permanently unless called away or has been protracted for five complete years.

§2. Quasi-domicile is acquired by residence within the territory of a certain parish or at least of a diocese, which either is joined with the intention of remaining there for at least three months unless called away or has in fact been protracted for three months.

§3. A domicile or quasi-domicile within the territory of a parish is called parochial; within the territory of a diocese, even though not within a parish, diocesan.

Can. 103 Members of religious institutes and societies of apostolic life acquire a domicile in the place where the house to which they are attached is located; they acquire a quasi-domicile in the house where they are residing, according to the norm of ⇒ can. 102, §2.

Can. 106 Domicile and quasi-domicile are lost by departure from a place with the intention of not returning, without prejudice to the prescript of ⇒ can. 105.

Can. 107 §1. Through both domicile and quasi-domicile, each person acquires his or her pastor and ordinary.

§2. The proper pastor or ordinary of a transient is the pastor or local ordinary where the transient is actually residing.

§3. The proper pastor of one who has only a diocesan domicile or quasi-domicile is the pastor of the place where the person is actually residing.
 
For reference:

Can. 100 A person is said to be: a resident (incola) in the place where the person has a domicile; a temporary resident (advena) in the place where the person has a quasi-domicile; a traveler (peregrinus) if the person is outside the place of a domicile or quasi-domicile which is still retained; a transient (vagus) if the person does not have a domicile or quasi- domicile anywhere.

Can. 101 §1. The place of origin of a child, even of a neophyte, is that in which the parents had a domicile or, lacking that, a quasi-domicile when the child was born or, if the parents did not have the same domicile or quasi-domicile, that of the mother.

§2. In the case of a child of transients, the place of origin is the actual place of birth; in the case of an abandoned child, it is the place where the child was found.

Can. 102 §1. Domicile is acquired by that residence within the territory of a certain parish or at least of a diocese, which either is joined with the intention of remaining there permanently unless called away or has been protracted for five complete years.

§2. Quasi-domicile is acquired by residence within the territory of a certain parish or at least of a diocese, which either is joined with the intention of remaining there for at least three months unless called away or has in fact been protracted for three months.

§3. A domicile or quasi-domicile within the territory of a parish is called parochial; within the territory of a diocese, even though not within a parish, diocesan.

Can. 103 Members of religious institutes and societies of apostolic life acquire a domicile in the place where the house to which they are attached is located; they acquire a quasi-domicile in the house where they are residing, according to the norm of ⇒ can. 102, §2.

Can. 106 Domicile and quasi-domicile are lost by departure from a place with the intention of not returning, without prejudice to the prescript of ⇒ can. 105.

Can. 107 §1. Through both domicile and quasi-domicile, each person acquires his or her pastor and ordinary.

§2. The proper pastor or ordinary of a transient is the pastor or local ordinary where the transient is actually residing.

§3. The proper pastor of one who has only a diocesan domicile or quasi-domicile is the pastor of the place where the person is actually residing.
this seems to answer the question while the language is a little confusing for me
 
this seems to answer the question while the language is a little confusing for me
You’ll get used to it…

Here’s the thing: The OP asked “who is my bishop?”

Answer: Read canon 107. Through both (key word for the OP is “both”) domicile and quasi-domicile, each person acquires his own ordinary (“bishop”* for the sake of other readers here)

So what does that mean? What do those terms mean?
Go back to canons 100 & 102.

Domicile means “a permanent residence” or at least as permanent as it gets–living in a place with the intention of making that place one’s home.

Quasi domicile means living in a place for at least 3 months (or having that intention) while at the same time, not-intending to make that place one’s home.

It actually helps to “think” using the words of the translator from canon 100. The words “resident,” “temporary resident” and “traveler” are more natural for English speakers.

In the OP’s question, the key words were that she would be living there “for 2 months” (2, not 3) and “I might be coming back, but I’m not sure.” So clearly she doesn’t intend to be there for 3 months or more. So we eliminate the possibility of quasi-domicile. If circumstances change and she does indeed live there for 3 months, then she will have a quasi-domicile–but that doesn’t apply yet.

Since she has neither a domicile nor a quasi-domicile in that place, she does not “acquire an ordinary”–meaning (again, for all readers here) that the bishop of that “other” place is not “her bishop.” At the same time, she is a “traveler” in that other diocese, so there are times when that other bishop may have certain jurisdiction (for example, as a traveller in his diocese, he can dispense her from the Sunday obligation).

Because she might be returning to her original home (her domicile at the present), she still has connections there, and she retains her domicile. In other words, she likewise doesn’t fit into the category of “vagus” (transient, or more literally vagrant, or even homeless).

Your own situation is actually a very typical example of quasi-domicile. College students living at school have a quasi-domicile (that’s what makes it so typical); because they live there for at least 3 months, but that’s not actually their permanent home (at least that’s the typical arrangement). College students have 2 pastors; the pastor of the place where they permanently live and the pastor of the place where they are living at the moment. They likewise have 2 “bishops” (okay, “ordinaries”).
This becomes very important if they decide to get married while at school. What is their proper parish and pastor? Both.
Likewise, for you. You have 2 bishops–the bishop of your home diocese and the bishop of the diocese in which you now live (albeit temporarily). Your own obligations, with respect to your formation, toward your home bishop are, of course, different from those toward the bishop of the place where you’re living; but still, under canon law, both bishops are your own proper Ordinaries.

You actually retain your “own” bishop not because of your attachment to the diocese as a seminarian, but because your home diocese is your true home–you have every intention of returning there and resuming your life there (I only say this because you’ve said as much yourself). This would still apply if you were not a seminarian or not a diocese employee. Ones ordinary depends on where he actually lives (permanent or temporary) but does not depend at all on ones employment status.
  • Let’s just leave it as “bishop” for the moment instead of getting distracted by the distinctions between “bishop” and “ordinary.” Different topic.
 
Let’s just leave it as “bishop” for the moment instead of getting distracted by the distinctions between “bishop” and “ordinary.” Different topic.
LOL…! Yes – if you thought that ‘domicile’ and ‘quasi-domicile’ made your head spin, you’re in for a whole bucket of headache trying to get ‘bishop’ and ‘ordinary’ straight! 😉
 
Thanks for the replies! 🙂

I’m back to this thread because I have more information on my situation… I lived in this diocese for the two months now, and now I’m moving back to my family home for July and August. However, now I think I’ll be going back to this current diocese again in September to work, also my family might be moving here too in the future. I think I’ll be moving here permanently. So… :confused: that just makes it more confusing for me, does anyone have any thoughts? Fr David? 🙂 when I’m back with my family in the summer, I’m not sure if it’s still my domicile or quasi-domicile.

thank you!
 
Thanks for the replies! 🙂

I’m back to this thread because I have more information on my situation… I lived in this diocese for the two months now, and now I’m moving back to my family home for July and August. However, now I think I’ll be going back to this current diocese again in September to work, also my family might be moving here too in the future. I think I’ll be moving here permanently. So… :confused: that just makes it more confusing for me, does anyone have any thoughts? Fr David? 🙂 when I’m back with my family in the summer, I’m not sure if it’s still my domicile or quasi-domicile.

thank you!
It doesn’t matter what you or your family might do in the future. It depends on where you/they are now.

You have a domicile in your family’s place of residence and a quasi-domicile where you have been for 2 months.

When you move back home, that will be your domicile until and unless you move somehwere else.
 
Thanks for the replies! 🙂

I’m back to this thread because I have more information on my situation… I lived in this diocese for the two months now, and now I’m moving back to my family home for July and August. However, now I think I’ll be going back to this current diocese again in September to work, also my family might be moving here too in the future. I think I’ll be moving here permanently. So… :confused: that just makes it more confusing for me, does anyone have any thoughts? Fr David? 🙂 when I’m back with my family in the summer, I’m not sure if it’s still my domicile or quasi-domicile.

thank you!
It seems to me that your “permanent” home is your current family home. If that’s indeed the case, then that’s where you have a domicile. At the present time, you’re still a traveler in your “new” diocese; and you still have a domicile in your original, permanent diocese.

You cannot actually answer the question of what will happen in September because at this point it’s still an unknown. If you had said something like “I just bought a house with a 20 year mortgage and I intend to live there beginning in September…” then things would be different. However, since you yourself don’t know what your status will be at that time, then no one can answer the question of whether you will have a [quasi]domicile there.

If you indeed “move there permanently” then you’ll have a domicile there.
If you do not, then you won’t.

We can help you understand the canons, but we cannot predict the future:)
 
Thank you! 🙂

If I do move there, then would I need to wait another month (so it’s 3 months in total) in order to have a quasi-domicile? or is it just automatically quasi-domicile because of the intention?
 
Where are you a registered parishioner? If you are still registered under your parents, my guess is your “home” bishop is your bishop.
 
Where are you a registered parishioner? If you are still registered under your parents, my guess is your “home” bishop is your bishop.
It’s not about guessing.

It’s about how canon law answers the question “who is ones proper ordinary?”

Registration is irrelevant in canon law; only residence (domicile) matters.
 
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