When was the decision on ABC finalized?

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Bookcat said:
No.

It was more a question of if the Pill was contraception or not (it was new on the scene)

It is.
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It certainly is and worse than that its not even healthy to use. I know many ladies that have had serious health problems because of it. My sis had a stroke at age 42, a friend had a heart attack 6 months after going on the pill at age 21.(Did you ever read the warnings??? I could name more but I bet you all have had it happen to people you know too. God Bless, Memaw
 
Linusthe2nd said:
Some teachings of the Church are considered infallible, not because the Church says so, but because Revelation teaches it or because they are contained, in a manifest way, in the natural law. Such would be the case in the examples you cite. And that this is the case has been made clear by the repeated teaching of the Popes.

**The Church cannot change what Christ has laid down or what the natural law dictates.
**
Linus2nd
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The celibacy is against what the natural law dictates.
Still it can be justified.
 
Jaaanosik said:
The celibacy is against what the natural law dictates.
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This isn’t true. Human beings have always embraced sacrifice as a natural call to die to self for the life of a ‘higher good’. A creatures capable of desiring a relationship with the Creator of the world, will perennially sacrifice something as a natural manifestation of the desire. Celibacy is a natural form of sacrifice for the ‘higher good’.
 
LongingSoul said:
This isn’t true. Human beings have always embraced sacrifice as a natural call to die to self for the life of a ‘higher good’. A creatures capable of desiring a relationship with the Creator of the world, will perennially sacrifice something as a natural manifestation of the desire. Celibacy is a natural form of sacrifice for the ‘higher good’.
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You said it very nicely, but no. The procreation is more fundamental natural goodness.
The sacrifice for the ‘higher good’ is a very rare exception. It does not come to people as natural as the procreation. It is easier to procreate than to sacrifice.
 
Jaaanosik said:
You said it very nicely, but no. The procreation is more fundamental natural goodness.
The sacrifice for the ‘higher good’ is a very rare exception. It does not come to people as natural as the procreation. It is easier to procreate than to sacrifice.
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The Church teaches that sacrifice in service to the higher good is part of natural law. That is what abstinence, fast, chastity and celibacy represent. Thomas Aquinas ST II II 85 1…

At all times and among all nations there has always been the offering of sacrifices. Now that which is observed by all is seemingly natural. Therefore the offering of sacrifices is of the natural law.

Natural reason tells man that he is subject to a higher being, on account of the defects which he perceives in himself, and in which he needs help and direction from someone above him: and whatever this superior being may be, it is known to all under the name of God. Now just as in natural things the lower are naturally subject to the higher, so too it is a dictate of natural reason in accordance with man’s natural inclination that he should tender submission and honor, according to his mode, to that which is above man. Now the mode befitting to man is that he should employ sensible signs in order to signify anything, because he derives his knowledge from sensibles. Hence it is a dictate of natural reason that man should use certain sensibles, by offering them to God in sign of the subjection and honor due to Him, like those who make certain offerings to their lord in recognition of his authority. Now this is what we mean by a sacrifice, and consequently the offering of sacrifice is of the natural law.​

newadvent.org/summa/3085.htm
 
Jaaanosik said:
You said it very nicely, but no. The procreation is more fundamental natural goodness.
The sacrifice for the ‘higher good’ is a very rare exception. It does not come to people as natural as the procreation. It is easier to procreate than to sacrifice.
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Maybe so, but that’s why it’s call sacrifice. God Bless, Memaw
 
Jaaanosik said:
The celibacy is against what the natural law dictates.
Still it can be justified.
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Natural law is not to be confused with the biological dictates of human “instinct” twisted by concupiscence. It is not “those things humans do and feel right about doing.” Even if it were, it is hard to know if humans raised in contemporary society could even recognize which of their inclinations were natural and which were the artificial imprint of sin and temptation on the heart.

*CCC 1955 The “divine and natural” law(6) shows man the way to follow so as to practice the good and attain his end. The natural law states the first and essential precepts which govern the moral life. It hinges upon the desire for God and submission to him, who is the source and judge of all that is good, as well as upon the sense that the other is one’s equal. Its principal precepts are expressed in the Decalogue. This law is called “natural,” not in reference to the nature of irrational beings, but because reason which decrees it properly belongs to human nature:

Where then are these rules written, if not in the book of that light we call the truth? In it is written every just law; from it the law passes into the heart of the man who does justice, not that it migrates into it, but that it places its imprint on it, like a seal on a ring that passes onto wax, without leaving the ring.(7) The natural law is nothing other than the light of understanding placed in us by God; through it we know what we must do and what we must avoid. God has given this light or law at the creation.(8)*
 
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