I don’t think anyone said it was harmless. But they are legitimately practiced beliefs systems, just as Christianity or Judaism are. They are simply different, just like Shinto or Jainism would be to most Westerners.churchpop.com/2016/08/05/exclusive-church-desecration-was-demonic-retaliation-priest-suspects/
So practicing Wicca is harmless eh? Prayers for the priest, his parishioners and their well beings.
I totally agree. I don’t understand why people are uncomfortable with this faith tradition and its practitioners as opposed to others around the world. Have people ever been to the Parliament of World’s Religions? Pagans are quite active.I don’t think anyone said it was harmless. But they are legitimately practiced beliefs systems, just as Christianity or Judaism are. They are simply different, just like Shinto or Jainism would be to most Westerners.
No, not correct. Christian prayer is different from “spell” in other religious traditions just as mattp0625 pointed out. It is wrong to generalize Christian prayer as a “petition spell”. Christians don’t pray just to have a petition with God, they pray to thank, to praise God and what is emphasized in Christian prayer - to repent for one’s sins and to recognize the humility of one’s sinful self. Furthermore, in Christianity, you cannot appeal or change God’s mind but you pray based on His will and what He desires.Yes, that’s correct in many ways - think of ‘spell’ as ‘prayer’ - when one prays for something, essentially it’s the same thing as a petition spell. Pray for healing, same as healing spell, etc.
The use of incense in Eastern Orthodox and Catholic liturgies is symbolic and as a reminder not that it has any real effect. And there is no such thing as “talking to a guardian angel” in Christianity, it does not exist.The methodology may be a little different, but the basic premise is the same.
“Burning white sage” is no different than burning incense (actually incense is used as well), talking to a spirit guide is no different than talking to a ‘guardian angel’ - there are plenty of parallels.
Though the understanding of the symbol and representation of the candles and their role in the ceremony might be different.Candles are used in churches just as they are used in many pagan celebrations.
The use of the Chrism again in Catholic and Eastern Orthodox celebration of Sacraments is of a symbolic nature and as a visible sign of the transmission of the gifts and Holy Spirit. It is understood that it is not the chrism that transmits grace and the gifts of the Holy Spirit but only a sign and symbol of the actual transmission.A sacred oil is not much different than a “potion”. The list goes on.
No, not. There are a multitude of differences and each religious tradition is different from one another. Hence, we study religions so we will not be ignorant.When you get right down to it, there’s not a lot of difference - same intents, slightly different way of effecting them.
It’s probably a remnant of the Satanic ritual abuse moral panic in the 1980s. A lot of Catholics and Protestant confuse Wicca with Satanism, either by ignorance or by intentional belief even though Wicca is very different to Satanism. It does not help that some of the images and practices in Wicca are similar to the common conception of Satanism in popular culture, such as the Wiccan pentagram being mistakenly identified with the Satanic inverted pentagram.I totally agree. I don’t understand why people are uncomfortable with this faith tradition and its practitioners as opposed to others around the world. Have people ever been to the Parliament of World’s Religions? Pagans are quite active.
parliamentofreligions.org/content/pagan-response-parliament
Consider the possibility that the source of its “power” (for lack of a better word) is the same, but it is wrapped up in a different name and disguised with different bells and whistles.It’s probably a remnant of the Satanic ritual abuse moral panic in the 1980s. A lot of Catholics and Protestant confuse Wicca with Satanism, either by ignorance or by intentional belief even though Wicca is very different to Satanism. It does not help that some of the images and practices in Wicca are similar to the common conception of Satanism in popular culture, such as the Wiccan pentagram being mistakenly identified with the Satanic inverted pentagram.
Correct - pagans pray to thank and praise as well. The concept of ‘sin’ is different. Neither does one appeal or change the mind of a non-Christian deity; ones prays based on the will of the god(s).No, not correct. Christian prayer is different from “spell” in other religious traditions just as mattp0625 pointed out. It is wrong to generalize Christian prayer as a “petition spell”. Christians don’t pray just to have a petition with God, they pray to thank, to praise God and what is emphasized in Christian prayer - to repent for one’s sins and to recognize the humility of one’s sinful self. Furthermore, in Christianity, you cannot appeal or change God’s mind but you pray based on His will and what He desires.
The use of incense in Eastern Orthodox and Catholic liturgies is symbolic and as a reminder not that it has any real effect. And there is no such thing as “talking to a guardian angel” in Christianity, it does not exist.
Though the understanding of the symbol and representation of the candles and their role in the ceremony might be different.
The use of the Chrism again in Catholic and Eastern Orthodox celebration of Sacraments is of a symbolic nature and as a visible sign of the transmission of the gifts and Holy Spirit. It is understood that it is not the chrism that transmits grace and the gifts of the Holy Spirit but only a sign and symbol of the actual transmission.
No, not. There are a multitude of differences and each religious tradition is different from one another. Hence, we study religions so we will not be ignorant.
These kind of discussion is not really helpful in academic or scholarly contexts. Personally, I believe the same and I disagree personally with the beliefs of the Wicca but the OP is trying to discuss things from a sociological, academic viewpoint not in a confessional, theological one.Consider the possibility that the source of its “power” (for lack of a better word) is the same, but it is wrapped up in a different name and disguised with different bells and whistles.
Sacramentals, such as blessed candles or holy water, do carry the blessings of the church, but this is far removed from a potion or spell in both form and substance. Jesus gave the church it’s authority to grant blessings, administer sacraments, etc.
The enemy can take the form of an angel or human spirit in order to deceive. It is a similar concept here.
I agree with this that several things in religions might be similar to the uninformed but they are only superficial similarities and only appear on the surface. With study all religions are different and contradict each other.But to non-Catholics many of our sacramentals, sacraments, and rites/uses might just appear so similar to an ‘outsider.’ I think that’s what I personally was trying to say.
And after all, there are only so many material things in the world that humans can use to engage in any ritual or prayer or what have you, regardless of religion. So there is bound to be overlap. The Rituale Romanum in Latin with etchings looks just as exotic and mysterious to an outsider as a witches grimoire might.
Example:
Buddhist rosaires and chotkis
Celtic crosses and stone piles in Ireland and stone heaps in Tibet
Confucian ancestor ritual in Korea and the Tridentine Mass
A Bible in Arabic and a Quran
Kissing icons and kissing statues of Krishna
I am not saying these things are the same. I am saying to outsiders, our things may appear similar to other faiths, even witch or pagan practices.
“Wicca, as you practice the religion today, is a new religion, barely fifty years old. The techniques you use at present are not entirely what your elders practiced even thirty years ago. Of course, threads of ‘what was’ weave through the tapestry of ‘what is now.’ …in no way can we replicate to perfection the precise circumstances of environment, society, culture, religion and magick a hundred years ago, or a thousand. Why would we want to ? The idea is to go forward with the knowledge of the past, tempered by the tools of our own age.”
Simply not. The incense is symbolic in Catholic and Orthodox liturgy as a representation of the prayers being put forward to God. It is understood that the incense does not affect the transmission of the prayer.I don’t believe it is symbolic - it’s original intent was to carry the prayers to God as the smoke rises. Talking was a bad choice of words - many people, I don’t want to use the word pray, as that’s not correct, but ‘ask’, perhaps, their or their child’s guardian angel to watch over them, etc. Not done in all Christian traditions, but done in some.
Partly correct. Catholic liturgy is rich in candles and has diverse symbolism - used in votive candles, Paschal, liturgical, et cetera.Yes - that’s true - candles may play different roles in different traditions, however, I might argue that the underlying symbology here is to represent ‘eternal light’ / presence of the deity.
No, not, the will of God does not work through the chrism. Rather, the chrism is a visible sign and representation of the will of God, the infusion of grace and the Holy Spirit’s gifts.For many pagans, this is the same intention oils serve; they are symbolic. The symbolism may be different, but they are used in the same way (the will of the deity works through the symbol of the oil).
I will contend your opinion that basic elements of religions are similar - yes, I agree with you that there might be a lot of superficial similarities in the material aspect of our religious traditions, but if we analyze closely, virtually all religions contradict especially in their theology and doctrine.What I mean is that the basic elements of religions are essentially very similar; there’s really not that much difference - same “tools” are used, if you will, the same intents, sometimes the “tools” are are used the same way, sometimes slightly different. Sometimes the way of effecting the intent of the prayer (be it petition, thanks, praise, etc.) is slightly different as well, but the intent is the same. Christians do not pray any differently than anyone else with respect to intent - methodology may differ from belief to belief.